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Expanded archive listing

"Top Science Fiction" -- adding author intros

Hi. I have a copy of this to hand Top Science Fiction: The Authors' Choice and I note that the ISFDB entry does not list the authors' intros. It seems like it ought to, although they're just a few paragraphs before the story starts. Could-should I add them? Frink (talk) 19:05, 3 October 2023 (EDT)

Yes, that would be great! I assume they are by Josh Pachter? ···日本穣 · 投稿 · Talk to Nihonjoe 14:36, 4 October 2023 (EDT)

They're actually by the authors and aren't separated explicitly from the stories, which is why I was unsure about this. I'll go ahead and do it, and if it's undesirable it's easily reverted. Frink (talk) 21:26, 4 October 2023 (EDT)

Yes, just enter them as essays by the authors then. If they don't have explicit titles, give them the name of the story with "(introduction)" at the end. ···日本穣 · 投稿 · Talk to Nihonjoe 13:46, 5 October 2023 (EDT)

Done. Thank you for the help! Frink (talk) 09:48, 7 October 2023 (EDT)

Messy situation with a translated essay and author credit

I'm in the process of adding a Chinese fanzine that is mostly translated articles, and I've encountered a case that I'm not sure I've handled optimally, but I'm not sure what the correct way to go is.

This essay is credited to "洛朗蒂乌·尼斯托雷斯库 等", where the body of it is a Sinocization of Laurențiu Nistorescu with the trailing "等" indicating "et al". As such, I've credited the essay to 洛朗蒂乌·尼斯托雷斯库, added a note for the "et al", and made that author an alternate for Laurențiu Nistorescu.

The problem comes in because the original online publication doesn't clearly indicate the author(s). A footnote states "This article was a co-operative venture. Much is owed to Laurentiu Nistorescu (SF writer and journalist), Antuza Genescu and Dorin Davideanu (editor of the H. G. Wells Society zine Paradox).", but that feels like some unnamed editor assembled an English-language essay from articles by those authors, quite possibly in Romanian. As such I've added that English essay as by "uncredited", with the footnote copypasted into the note.

The problem comes in that the essay doesn't show up on the Nistorescu author page (which is understandable), nor the alternate Chinese author page. The latter seems bad for discoverability and understanding why that author record even exists.

Any thoughts on whether I should change how these essays have been recorded? A technical fix might be to not "hide" titles on the alternate author's page, if the parent title is logged against unknown/uncredited/etc, but I dunno how much work that would be, or even if it's desirable.

Thanks ErsatzCulture (talk) 12:25, 7 October 2023 (EDT)

One option:

• Credit the Chinese title to 洛朗蒂乌·尼斯托雷斯库 and uncredited
• Credit the English title to Laurentiu Nistorescu, Antuza Genescu, Dorin Davideanu, Silviu Genescu, and uncredited

A simpler option: Delete the English essay record. As entered, it does not appear in an eligible publication. We only enter webzines, not any web essay. Everything entered in that record can be moved to the Chinese title record. -- JLaTondre (talk) 13:05, 7 October 2023 (EDT)

I would also use the "A" template for Antuza Genescu, Dorin Davideanu, and Silviu Genescu since we have author records for them. Ahasuerus (talk) 13:08, 7 October 2023 (EDT)

Thanks both. I'll update the author names to use the template.

Re. the original "publication" - I appreciate the original isn't really eligible for inclusion in ISFDB, but I'm more interested in capturing the fact that the Chinese publication is a translation of an older essay, and I don't think there's any other way of recording that than creating an English (or whatever) title record to variant to? (Same as how translated webnovels get a parent title record, even though the original webnovel "publication" isn't really ISFDB-eligible.) ErsatzCulture (talk) 19:40, 8 October 2023 (EDT)

The point about "translated webnovels get[ting] a parent title record" is an interesting one. I maintain a few publishers who do exactly that, e.g.:

• Cross Infinite World: publishes English translations of Japanese light novels
• Magic Dome Books/Magic Dome Books and 1C-Publishing: mostly publishes European (mostly Russian and Ukrainian, but also some German) authors, often in translation

Some of these translated novels were originally published in book form, but many original versions are Web novels and have not been published as books. I don't think we have a standard for these types of scenarios, which results in inconsistent dating: some parent titles are enter as "8888-00-00" while others use the date of the online publication. We probably need to discuss these issues on the Rules and Standards page. Ahasuerus (talk) 13:51, 9 October 2023 (EDT)

Stuck submission?

Wondering my submission seems stuck? https://www.isfdb.org/cgi-bin/view_submission.cgi?5773933 Thanks. gzuckier (talk) 00:50, 14 October 2023 (EDT)

I suspect that the moderators who reviewed the submission were not sure whether this "future history" book was a work of fiction. I have confirmed that it is indeed fiction, approved the submission and updated the author record. Thanks! Ahasuerus (talk) 10:38, 14 October 2023 (EDT)

Thank you. gzuckier (talk) 12:19, 14 October 2023 (EDT)

Adding "Pages to Fill: A Legends & Lattes Short Story"

Greetings and felicitations. I'd like to add (or have someone else add) "Pages to Fill: A Legends & Lattes Short Story", a prequel to the novel. Besides the author's Web site, it is also available in the back of Tor's American hardcover edition (though I don't have proof of that) and apparently at the end of the audiobook (see the full Publisher Description).

Unfortunately, I can't find instructions on how to do that (for SHORTFICTION), though other comments on this page hint at it. Help, please? —DocWatson42 (talk) 00:15, 18 October 2023 (EDT)

Amazon's Look Inside let me confirm that "Pages to Fill" indeed appears at the end of the hardcover edition published by Tor. The table of contents of their ebook edition mentions an "excerpt" from "Pages to Fill", but Look Inside doesn't display it. I have updated the hardcover pub -- all I had to do was use "Edit This Pub" and add a SHORTFICTION title to the Content section. The version posted on the author's Web site has 9491 words, which makes it a novelette. Thanks! Ahasuerus (talk) 11:46, 20 October 2023 (EDT)

Thank you, and I'm sorry about the deletion of discussions here—it was not only unintentional, I did not realize that I was doing it. —DocWatson42 (talk) 03:28, 26 October 2023 (EDT)

Awards

I can't find where to add an award that is not part of the awards list. I appreciate help. Thanks. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Antunes (talk • contribs) .

Help:Screen:AwardType says:

• Award Types define the types of awards (like the Hugo award) that ISFDB currently supports. Only ISFDB bureaucrats can create new award types. Only ISFDB moderators can edit existing award types. If you would like to have a new award type added or an existing award type modified, feel free to post your request on the Community Portal.

Once a request has been posted in the Community Portal, it usually takes a few days to discuss it. If consensus is reached, then an ISFDB bureaucrat will add a new Award Type. HTH! Ahasuerus (talk) 11:22, 20 October 2023 (EDT)

Author Directory

I've logged in, yet selecting any letter in the author directory returns that advanced search is restricted? —The preceding unsigned comment added by Acb13adm (talk • contribs) 08:59, October 29, 2023‎

Are you sure you are logged into the ISFDB as well as this wiki? John Scifibones 09:24, 29 October 2023 (EDT)

Because the search function is not dependent on being logged in, the problem you are facing must be caused by something else.

I do suppose you get the response 'Regular search doesn't support single character searches for names' using the regular search: that answer is intentional, because you wouldn't get the authors whose name begins with this letter but all authors whose name contain this letter at any position in their spelling (and this can easily lead to more than 100,000 authors to be displayed).

If this ain't the problem you're facing: could you please describe more specifically what you're doing (and where), and what the exact wording of the response is? Stonecreek (talk) 06:24, 30 October 2023 (EDT)

Advanced Search requires you to be logged in. That was changed awhile back because of bots causing DB issues. So what is happening is expected behaviour if someone is not logged in. Annie (talk) 12:42, 30 October 2023 (EDT)

That's right. Let me add a warning to the "Author Directory" page. Ahasuerus (talk) 13:48, 30 October 2023 (EDT)

Done. Ahasuerus (talk) 14:46, 30 October 2023 (EDT)

S. R. Cronin not on ISFDB

Locus just announced the passing of this author.

https://locusmag.com/2023/10/sherrie-cronin-1954-2023/

As far as I can tell, this author only appears on ISFDB in this record, under a different version of her name:

https://www.isfdb.org/cgi-bin/title.cgi?43591

She self-published several fantasy novels in two series w/ Amazon.com Kindle delivery:

https://www.amazon.com/s?k=s.+r.+cronin&i=stripbooks&crid=ZBEVKG7XIXYN&sprefix=s.+r.+cronin%2Cstripbooks%2C126&ref=nb_sb_noss

Should we index them? Mike (talk) 13:13, 31 October 2023 (EDT)

https://archive.org/details/Asimovs_v03n11_1979-11/page/n119/mode/2up?view=theater; I saw that link in a StackExchange discussion where someone couldn't remember the title of this story. --Username (talk) 13:36, 31 October 2023 (EDT)

We definitely want her self-published books. I plan to add them tomorrow morning. Ahasuerus (talk) 22:45, 2 November 2023 (EDT)

All of her books have been entered and an alternate name has been set up. Thanks for finding the obituary! Ahasuerus (talk) 14:04, 3 November 2023 (EDT)

Thanks for handling this. Cheers. Mike (talk) 17:39, 3 November 2023 (EDT)

Mafagafo Revista/Monthly issues inside a yearly folder

I hope this doesn't sounds confusing: I'm slowly adding issues of this Brazilian magazine, but how do I neatly tuck these and two (and other editions I still need to add manually) issues inside a neat early "folder" like this (i.e.: put them inside a Mafagafo - 2022 "folder")? Thanks in advance! Alittlebook (talk) 16:46, 2 November 2023 (EDT)

There is a Help page, Help:How to link a magazine to its wiki page and add it to a magazine series, that discusses this topic. The top half is actually obsolete now that the ISFDB software builds issue grids automatically; the ISFDB Wiki is no longer used for this purpose. We'll need to remove the section.

The bottom half, however, is still mostly accurate. Here are the relevant steps, edited to reflect the current state of the software:

• The EDITOR records of a magazine must first be merged by year using the steps listed below.
• Use Advanced Title Search to find the EDITOR records for issues published in a given year. The Title Search screen will list candidates for merging.
• Select the titles to be merged being careful not to select any titles that should not be merged. Only titles with the same editor(s) and year should be merged. See this example where the editor credit changed in the middle of 1953.
• Review the displayed titles, then click Complete Merge. On the next Web page, select the title record with the earliest date. Note that the spelling of the title doesn't matter because it will be modified in the next step. The Moderator will review and approve the submission.
• Bring up the merged title record for editing. For example, "Strange Stories, April 1939" should be changed to "Strange Stories - 1939" and "Strange Stories" entered in the Series field. A moderator will review and approve the submission.
• Putting EDITOR records in the same series will result in "(View All Issues)" and "(View Issue Grid)" links appearing on all Web pages displaying individual issues.

Please note the bolded statement above, i.e. "Only titles with the same editor(s) should be merged". In the case of Mafagafo, the two 2022 issues that we currently have on file have different editors, so they shouldn't be merged. HTH! Ahasuerus (talk) 22:29, 2 November 2023 (EDT)

Hm! This answers my question but raises another: Mafagafo always had the same editor-in-chief, which is Jana Bianchi (the one listed in the yearly merged links from 2018 and 2019). I think this is a lost-in-translation kind of situation, because the I've been crediting the other editions (from issue 2020 onwards) as "edited by [new person]", the "editor" in this case being the person who did the developmental edits/copyedits (the word "editor" means the both things in Portuguese), but Jana Bianchi was still the editor-in-chief. Considering how Strange Horizons is credited here (with the credited editor being only the editor-in-chief and not the fiction/developmental editors), should I go back and change all the issues to credit Jana Bianchi? Alittlebook (talk) 23:11, 2 November 2023 (EDT)

Generally, we only enter the name(s) of the Editor-in-Chief in the Author/Editor field. For example, consider the Wiki page Series:Air Wonder Stories, which says (under "Staff"):

• Hugo Gernsback, editor-in-chief.
• David Lasser, Literary editor, July 1929-February 1930, Managing editor, March-Mary 1930. Despite his title Lasser was in effect managing editor for all issues.
• M. E. Dame, Associate editor, April-May 1930.
• A. L. Fierst, Associate editor, February-May 1930.
• C. P. Mason, Associate editor, February-May 1930.

When you check the corresponding "Series" page in the database, you'll note that only Gernsback is credited.

In this case I would enter "Jana Bianchi" in the Author/Editor field and document "guest editors", "fiction editors", "developmental editors", etc in Notes. Ahasuerus (talk) 19:06, 3 November 2023 (EDT)

Ok, thanks! I'm gonna go back to those and credit Jana as the main editor, then. Alittlebook (talk) 20:11, 3 November 2023 (EDT)

Approved and ready for two "Title Merge" submissions, one for 2012 and the other one for 2022. You can either use Advanced Title Search or pull up Jana Bianchi's Summary page, then click "Show All Titles" under "Editing Tools" and select titles to merge from the displayed list. Ahasuerus (talk) 20:44, 3 November 2023 (EDT)

'Star Wars Universe' vs 'Star Wars Universe/Star Wars' series

Can anyone explain the rationale for choosing which series to place 'independent' novels into? --Glenn (talk) 16:39, 6 November 2023 (EST)

How to find magazine issue when story title is known

I am looking for the issue of the Analog or Fantasy & Science Fiction magazine containing a story titled "Gotlos". Thanks —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Dulinje (talk • contribs) .

Colin Kapp's Gottlos appeared in Analog Science Fiction/Science Fact, November 1969. -- JLaTondre (talk) 19:04, 21 November 2023 (EST)

And for future reference, you can find what JLaTondre found by searching for the author listing (in this case, here) using the search box at the top left side of the main site and find the story in their list of works. Clicking on the story title will take you to the entry JLaTondre provided, where you'll be able to see where that story's been published. You can also search for the story title using that same search box. ···日本穣 · 投稿 · Talk to Nihonjoe 13:16, 22 November 2023 (EST)

However, you need to know the correct spelling for ISFDB search to work. To find this story, I searched "Gotlos Analog or Fantasy & Science Fiction magazine" in Google and the first hit lead me to "Gottlos" and that it was in "Analog Science Fiction/Science Fact, November 1969". -- JLaTondre (talk) 07:15, 23 November 2023 (EST)

Synopsis can't be edited

I can't find the information on why a synopsis can't always be edited. Example: https://www.isfdb.org/cgi-bin/title.cgi?3086815 LiseAndreasen (talk) 16:57, 23 November 2023 (EST)

I'd say it is because the title is for a Chapbook which is a special type of container. Instead, edit the Shortfiction title of the same name that is included in the Chapbook. For your example: here. Phil (talk) 20:07, 23 November 2023 (EST)

That's right: we wouldn't want to add a synopsis to a CHAPBOOK: the enclosed piece of shortfiction may also be published in a COLLECTION or an ANTHOLOGY, and so it's more meaningful to add this information to the fiction title (and it's in the fiction where the plot unfolds). Stonecreek (talk) 01:55, 24 November 2023 (EST)

Okaaay. Is it by design, that it's not obvious, that the text exists in 2 versions? With different nomination data? LiseAndreasen (talk) 03:19, 24 November 2023 (EST)

Chapbooks are a special case. The chapbook record is for the publication, not the text within the publication. The short fiction record is for the actual contents. Think of a chapbook as a single story collection if that helps. The award nomination should have been on the novella record and not on the chapbook record. I have fixed that. -- JLaTondre (talk) 07:18, 24 November 2023 (EST)

And we do need a special container title type, even for a single piece of shortfiction: though that is the criterion that makes out a CHAPBOOK, there can be other title types that are published along the shortfiction, essays, for example, or pieces of interior art. Stonecreek (talk) 09:58, 24 November 2023 (EST)

Thanks for all answers! LiseAndreasen (talk) 13:29, 24 November 2023 (EST)

(This just to clarify content. LiseAndreasen (talk) 22:48, 1 December 2023 (EST))

Oh. One more question. It's possible to attach different tags to a chapbook and the story in it? There's a reason for handling tags this way and synopsis another way? LiseAndreasen (talk) 14:56, 24 November 2023 (EST)

Same story, different synopsis

This story has its own synopsis, so does the "original". The reason for this? https://www.isfdb.org/cgi-bin/title.cgi?64178 LiseAndreasen (talk) 14:59, 24 November 2023 (EST)

Checking Edit History, I see that you added a synopsis to the Variant Title on 2023-10-09. I will ping User:Rtrace, who approved the submission on 2023-10-17. Ahasuerus (talk) 21:30, 28 November 2023 (EST)

When I review an edit adding a synopsis, I generally approve those without much investigation. Unless one is familiar with the title, there's no way to verify that the synopsis is correct, so this is a type of edit where I tend to trust that the submitter knows what they're doing. That being said, I don't recall that I've ever drilled down into the existing title record to see if it is a variant. If having synopses on both parent and variant title is a concern I can try to do so, but we may want to add a warning that the title being edited is a variant with a link to the parent title. The converse relationship (i.e. when editing the parent) is clear when reviewing the edit, but there's nothing on the review screen showing the parent title. --Ron ~ Rtrace^Talk 21:41, 28 November 2023 (EST)

Checking our archives, I see the following 2022-04-30 announcement:

• "Make Variant" has been updated to move "synopsis" data from the child title to the parent title. [This was FR 743, "Make This a Variant Title should move synopsis".]
• Which reminds me. Are there scenarios where a VT with a synopsis makes sense? We have 1,636 of them, but I suspect that the vast majority are titles whose synopses were not moved to the parent record when they were varianted. I guess I should create a cleanup report for "VTs with synopsis data" and then we'll see if any are legitimate. Ahasuerus 17:41, 30 April 2022 (EDT)
  • The cleanup report has been coded and deployed [this was FR 1501, "Create a cleanup report to find VTs with synopsis data."] The data will become available tomorrow morning. Ahasuerus 19:57, 30 April 2022 (EDT)

As of this morning, the cleanup report had 1546 VTs with synopsis data. If we can get a cleanup effort going, it should be possible to get all of them moved to the parent titles within a few days/weeks. If we don't come across any scenarios requiring that VTs have synopses, I could then change the software to make the Synopsis field not editable for VTs. It would be similar to the way CHAPBOOKs work. Ahasuerus (talk) 13:21, 29 November 2023 (EST)

I have cleaned up a bunch and the report is now down to 1,500 titles. It is as I suspected: most just needed the synopsis data to be moved to the parent titles; some needed two synopsis entries reconciled; a few were in error, e.g. Notes data in the Synopsis field or vice versa or non-English synopses which are explicitly not allowed in Help.

I plan to post my findings on the Community Portal tomorrow morning. I will also propose a software change to disallow entering Synopsis data for VTs. Ahasuerus (talk) 18:04, 29 November 2023 (EST)

I spotted a couple of titles on the cleanup report with which I am familiar so have submitted edits to clean them up: The Engineer ReConditioned and The Long Afternoon of Earth. Teallach (talk) 17:50, 30 November 2023 (EST)

Approved, thanks. Ahasuerus (talk) 18:13, 30 November 2023 (EST)

OLiver Whimsey

● I don't know if this subject has ever come up, but I would like to add a few coloring books, like Dark Beauty Horror Coloring Book for Adults by Oliver Whimsey. I would think these books could qualify as art books. "He" has a number of fantasy oriented coloring/art books. Still, there might be rule against these, I'm good either way. MLB (talk) 21:21, 28 November 2023 (EST)

Well, coloring books do contain art and we have a number of them on file. However, the ones that are currently in the database are generally covered by the following Rule of Acquisition:

• Included: Published non-fiction works about speculative fiction which can be plausibly linked to published (as defined above) speculative fiction.

Examples include "Terry Pratchett's Discworld Coloring Book" and "The Wonderful Wizard of Oz Coloring Book".

Can Oliver Whimsey's Dark Beauty Horror Coloring Book for Adults be plausibly linked to published (as defined above) speculative fiction? Or it is standalone horror art? Ahasuerus (talk) 21:43, 28 November 2023 (EST)

They seem to be stand-alones. Nice art, but again, I'll go with the majority here. MLB (talk) 05:02, 1 December 2023 (EST)

Crown of Starlight

Recently watched a YouTube video about this fantasy and I have added it to this website. But, I'm not sure if I did it correctly. Could somebody in the know check out my listing and let me know if it was done correctly. The YouTube video on this book and it's author is attached to my listing. MLB (talk) 20:29, 26 December 2023 (EST)

TOXIN - By Robin Cook

In the book jacket it says, “Determined to be a good father to his only son, newly divorced surgeon Dr. Kim Regis takes Selden to his favorite fast food restaurant…” In the book itself, the child is a girl (daughter) named Becky. Also, the doctor’s name is spelled REGGIS- not REGIS. In the book jacket it says “…the boy dies within hours…” whereas in the text the (girl) dies in 5 days. How does this type of error happen? I’m sure thousands of copies of this book were printed. I’m just curious.

Please reply to ronlibutti@gmail.com

Thank you. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by RONLIBUTTI (talk • contribs) . 22:53, 6 January 2024‎ (EST)

We apologize for any confusion. We are not the author or the publisher, so we don't have an answer for your question. If we were to venture a guess, it's likely the story was modified slightly between the time the back cover copy was written and the book contents were finalized, and no one noticed the discrepancies. It happens here and there in the publishing world. You're welcome to contact the publisher or the author through their respective websites if you wish. This would allow them to correct it for future printings. ···日本穣 · 投稿 · Talk to Nihonjoe 12:11, 8 January 2024 (EST)

Excerpted only in translation

I believe that the convention for entering an excerpt is that it takes the date of excerpt publication and stands alone, not being made a variant of the work excerpted from. That's the way I've been doing them. However, I've just come up against this question: what about a translated excerpt when only the excerpt has been translated, not the entire original? Looking for the first foreign titles listed with "(excerpt)" I find Джанга с тенями (excerpt), which is dated the same as the English translation, and Мы (excerpt), which is dated 8888-00-00, or unpublished. The latter makes a lot more sense to me. I would even add a note confirming that the full original work was not translated. Possibly someone can direct me to a Rules page that clarifies this; otherwise, is there a consensus? -- Martin MOHearn (talk) 10:21, 10 January 2024 (EST)

I don't know if there's a consensus, but I do think that from the rules your assumption is more meaningful: we have the rule that titles have to bear the date of their first publication, and thus a title where we know (or can safely assume) that it was not published should be marked as such ('8888-00-00'). Christian Stonecreek (talk) 01:39, 11 January 2024 (EST)

I think I'll go ahead that way on the relevant entries in an anthology I listed a few days ago, so the story and essay excerpts in Italian show at least some sort of source. Martin MOHearn (talk) 09:43, 11 January 2024 (EST)

LInda Barrett

Well, I've done it again. Somehow I messed up the serial that can be found here, and I don't how to fix it. Can I get any help? MLB (talk) 01:15, 19 January 2024 (EST)

It looks like you made part 1 a variant of part 2. Instead, both should have been made a variant of a new title. You should be able to fix this by making part 2 a variant of a new title (use Option 2 of the Make Variant Title screen). Since the software doesn't allow variants of variants, it will automatically move part 1 to be a variant of the new title also. -- JLaTondre (talk) 08:47, 19 January 2024 (EST)

Carnegie Medal

sorry if this is the wrong place for this question. The carnegies have only had a list of nominees since 2003, prior to that in many years they had two other awards as well as the winner namely "Commended" and "Highly Commended". Is It possible to have these categories added to the list of options? if not then how should they be categorised? nominee with a note to say what they actually are? cheers from Gaz Faustus (talk) 15:22, 19 January 2024 (EST)

Let me first clarify that "award categories" are for different types of awards given by the same award committee/body. For example, consider the list of categories for the International Horror Guild Award: Best Novel, Best First Novel, Best Short Story, Best Non-Fiction, Best Artist, Best Periodical, Best TV, etc.

On the other hand, what you are describing is non-standard "award levels", which are different animals. At this time, we do not have support for them. You could enter their Award Levels either:

• as "Nomination", or
• as "Special" followed by selecting "Honorable Mentions" from the drop-down list

Either way, please explain the details in the Notes field. Award Notes appear in hover-over "informational" bubbles displayed on Award pages, e.g. if you display the main page for the Carnegie Medal category, you will notice a little "i" next to the word "Win" for 1947. If you hover your cursor over it, it will display the associated award record's Note, in this case "First collection to win the award, and first time previously published works were considered." Hope this helps! Ahasuerus (talk) 21:29, 19 January 2024 (EST)

cheers mate it was award levels i meant. Just done one using honourable mentions and note with the note saying: Received the designation "Commended". I'll stick with that if youre happy. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Faustus (talk • contribs) .

Thanks, I have approved the submission -- here is the result. I also updated the Note field to indicate where the data came from. Ahasuerus (talk) 07:59, 21 January 2024 (EST)

Got it- i'll follow that format for the others. cheers - Gaz Faustus (talk) 08:40, 21 January 2024 (EST)

1 Novel + 1 Short fiction = Omnibus/Collection/Novel?

If a book consists of a novel and a shorter work both of which have previously been published seperately then what type is it?

This one is an OMNIBUS

This one is a COLLECTION

This one's a NOVEL

The Benford novelette is set in the same universe as the novel - does that have any bearing on Pub Type?

from Gaz Faustus (talk) 09:24, 25 January 2024 (EST)

It can be classified as a NOVEL or a COLLECTION. From the Publication Type help section

"NOVEL. Used when the book is devoted to a single work of fiction. The addition of multiple short stories makes the book a collection, not a novel (A single story is a judgment call, see below). However, sample chapters placed at the end of a book for advertising reasons do not make a novel into a collection. If a book is packaged as a single volume work, and then republished as a multi-volume work, all the publications are novels; there is no need to classify the single volume work as an omnibus. Conversely, if a book is originally published as multiple volumes, and republished as a single volume, the latter is a novel unless the presentation within the single volume makes it clear that the works are presented as separate novels. Sometimes a novel is bound with a single short work of fiction by the same author (an example is this edition of The Misenchanted Sword). In such a case it is often preferred to class the publication as a novel with a "Bonus story" rather than a 2-item collection or omnibus. This is particularly true if the publication has the same title as the novel. It is a judgment call, however." John Scifibones 10:00, 25 January 2024 (EST)

Thanks, i'd read the collection and omnibus bits of that help page but somehow didnt look at NOVEL. Gaz Faustus (talk) 10:23, 25 January 2024 (EST)

My typo in a canonical name

I mistyped Linda Burroughs as LInda Burroughs and now that it's been entered as a canonical name I can't correct it. I tried doing so on the title page for her one essay so far, but the software matched Linda with LInda and that edit went through without the change. Could a moderator fix that typo on the Author Record page? Thanks. MOHearn (talk) 15:52, 26 January 2024 (EST)

As requested. John Scifibones 16:25, 26 January 2024 (EST)

Thank you, John.--Martin MOHearn (talk) 17:19, 26 January 2024 (EST)

A question about variants with pseudonyms

I'm generally fine with creating variants but need some clarification for this situation. The publication is written under a pseudonym. The title page shows the author as another pseudonym "writing as". Fine so far but the existing canonical author record has the author's canonical name plus an additional author. Example: Satellite B.C. which has the canonical authors as John S. Glasby and Arthur Roberts. I added the ebook edition whose title page shows "John Glasby writing as Rand Le Page" using the Rand Le Page pseudonym. I feel like there should be a variant created but am not sure if that's true. What should I do? Thanks! Phil (talk) 10:07, 3 February 2024 (EST)

The author field help attempts to cover this:

Alternate Names. If you know that a particular author's name is an alternate name, enter that alternate name rather than changing it to the canonical name. If the title page shows both an original and a subsequent name, use the original name. For example, Isaac Asimov's "Lucky Starr" books were originally published under the pseudonym of Paul French, but later reprints were given both names: "by Isaac Asimov, writing as Paul French". In these cases you should still enter Paul French as the author and record the dual credit in the notes. If the cover shows both names but the title page shows only one name, use the name from the title page -- no matter which it is -- and record the discrepancy with the cover credit in the notes. When a book is known to be ghost-written, this should be treated as an alternate name; the ghost-writer will eventually show up as having an alternate name of the well-known author, but that data is not entered via this field. (my emphasis)

The credit should be to Rand Le Page. The variant would go to the canonical name, which is John S. Glasby. The software does not permit a variant of a variant, so there would be no intermediate record with the John Glasby credit. If we believe the work is by both Glasby and Roberts, then the variant would go to a record using two author credits for John S. Glasby and Arthur Roberts -- always to the canonical. Unless it were ever published as credited solely to "John Glasby", there will be no variant with that credit. --MartyD (talk) 15:56, 4 February 2024 (EST)

Thanks. That's how I did it but somehow didn't see the guidance in the Help to reassure me that I had done it correctly. Phil (talk) 16:53, 4 February 2024 (EST)

Restoring cancelled submission

Is there any way to easily restore/resubmit a submission I accidentally cancelled (other than reenter everything)? 5883840 if it can be done. Thanks. gzuckier (talk) 22:27, 8 February 2024 (EST)

A moderator can unreject. Which I had done. It is back to being active and in the queue. Annie (talk) 00:53, 9 February 2024 (EST)

10000 thank yous. gzuckier (talk) 23:47, 10 February 2024 (EST)

interviews jump to continuation page

When entering an interview with multiple authors interviewed in a publication, when the article starts on say page 1 and the first author is interviewed there, and the continuation of the article jumps to say page 10 and interviews more authors, is it better to just add additional authors to the interview listing with the first page number, or to add them as another interview with the second page number and the same title? I can't decide which is more logical. Thanks. gzuckier (talk) 15:12, 18 February 2024 (EST)

Adding alternate name

Colombian author Rodrigo Bastidas Pérez [1] [2] also appears to use the nameRodrigo Bastidas [3] [4] so if anybody could add it, please? Thanks. gzuckier (talk) 15:30, 18 February 2024 (EST)

The ISFDB is a publication driven database. An author record will be created the first time "Rodrigo Bastidas" is credited to a title. After creation, go to the newly created author record. Select 'Make/Remove Alternate Name' from the Editing Tools menu. Put 'Rodrigo Bastidas Pérez' in the Parent name field or 329980 in the Parent Record # field. John Scifibones 15:42, 18 February 2024 (EST)

thanks. gzuckier (talk) 15:56, 18 February 2024 (EST)

Adding web-published short fiction?

General question: https://isfdb.org/wiki/index.php/Help:Screen:NewPub seems to list everything except a new piece of short fiction (New Anthology, New Chapbook, New Collection, New Fanzine, New Magazine, New Nonfiction, New Novel, and New Omnibus). How does one add one?

More specifically, how would one add Andy Weir’s latest short story, “The Martian: Lost Sols” (https://galactanet.com/lostsols.pdf)?

(A more complicated issue might be whether to count it as either part of a new The Martian series, or as just a missing part of the novel.)

— FlaSheridn (talk) 19:42, 18 February 2024 (EST)

A publication of a single work of short fiction is handled in the ISFDB as a CHAPBOOK, which you should think of as a one-story COLLECTION. So you use Add New Chapbook. We would consider a PDF an "ebook". It will seem redundant, but within that new record, you would add one entry in the "Regular Titles" (content) section for the short story. See some details in the CHAPBOOK sub-bullet of Help:Screen:NewPub#Publication_Type. It is normal for both the CHAPBOOK and the SHORTFICTION records to have the same title text, but that is not required. If the story belongs in the series, add the series to the SHORTFICTION record (which will only be available after the initial submission is accepted), not to the CHAPBOOK. --MartyD (talk) 21:31, 18 February 2024 (EST)

Financial contributions

Is there a way to make a monthly financial contribution to your site? —The preceding unsigned comment added by Jeradcentipedepress.com (talk • contribs) 16:35, February 21, 2024‎

Not at the moment, but let me check with Al von Ruff who currently handles server issues. Thanks for the thought! Ahasuerus (talk) 17:36, 21 February 2024 (EST)

++

— FlaSheridn (talk) 21:07, 22 February 2024 (EST)

Not at the moment. but the site isn't particularly expensive to operate. I'll be looking into creating a 501c later this year, mostly to ensure the longevity of the site, but that would also allow for official financial contributions. Alvonruff (talk) 16:43, 11 March 2024 (EDT)

(in error) credit to cover artist / Beloved Exile

What steps should I take to fix up the cover artist for Beloved Exile? My 2nd printing has a copyright page credit and signature on the artwork crediting 'Heide Oberheide'.

It seems I should edit the 'Author 1' name in the record, but am unsure how to create the 'Tom Canty (in error)' record linkage. --Glenn (talk) 17:13, 14 March 2024 (EDT)

It's unfortunately complicated. What you'd need to do is separate the publications so that the AvoNova pub has a COVERART record of its own that is not shared with the two Bantam pubs. Then make the AvoNova's credit be "Tom Canty (in error)" instead of "Tom Canty", and make the title the two Bantam pubs share be credited to "Heide Oberheide" instead of "Tom Canty". Then both the fixed "Heide Oberheide" one and the "Tom Canty (in error)" one would need to be made variants of one credited to "Heidi Oberheide" (her canonical name), "Tom Canty (in error)" would need to be made an alternate name for Heidi Oberheide, and the lingering old parent title credited to Thomas Canty would need to be deleted. It would take quite a few submissions and a few wait-for-approval pauses. I'd be happy to do this for you, if you want, or you're welcome to try it yourself. --MartyD (talk) 18:38, 14 March 2024 (EDT)

Please do. --Glenn (talk) 20:16, 14 March 2024 (EDT)

The two Bantam editions have different credits (one "Heidi", the other "Heide") and also needed to be separated. Final result is here. --MartyD (talk) 07:19, 15 March 2024 (EDT)

Хищник

I need some help from anybody who knows Russian. I just listed Хищник. I did the best I could, but I know I must of gotten something wrong. I had to spell out the authors' names from by "Symbol" program on my word program and I'm sure I did something wrong. Could somebody check this out and let me know what I did wrong? MLB (talk) 23:09, 14 March 2024 (EDT)

All fixed :) Annie (talk) 13:54, 15 March 2024 (EDT)

Thank you very much. MLB (talk) 14:57, 15 March 2024 (EDT)

Anytime - the two author names needed fixing - Morris looked ok but the k in his first name was in Latin; Golden's first name contained characters that looked like the actual letters if you squint :) I also added more details (including the translator)from Fantlab and other Russian sources, got the publisher sorted out and got a month of publication (Goodreads can be really bad for this on Russian books). Thanks for adding it. Feel free to drop me a note when you get one of these - either after you add it as you did now or just with a link to the Goodreads book and I will be happy to fix/add it. Annie (talk) 15:06, 15 March 2024 (EDT)

@MLB, when I am not on my tablet or phone with convenient virtual keyboards and am stuck on my computer's US-standard QWERTY keyboard, I often find it easier to Google for names/titles with diacriticals or in non-Latin alphabets and copy + paste. WAY faster than trying to enter one symbol at a time.... --MartyD (talk) 08:22, 16 March 2024 (EDT)

Baen vs Baen Books publishers redux

I'm reopening the Baen vs Baen Books publishers discussion as I currently have some edits on pause [5] that attempted to add the "Baen Science Fantasy Books".

The last time this was discussed, it kind of fizzled out, and so when PVing my Baen books I ended up just following the existing patterns for which Baen publisher variant to use. (I've currently have PVed 1077 Baen publications). The addition of the little used variant would follow existing patterns, but much lower usage.

Is this the time to get this straightened out? --Glenn (talk) 16:14, 18 March 2024 (EDT)

Conceptual clarification for alternate names and “as by”?

I’m seeing some works that have a non-canonical name for their byline but that aren’t showing up on the page for the canonical name. I think I now understand that to make them show up on the page for the canonical name, I need to follow the instructions under Help:How_to_record_a_variant_title, but I feel like it might be useful to add a conceptual clarification in the introduction to that page, saying something like “There are various reasons to create a variant title record; for example, to get a work that was published under a non-canonical name to appear under the author’s canonical name, you need to create a variant title record that gives the author’s canonical name.”

I’m saying this because I recently linked a non-canonical name to a canonical name, and I expected that ISFDB would automatically create an “as by” line on the canonical-name page. When that didn’t happen, I went and searched in the wiki to try to find out more; I eventually found that how-to page, and that page gives useful instructions on what to do, and after reading a few different bits of it a few times I think I understand what to do. But I feel like that page could use a high-level conceptual description of what you’re doing, because the phrase “record a variant title” didn’t initially sound like what I wanted to do.

The wiki page for Help:How to enter works published under an alternate name also seems relevant, and I feel like that one could also use a similar high-level conceptual description. In particular, that page says to clone the existing page, but it doesn’t say what to change in the cloned version; I think it should say to change the name in the cloned version to the canonical name. --Elysdir (talk) 16:22, 18 March 2024 (EDT)

When you say ... I recently linked a non-canonical name to a canonical name, ... what was the situation you were trying to deal with, and what did you do at first? --MartyD (talk) 17:47, 18 March 2024 (EDT)

Oops, didn’t see this response ’til now, sorry. There were two situations: (1) My story “All Through the Night” was listed as being by Jedediah Elysdir Hartman, so it wasn’t showing up on the Summary Bibliography page for Jed Hartman. I made Jedediah Elysdir Hartman an alternate name for Jed Hartman, but the story still didn’t show up on the Summary Bibliography page for Jed Hartman. (Now it does.) (2) Thomas M. Disch’s poem Learning to Cross the Street was published under three different versions of the author’s name (Tom Disch, Thomas Disch, Thomas M. Disch), and I wanted those all to appear on the Summary Bibliography page for Disch. (Now they do.) …In both cases, I had initially assumed that if a non-canonical author name was listed for a work, and the non-canonical name was listed as an alternate name, that that work would automatically show up with an “as by” on the Summary Bibliography page for the canonical author name. But it didn’t seem to work automatically, so I went and did some digging through the help pages, and eventually found useful information but without a conceptual overview about circumstances when you might want/need to make a variant title. So, really what I’m saying is that I would like it to be clearer in the documentation what to do if you want an “as by” to show up on the Summary Bibliography page for the canonical name. —Elysdir (talk) 17:51, 7 April 2024 (EDT)

You seem to have made a point: while it does seem a natural move for the ones used to ISFDB to do both moves (that is, establish the alternate name relation and to variant the title as by the alternate name to the title as by the canonical name), there likely should be a hint given within the Make Alternate Name help page. Christian Stonecreek (talk) 02:08, 8 April 2024 (EDT)

Linking books as translation

I have submitted tickets for this for several books in the Eragon series through 'Make This Title a Variant' butt nothing changed after it got approved.

See the novel section for the not linked Swedish and Italian ones https://www.isfdb.org/cgi-bin/ea.cgi?28380

The West-Frisian translation of The two towers is also not linked 'De twa tuorren' https://www.isfdb.org/cgi-bin/ea.cgi?302

Also this author translated his own book that needs to belinked to the original English one https://www.isfdb.org/cgi-bin/ea.cgi?376722

Noticed that now it's just the other way around. 'Het zwaard van het licht' is the translation of 'The Lady's Gift', right? If you could confirm here, I'll switch it around for you (or someone else will) :) MagicUnk (talk) 16:17, 21 March 2024 (EDT)

Flapco (talk) 14:06, 20 March 2024 (EDT)

The best way to do this is to follow these steps:

• Create the translated title as normal.
• View the new title record you made (make sure it's the title record and not the publication record).
• Open a separate window or tab with the original title to which you want to variant the translation.
• Copy the Title Record # (at the top right of the entry).
• Go back to the tab or window with the translated title record and click the Make this title a variant link in the toolbar on the left.
• Under Option 1 (don't use Option 2), paste the copied Title Record # into the Parent # field.
• Click the Link to Existing Parent button to submit the varianting for review.

Once you've done that, a moderator can review the submission and approve it. ···日本穣 · 投稿 · Talk to Nihonjoe 14:16, 20 March 2024 (EDT)

Just a small clarification - "Create the translated title as normal." above means "Add the book. Forget that it is a translation and just add it - add the translator in the Title note but other from that, just add the book as you would add any other book".

If you start by creating the variant and not by adding the book, the variant may be deleted overnight (we have a report looking for orphan titles). :) Annie (talk) 18:39, 20 March 2024 (EDT)

Good clarification. ···日本穣 · 投稿 · Talk to Nihonjoe 19:13, 20 March 2024 (EDT)

J. T. Brewer

I am entering the spiritual fantasies of J. T. Brewer, but the author is actually two people, Judeen Brewer and Terry Brewer. How do I enter the two author's real names when the field will only accept one? MLB (talk) 23:07, 25 March 2024 (EDT)

You'd need to add both as using that name as a pseudonym. Similar to James S. A. Corey and The Expanse series. See point #4 here for more details. ···日本穣 · 投稿 · Talk to Nihonjoe 01:23, 28 March 2024 (EDT)

Rejected attempt to enter ISBN

I tried to enter the ISBN for Publication Record # 39933: The Flight of the Horse, Ballantine Books, 1973-09-00.

My attempt to save this data was rejected with the error message "Info already on file", or words to that effect.

There is an ISBN listed in your records for later printings of that book, but not for this first printing. Not in PR# 39933. That record does show an SBN, and the ISBN can be derived from that, which is how I got the valid ISBN for this book, using the SBN printed in my copy of the first printing. That ISBN was confirmed by an ISBN lookup, which shows the book with the same cover I have. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Lensman03 (talk • contribs) .

We would need more information for us to be able to help. For example, do you have the submission record that got rejected? That would tell us whether it's a mistake and your submission should not have been rejected, or conversely, that there's indeed data that shouldn't be overwritten. Oh, and always sign your posts with four '~'. MagicUnk (talk) 12:00, 26 March 2024 (EDT)

Checking the submission queue, I see that the submission in question is currently pending. The "Warnings" column says "ISBN already on file", but it's just a warning that tells the reviewing moderator that we already have a publication with this ISBN on file. It doesn't mean that the submission was automatically rejected. It should appear on User:Lensman03's

My Pending Edits page. Ahasuerus (talk) 12:25, 26 March 2024 (EDT)

I've approved this submission and added part of your moderator note to the notes for the publication. ···日本穣 · 投稿 · Talk to Nihonjoe 12:33, 26 March 2024 (EDT)

Thank you, everyone, for your help in holding this newbie's hand! Lensman03 (talk) 23:46, 27 March 2024 (EDT)

Alternate name linkage / Return to Mayberry

I linked Rob Hampson to Robert E. Hampson, but the story Return to Mayberry isn't shown under the full name. What did I miss? --Glenn (talk) 01:27, 28 March 2024 (EDT)

You need to create a parent for it -- just go to "Make This Title a Variant", Option 2 and replace the pseudonym author name with the canonical name one. If the story is already on the canonical author page, you can use Option 1 with the ID of course. That does not happen automatically when you make a pseudonym - partially because we do not want to create duplicates if the titles already exist on the other page. Annie (talk) 14:58, 28 March 2024 (EDT)

Doubles - Omnibus versus Anthology

I just ran across two titles in the DB that are currently set as Anthologies. The Time-Raider / The Whisper of Death and Last Call For Doomsday / The Huntress of Akkan. These are both Doubles in the Armchair Sci-Fi & Horror Double Novels publication series. Shouldn't these be Omnibus titles instead of Anthology? Almost all of the Ace Doubles are considered Omnibus titles. What's the difference? Phil (talk) 12:46, 5 April 2024 (EDT)

The first one is a novel & a novella. The second one is two novellas. Per Template:PublicationFields:PubType, the second one is definitely properly entered as an anthology as both works are short fiction. For the first case, the OMNIBUS definition states "A publication may be classified as an omnibus if it contains multiple works that have previously been published independently, and at least one of them is a NOVEL, ANTHOLOGY, COLLECTION, or NONFICTION. However, generally this category should not be used unless the other categories do not seem appropriate.". The novella in this book was never published independently (see Whisper of Death) so anthology seems appropriate. But as the page says, "The distinction between 'Omnibus' and the other types is somewhat subjective and may require discussion on ISFDB:Help desk or the Community Portal." -- JLaTondre (talk) 16:02, 5 April 2024 (EDT)

Thanks for the clarification. Phil (talk) 16:44, 5 April 2024 (EDT)

Uncertainty about “Email this user”

The only remaining verifier for a particular work says to contact them via wiki email instead of by adding to their Talk page. So I followed that user’s link to the Email this user page, and wrote an email, and clicked Send. But instead of giving me some kind of your-message-has-been-sent confirmation, the page just reloaded, with my text still in the text box. So I can’t tell whether the message got sent or not. When it sends successfully, does it give a confirmation message, or does it just reload the text that it just sent? …Also, I have the “Email me a copy of my message” checkbox checked, but I haven’t received a copy of the message, which makes me think it probably didn’t send. But I’m not sure. Any thoughts about how to find out whether it sent? (I did try clicking Send again, but the same thing happened.) —Elysdir (talk) 17:31, 7 April 2024 (EDT)

I am afraid the ISFDB email server hasn't been kept in sync with evolving email delivery standards, so our email functionality can be spotty. Sometimes ISFDB email is delivered properly and other times it isn't. The ISFDB FAQ mentions it in passing:

• Different email servers have different automated rules which may block email coming from certain Web sites, which makes it hard to tell what's preventing ISFDB confirmation email from being delivered to your mailbox.

Unfortunately, I know little about email servers. At one point Al mentioned that he was going to investigate, but his availability has been sporadic since the last server upgrade in late 2022. Ahasuerus (talk) 20:22, 7 April 2024 (EDT)

OK, thanks—that makes sense in terms of whether mail that gets sent will be delivered. Followup question: Looking at it from the user-of-the-wiki-email-page side of things, can you tell me whether I should expect there to be some kind of confirmation message displayed in the browser after I click Send? Or when I click Send, should I expect it to reload the page, and still show the text boxes containing the message? (In other words, setting aside the question of whether the mail will be delivered after it’s sent, I’m not sure whether it’s being sent at all, so I’d like to find out what it’s supposed to look like from the user’s point of view when it does send the mail.) —Elysdir (talk) 13:43, 8 April 2024 (EDT)

If you use the Email User functionality, if the mail is sent, you should get a "Your email message has been sent." with a link to return to the user's page. If it does something else for you (just reloads?), chances are that there is a browser dependency somewhere - what browser are you using? And if you know how to look, do the Developer tools in the browser give you any clues on errors? Annie (talk) 14:01, 8 April 2024 (EDT)

Thanks! I’ve now tried a different browser (Chrome/Mac), and it correctly gave me the “Your email message has been sent” message. Whew. (Weirdly, I then switched back to my first browser (Safari/Mac) and tried sending mail to myself, in order to follow your suggestion and check Developer Tools—but the message to myself *also* worked correctly. So I don’t know what was going on before; maybe some kind of transient glitch. But everything seems to be working correctly now.) —Elysdir (talk) 15:22, 9 April 2024 (EDT)

New mag entry vanished?

Hi. I submitted a new magazine entry for the New Times Book Review, April 7, 2024, yesterday. It was in my pending edits yesterday, but now it's not in my pending, recent, or rejected? Thanks. gzuckier (talk) 23:33, 13 April 2024 (EDT)

It is showing up in the In Progress or Errored Out New Publication Submission report (I'm not sure that is visible by non-mods). It did create the publication. It can be found here. Comparing the submission to the pub, it looks like everything after "The Essentials / Stephen King" failed to be created. -- JLaTondre (talk) 07:06, 14 April 2024 (EDT)

"Moderator privileges are required for this option". --Username (talk) 10:15, 14 April 2024 (EDT)

A list of your errored out submissions should be accessible from the navigation bar on the left. It is called "My Errored Out Edits". Ahasuerus (talk) 12:27, 15 April 2024 (EDT)

Using your software for an italian version

Hallo I am a fan of ISFDB.org I currently cooperate with the italian website Uraniamania, and I would like to use their database and giving an output similar to yours. Actually, I do not have any oinfo about the acritecture of their database, so I do not know if it will be possible to translate it into an "isfdb.it". Of course there would be differences, because in an hipotetic italian db i would like to include Science fiction,horror, and fantasy fiction, but also crime fiction.

So, let's come to the questions. Can I use your software...? Is it under license...?

Cristiano Zecchin Tel. 00 39 331 98 26 228.

It's certainly possible, although there are a few caveats. All of our bibliographic pages -- like the ISFDB home page --have a "License" section in the navigation bar on the left. It says:

• This work is licensed under a Creative Commons Attribution 4.0 International License.

If you follow the link to https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by/4.0/ , you will see the following summary:

• You are free to:
  • Share — copy and redistribute the material in any medium or format for any purpose, even commercially.
  • Adapt — remix, transform, and build upon the material for any purpose, even commercially.
  • The licensor cannot revoke these freedoms as long as you follow the license terms.
• Under the following terms:
  • Attribution — You must give appropriate credit , provide a link to the license, and indicate if changes were made . You may do so in any reasonable manner, but not in any way that suggests the licensor endorses you or your use.
  • No additional restrictions — You may not apply legal terms or technological measures that legally restrict others from doing anything the license permits.

Please note that it's just a high level summary. You can find the legal details on this page, which is linked from the summary page.

Please see the Installation and Setup section of the ISFDB Downloads page. It has links to Wiki pages explaining how to install the ISFDB software and database under different operating systems. Ahasuerus (talk) 12:25, 15 April 2024 (EDT)

Second editions with a different co-author

I was working through titles by Rebecca Hamilton and discovered that the series Shadows of Salem has first editions authored by Rebecca Hamilton and Jasmine Walt while the second editions with the same titles and series name are authored by Rebecca Hamilton and Heather Marie Adkins. From what I can find, Heather Marie Adkins is not a pseudonym for Jasmine Walt; they are two completely different authors. To add to the complexity, the audiobooks and CDs for the Rebecca Hamilton and Jasmine Walt editions are only shown as authored by Rebecca Hamilton (though the copyright info on Audible shows both authors).

I'm thinking that the best way to handle this is:
1. Create new titles for the Rebecca Hamilton and Heather Marie Adkins second editions and put them in a new series called "Shadows of Salem (Hamilton & Adkins)".
2. Make new titles for the audiobooks and CDs with just Rebecca Hamilton as the author and them make them variants of the corresponding Hamilton and Walt titles.
3. Change the existing series "Shadows of Salem" to "Shadows of Salem (Hamilton & Walt)".
4. Create a new superseries named "Shadows of Salem" with subseries 1 as "Shadows of Salem (Hamilton & Walt)" and subseries 2 as "Shadows of Salem (Hamilton & Adkins)".

Is there a better approach? TIA Phil (talk) 09:24, 16 April 2024 (EDT)

The first thing that I think we need to determine is whether the published texts are identical. If they are, then we would ideally determine who the actual authors were so that we could properly credit them in the canonical titles.

Also, scanning the Web, I see this Reddit post, which talks about various events surrounding Amazon banning/suspending some authors, including Rebecca Hamilton, in the late 2010s. Among other things, it states:

• Of note is the fact that Cipriano was also co-authored with Jasmine Walt, who was previously deeply entrenched with [Rebecca] Hamilton. However, shortly after the Garner vs Hamilton lawsuit started and information/screenshots on Hamilton's dealings came out, Walt broke ties with Hamilton. Walt also broke ties with [Conner] Kressley, and Hamilton slammed her and accused her of screwing Kressley out of money. Walt and Hamilton entered litigation and a non-disclosure settlement over breaking ties and the series they co-authored. [emphasis added]

And later:

• Other players in this web are Charity Vandehey, Monica Corwin, Margo Bond Collins, and Heather Marie Adkins, who work with Hamilton on Evershade Publishing [emphasis added]

If Rebecca Hamilton and Jasmine Walt did have a falling out, then it may explain the credit change. It doesn't help us determine who actually wrote these books, though. Ahasuerus (talk) 10:41, 16 April 2024 (EDT)

What a mess. I'm not sure if shouldn't just drop this for lack of resources to determine true authorship. What Amazon has for these three titles I can see. The Hamilton & Adkins ebook and tp editions are visible via the Amazon Look-inside feature and show copyright data. WorldCat doesn't have listings for the Hamilton & Walt editions. Phil (talk) 12:53, 16 April 2024 (EDT)

First printing date for hardcover of THE RINGWORLD ENGINEERS

Re Publication Record # 257855, for the Phantasia Press limited hardcover edition of THE RINGWORLD ENGINEERS:

The ISFDB record gives a publishing date of 1979-12-00, and says in part "Year on title page. Source of month unknown. Locus magazine #230 (February 1980) lists it in the "January Books" column but Locus1 refers to it as "Phantasia 1979"

I emailed the publisher, requesting info for exactly when this book was released. Here is the reply I received:

    Hello David.

    My records, and best recollection, seem to show that our edition of THE RINGWORLD
    ENGINEERS was published in late 1979, and likely released in November or December of
    that year.

    Our contract with Hold, Rhinehart, Winston stated that our edition was to be released
    first and I know ours came out at least a few months prior to their trade edition.
    Thus, the Phantasia Press edition states "First Edition" on the copyright page. and
    the year on the title page is 1979.

    I hope this answers your question. If you need any other info, please do not hesitate
    to contact me.

    Sincerely,
    Alex Berman
    Publisher

I see no reason to change the ISDB record's date of 1979-12-00; that seems as accurate as we are going to get, from the publisher's reply. My question is: should any of this info from the publisher be documented in that record?

Lensman03 (talk) 01:26, 17 April 2024 (EDT)

Yes. Add it (in abbreviated, neutral form) to the notes of the concerned pub record. State whom you contacted when, reason, and the reply you've received. MagicUnk (talk) 08:33, 17 April 2024 (EDT)

Lensman03: I am the sole Primary Verifier for the Phantasia ed of The Ringworld Engineers. Thank you for contacting the publisher regarding the publication date. I did not supply the month (December) in the pub record but I did write all the pub notes. It's fine by me for you to add a further note with the information you have received from the publisher, along the lines that MagicUnk has suggested. Don't delete the statement "Source of month unknown." because even the publisher cannot confirm the precise month of publication. Teallach (talk) 12:00, 17 April 2024 (EDT)

Apologies for asking for further help, but this is only my 2nd contribution to the ISFDB, and I'd like some help on writing the "abbreviated, neutral form" note in question.

My first draft for the note is:

Publisher (Phantasia Press) was contacted, requesting exact publication date. Reply from "Alex Berman, Publisher" reads in part: "My records, and best recollection, seem to show that our edition of THE RINGWORLD ENGINEERS was published in late 1979, and likely released in November or December of that year."

I don't know if that's too much or too little info for the note. If an experienced editor here would give me some guidance, I'd appreciate it.

Lensman03 (talk) 00:25, 19 April 2024 (EDT)

It is the right one, I'd say: this way the amount of what we know and the source for it are documented. Stonecreek (talk) 06:03, 19 April 2024 (EDT)

Lensman03: Your wording is fine. The only minor suggestion I have is to include the date of the publisher's reply. So, for example, start the second sentence:

"Reply dated 2024-04-19 from "Alex Berman, Publisher... "

Obviously, change the date to the correct one. Teallach (talk) 06:42, 19 April 2024 (EDT)

Details re "Future Unbounded Program Book"

Re Publication Record # 389437

I question that this fan-published convention program book (booklet) should be categorized as an "anthology". It does have one piece of (short-short) fiction by Larry Niven, but otherwise it's just a typical small amateur-produced program book for a fan-run convention.

I suggest it should be categorized as a "fanzine"; it certainly has all the earmarks of one from the era (1960s), including being composed on a typewriter. This is far from a professional publication.

Also, there isn't any "primary verification". There's a note in the entry saying "All information from examination copy."

Should I add a Primary Verification, since I do own a copy? All I would be doing, other than possibly changing "ANTHOLOGY" to "FANZINE", is clicking on the "Verify" radio button. The entry is thoroughly complete -- I would say admirably so -- and all the details are accurate as far as I can see.

I don't understand why whoever entered the data (SFJuggler, apparently) didn't enter it as a primary verification, altho apparently it's because it was "from an examination copy". I do see in the instructions for Verification that an "examination copy" means "transient ownership", but I don't understand why this is important. Not trying to argue here, but if I borrowed a copy from a friend and got the details from that, I don't see why that would be any less of a primary source than a copy I actually own. Perhaps it's because I might not be able to check at a later date if questions arise?

Also, am I entering my questions in the right place in this forum? Should I be using a different discussion thread?

Lensman03 (talk) 21:14, 19 April 2024 (EDT)

Hi. This is the right place to ask. Taking your questions in order:

• Anthology-vs-Fanzine? -- I am not best qualified to answer, but "fanzine" would normally be for something akin to a magazine, with multiple issues, typically on some regular (or irregular) basis. As a one-time publication, a program book would not be that. But I am inclined to think that "anthology" is not correct, either. ISFDB uses ANTHOLOGY for compilations of fiction, possibly augmented with some non-fiction (essays and the like). I would expect a program book to be mostly non-fiction (schedules, bios, photos, blurbs, etc.) possibly augmented with some fiction. For compilations of non-fiction, we use NONFICTION. If something were labeled "program book" but in actuality was primarily a compilation of fiction provided to program-goers, only then would ANTHOLOGY be appropriate. This search gives you examples of NONFICTION program books. This search gives you examples of ANTHOLOGY program books. You can see how they differ. You can also inquire of primary verifiers why they chose one type versus the other.
• To Primary Verify? -- Please do, by all means, regardless of whether you find any changes are needed. Making yourself a Primary Verifier means you have the publication and have checked the information in the record against the copy you have. It helps us all to know that a record has been checked against an actual copy.
• Permanent vs. Transient verification? -- Both permanent and transient verifications are "primary" and are equally good/valid. As I said above, knowing someone compared the record to an actual copy is very important. Your intuition about why we have both is correct. "Permanent" means you have a copy and anticipate continuing to have it, which in turn means other editors can expect to be able to ask you questions about your copy and that you can check and provide answers. "Transient" means you only had a copy temporarily and although you have checked the record against that copy, you will not have the copy available in the future and will not be able to answer questions about it.

I hope that helps. --MartyD (talk) 17:23, 21 April 2024 (EDT)

varianting: child/parent question

I'm editing this publication, with a lot of work still to do. The Westminster Gazette newspaper published 54 of Wells's essays prior to this edition's date (post-September 1924). 34 of the original titles have been reused, but 20 have been re-titled, for example:

Westminster Gazette printed Importance of China on 1924-04-26.

Fisher Unwin has, p.170, the same essay as China: The Land Out of the Limelight.

Reading the Asimov example (point 5.) in the Help, I think I should make the Fisher Unwin title the parent and variant the Gazette title (even though that was first). Would that be correct? I have two other, different editions which use the Fisher Unwin title as is (i.e. 'better known' as). Thanks, Kev. --BanjoKev (talk) 16:28, 22 April 2024 (EDT)

Any help would be appreciated, thanks. Kev. --BanjoKev (talk) 21:18, 27 April 2024 (EDT)

As the linked Help page says, "When in doubt, pick the title used on the first published version of the story". Later titles are only used as canonical titles if they are much better known, as is the case with the Asimov example. The essays in question are fairly obscure, so even if one of the later titles is marginally better known than the original one, the difference is unlikely to be significant. Ahasuerus (talk) 12:06, 28 April 2024 (EDT)

Very helpful oversight, I'll proceed as suggested, thanks! Kev.--BanjoKev (talk) 12:48, 28 April 2024 (EDT)

Page-counting artwork

I read the help:screen:newpub and the ['Help:How to determine the value for the "Pages" field in a book', but did not find what to do when a book has the internal artwork on unnumbered pages. For example, I have here a book where the novel ends on page 122, and contains 4 "out-of-text" full-page illustrations, each on an unnumbered sheet with a completely blank unnumbered verso. If the rule "Don't use the count of all sheets of paper in a book" applies also to this case, the page count remains 122, but if I consider the artwork "material which needs to be entered as part of the contents of the book" the page count could become "122+4" or "122+8". Whatever the field content, I would explain the situation in the Pub Notes. What would you recommend? thanks! --Fantagufo (talk) 05:57, 24 April 2024 (EDT)

Good find! Here is an almost good example of how it can be done (almost good because this is a magazine for which all pages are to be taken into account, including the covers - which is different to other book length title types; but for the internal illustrations this should work): see this view of the 'Publication Editor'. Hope that helps! Christian Stonecreek (talk) 06:22, 24 April 2024 (EDT)

Thank you Christian! It's a bit more complicated than I expected (actually, I was planning to adopt the 'artwork single author' option recommended in Template:TitleFields:TitleType) but let's try the 'polaris' way as a useful exercise. Here is the result (unfortunately there is no preview of submissions). How does it look? Luca --Fantagufo (talk) 08:15, 24 April 2024 (EDT)

WHOOOPS! After all this... I left the page field at '122'. should have been "122+[4]", right? --Fantagufo (talk) 08:20, 24 April 2024 (EDT)

Looks good, but you're right: the page count should be 122+[4]. Christian Stonecreek (talk) 08:54, 24 April 2024 (EDT)