Difference between revisions of "User talk:Ahasuerus"

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See [[User talk:Ahasuerus/Archive]] for discussions prior to 2021.
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See [[User talk:Ahasuerus/Archive]] for discussions prior to 2024.
  
 
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== Weird link renaming ==
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== Corrupted publication record ==
  
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On [http://www.isfdb.org/cgi-bin/ea.cgi?258280 this] artist entry, the link to [http://www.asahi-net.or.jp/~jh7a-sezk/ this site] is renamed "A. E. van Vogt Cover Art Gallery". Will you figure out why, because it's definitely not anything to do with van Vogt. :) ···[[User:Nihonjoe|<font color="darkgreen">日本穣</font>]] · <small>[[Special:Contributions/Nihonjoe|<font color="blue">投稿</font>]] · [[User talk:Nihonjoe|Talk to Nihonjoe]]</small> 15:36, 22 January 2021 (EST)
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I saw [https://www.isfdb.org/cgi-bin/pl.cgi?589785 this one] on one of the cleanup reports. The software will not allow corrections. Do we need to create a new publication record and delete this one? [[User:Scifibones|<b>John</b> <small>Scifibones</small>]] 08:53, 27 January 2024 (EST)
  
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: Let's see...
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: Could you please clarify what you mean by "the software will not allow corrections"? The External ID field had a very long URL (instead of an ID), which distorted the display in some browsers, but I could still access the "Edit" link by scrolling to the right in Firefox. I then found the right PORBASE ID and replaced the long URL with it. It seems to have fixed the issue. Does it look OK now? [[User:Ahasuerus|Ahasuerus]] ([[User talk:Ahasuerus|talk]]) 10:28, 27 January 2024 (EST)
  
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: The base URL of the "A. E. van Vogt Cover Art Gallery" is [http://www.asahi-net.or.jp/~we8y-mrt/vanvogt/ www.asahi-net.or.jp/~we8y-mrt/vanvogt/]. The base URL of "Suhano Tobe's Web Site" is [http://www.asahi-net.or.jp/~jh7a-sezk/ www.asahi-net.or.jp/~jh7a-sezk/]. Our software assumes that anything hosted by "www.asahi-net.or.jp" must be a part of "A. E. van Vogt Cover Art Gallery", which is apparently not true. Let me see what I can do... [[User:Ahasuerus|Ahasuerus]] 15:54, 22 January 2021 (EST)
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:: When I entered the correct PORBASE ID, It reverted back to the incorrect previous link when looking at the Proposed Publication Update Submission' screen. As a result, I cancelled the edit. Not sure why that didn't happen to you. Regardless, it is correct now.  
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::P.S. It probably was allowing the change but the proposed changes column was likely off my screen. Thanks, [[User:Scifibones|<b>John</b> <small>Scifibones</small>]] 12:37, 27 January 2024 (EST)
  
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:: And fixed! [[User:Ahasuerus|Ahasuerus]] 16:22, 22 January 2021 (EST)
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::: Oh, I see. I vaguely recall experimenting with HTML tables to ensure that they wouldn't do this at some resolutions, but I think I ran into various technical issues and catch-22s. [[User:Ahasuerus|Ahasuerus]] ([[User talk:Ahasuerus|talk]]) 13:44, 27 January 2024 (EST)
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:::Thanks! Yeah, "www.asahi-net.or.jp" is an ISP, so there are likely many thousands of sites on it. ···[[User:Nihonjoe|<font color="darkgreen">日本穣</font>]] · <small>[[Special:Contributions/Nihonjoe|<font color="blue">投稿</font>]] · [[User talk:Nihonjoe|Talk to Nihonjoe]]</small> 13:49, 25 January 2021 (EST)
 
  
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== Man from U.N.C.L.E. publication dates. ==
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== Human-Machines ==
  
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You may have noticed that I took the Reginald number off of two publications in The Man from U.N.C.L.E. series which you have verified.  I did this because the number in Reginald refers to the UK edition for these two publications which appeared before the US Ace editions. While looking at these two records, I noticed that they both have a note that states that the pub date is from the copyright and that the date is likely incorrect because of the catalog number.  Reginald, in the Series Index, lists both the UK and the US ordering of The Man from U.N.C.L.E. and while the main section gives the date and publisher of the first edition (UK), the listing for the US series does give the later publication date.  This is all a long way saying that Reginald indicates that the US edition of ''[http://www.isfdb.org/cgi-bin/pl.cgi?185749 The Power Cube Affair]'' was published in 1969 and ''[http://www.isfdb.org/cgi-bin/pl.cgi?185741 The Corfu Affair]'' was published in 1970.  I checked the rest of the series and Reginald has the US editions of  ''[http://www.isfdb.org/cgi-bin/pl.cgi?185745 The Unfair Fare Affair]'' published in 1969; ''[http://www.isfdb.org/cgi-bin/pl.cgi?185737 The Thinking Machine Affair]'' in 1970; and ''[http://www.isfdb.org/cgi-bin/pl.cgi?185757 The Finger In The Sky Affair]'' in 1971.  The others all appear to have the correct date for the Ace printings.  You're the only active verifier for these publications.  Thanks. --Ron ~ [[User:Rtrace|Rtrace]]<sup>[[User talk:Rtrace|Talk]]</sup> 14:22, 23 January 2021 (EST)
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https://www.isfdb.org/cgi-bin/pl.cgi?17511; Archive.org cover has a price sticker so you may want to find another image to replace the unstable Amazon one that's there now. --[[User:Username|Username]] ([[User talk:Username|talk]]) 18:22, 2 February 2024 (EST)
  
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: The 5 linked pubs have been updated. Many thanks! [[User:Ahasuerus|Ahasuerus]] 15:46, 23 January 2021 (EST)
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: Updated, thanks. [[User:Ahasuerus|Ahasuerus]] ([[User talk:Ahasuerus|talk]]) 18:33, 2 February 2024 (EST)
  
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== The Compleat Werewolf and Other Stories of Fantasy and Science Fiction ==
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== Hidden World ==
  
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You're the PV on [http://www.isfdb.org/cgi-bin/mod/pv_update.cgi?4910725 this one]. Is the submitted cover correct? The submitter is just guessing, based on their comments. ···[[User:Nihonjoe|<font color="darkgreen">日本穣</font>]] · <small>[[Special:Contributions/Nihonjoe|<font color="blue">投稿</font>]] · [[User talk:Nihonjoe|Talk to Nihonjoe]]</small> 14:09, 14 February 2021 (EST)
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https://www.isfdb.org/cgi-bin/view_submission.cgi?5884849; PDF, cover, Mantong. --[[User:Username|Username]] ([[User talk:Username|talk]]) 23:14, 7 February 2024 (EST)
  
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: After checking my copy I can confirm that it is indeed the correct cover. Lucky us! :) [[User:Ahasuerus|Ahasuerus]] 21:23, 14 February 2021 (EST)
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: Approved, thanks. [[User:Ahasuerus|Ahasuerus]] ([[User talk:Ahasuerus|talk]]) 08:56, 8 February 2024 (EST)
  
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:: It was me who submitted that cover. --[[User:Username|Username]] 12:09, 15 February 2021 (EST)
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== Deryni Magic Question ==
  
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:::Ahasuerus, I left it in the [http://www.isfdb.org/cgi-bin/mod/pv_update.cgi?4910725 queue] for you, as the submission has a comment in the note-to-the-moderator about dates, and I see more info has been provided here, too.  You're the only PV, so I think it would be best if you reviewed and processed it.  --[[User:MartyD|MartyD]] 12:26, 15 February 2021 (EST)
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Hi Ahasuerus -
  
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:::: Thanks, I'll take a look. [[User:Ahasuerus|Ahasuerus]] 16:32, 15 February 2021 (EST)
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[[User:Anniemod|Annie]] has posed [[User talk:Rtrace#Deryni_Magic|this question]] on my talk page.  I found that original edits may may have been yours back in 2006.  Could you take a peek when you have a moment (and if you can remember why you did something 18 years ago!).  Thanks. --Ron ~ [[User:Rtrace|Rtrace]]<sup>[[User talk:Rtrace|Talk]]</sup> 21:18, 13 February 2024 (EST)
  
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::::: I have approved the submission, updated Notes and changed the date from 1990 to 0000. Thanks! [[User:Ahasuerus|Ahasuerus]] 11:28, 16 February 2021 (EST)
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: Done. Thanks for the ping. [[User:Ahasuerus|Ahasuerus]] ([[User talk:Ahasuerus|talk]]) 22:49, 13 February 2024 (EST)
  
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== Bill Breedlove and Publishers Export Co. ==
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== What we enter in the "Artist" field ==
  
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I noticed a 1967 novel on Bill Breedlove's ISFDB page, Devil Sex, which is by a man who wrote articles for magazines under the name William Breedlove, and I don't think he's related to the Bill Breedlove who started publishing stories 20 years later and runs Dark Arts Books. [--[[User:Username|Username]] 12:09, 15 February 2021 (EST)
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Ahasuerus: The table 'What we enter in the "Artist" field' which you created in your post 11:33, 19 February 2024 (EST) under [https://www.isfdb.org/wiki/index.php/Rules_and_standards_discussions#Secondary_source_artist_credit_in_face_of_credit_change_over_time this thread] is very useful. It is much easier to follow and understand than the wording under bullet point "Artist" in [[Template:PublicationFields:CoverArt]]. I recently referred to the table for a separate issue about cover artists [https://isfdb.org/wiki/index.php/User_talk:GlennMcG#Theodore_Sturgeon_.2F_Beyond here].
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Could you please add the table to the help page. [[User:Teallach|Teallach]] ([[User talk:Teallach|talk]]) 17:04, 24 February 2024 (EST)
  
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: The author's Web page has his photos as of 2005-2006. He certainly doesn't look like he was born in the 1940s or earlier, which he would have to be in order to have published a book in 1967. Besides, it was probably a pseudonym anyway. I have disambiguated the name and added a note. Thanks! [[User:Ahasuerus|Ahasuerus]] 12:22, 16 February 2021 (EST)
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: Thanks for the reminder! I have been sick most of the last week and didn't want to touch Rules and Standards discussions until I was back up to 100%. Once I feel better, I'll make sure to check on the R&S page that it's OK to add the table to Help. Thanks. [[User:Ahasuerus|Ahasuerus]] ([[User talk:Ahasuerus|talk]]) 17:50, 24 February 2024 (EST)
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::No problem. There is no hurry. I am sorry to hear you have been unwell and wish you a speedy recovery. [[User:Teallach|Teallach]] ([[User talk:Teallach|talk]]) 12:47, 25 February 2024 (EST)
  
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While deciding what to do about this, I noticed Devil Sex didn't have a price or cover so I checked and only Goodreads had one, which had the price clearly displayed, so I entered it. Someone scrawled a big number on the cover so a better one is needed for ISFDB. [--[[User:Username|Username]] 12:09, 15 February 2021 (EST)
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::: Thank you! [[User:Ahasuerus|Ahasuerus]] ([[User talk:Ahasuerus|talk]]) 13:20, 25 February 2024 (EST)
  
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: I have approved the submission and added a note. Thanks! [[User:Ahasuerus|Ahasuerus]] 12:23, 16 February 2021 (EST)
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== Image backups ==
  
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Then I noticed the publisher, PEC, and saw online it stood for Publishers Export Corporation (or Company depending on where you look). There was 1 book by that publisher on ISFDB, Swap Academy, [http://www.isfdb.org/cgi-bin/pl.cgi?48195], which you PV'd, which has no cover and a date of 1970. However, [https://www.iguide.net/160116_item_sawp_academy__greg_stevens__pec_giant_g1205_1969.html] has it as 1969 with a different catalog ID. I nearly didn't find that page because they misspelled "swap". Also, I found exactly 1 book on picclick, Historic Orgies (1968), which shows a copyright page for this publisher and it says "Publishers Export Co., Inc.", which would agree with the note on ISFDB that says P.E.C, Inc. So I know Swap Academy is very rare but date and publisher name might need fixing, and maybe Devil Sex and Swap Academy should be on the same publisher page. Also, I found an archived 2008 discussion on ISFDB about not safe for work images which includes the cover for Swap Academy, [http://www.isfdb.org/wiki/index.php/Image:SWPAC1970.jpg]. [--[[User:Username|Username]] 12:09, 15 February 2021 (EST)
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Hi,
  
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: After checking my copy, I updated [http://www.isfdb.org/cgi-bin/pl.cgi?48195 the ISFDB record] with more details. The stated copyright date is 1970, but it's conceivable that the book was published in late 1969. I'll leave it as 1970 until we find more information. The stated catalog ID is G-1201; it's possible that a later printing appeared as G-1205, but we'll need more data before we can create a separate publication record for it.
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I see you updated the downloads page to note that image backups are being redone. This reminds me of something that's puzzled me for a while, and which I meant to ask you about months (years?) ago.
  
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: I have standardized the publisher name ("Publisher's Export Company") of ''Swap Academy'' and ''Devil Sex'' and added a note and a Web page link to the publisher page. Thanks! [[User:Ahasuerus|Ahasuerus]] 13:01, 16 February 2021 (EST)
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Am I right in thinking that when those zips are generated, it's not an incremental backup style thing where you just need to download the changes/deltas, but rather that they are completely regenerated, and that you'd have to download the full set of zips to have an accurate and complete collection?  I vaguely recall that at some point in the past, I'd been downloading the zips in a fairly leisurely manner over a period of days/weeks, and had got maybe 80% of the way through them, and then the zips were regenerated, and I assumed that I had to restart the set.
  
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Found this, [https://archive.org/details/pandabearpassion00hitt], and copyright page has same publisher name but different address than the one in Swap Academy. Guess they moved. If only someone could find a hint of genre content in this book so PANDA BEAR PASSION can be entered on ISFDB! --[[User:Username|Username]] 13:00, 16 February 2021 (EST)
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Would it be possible to have a bit more information on the download page about how they work?  NB: I haven't actually ever done anything with the zips I downloaded - I rarely run the full Apache website locally, which I imagine is the main intended use case for the image backups - but I always thought they had the potential to be the foundation of an interesting project. Thanks! [[User:ErsatzCulture|ErsatzCulture]] ([[User talk:ErsatzCulture|talk]]) 04:35, 5 March 2024 (EST)
  
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Found this, [http://www.isfdb.org/cgi-bin/publisher.cgi?56353], which is related to the above. --[[User:Username|Username]] 01:30, 27 February 2021 (EST)
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: That's right: the images hosted by Google Drive are a complete copy of the images hosted by the live ISFDB server. I have added a few more details to the description. Does it make more sense now? [[User:Ahasuerus|Ahasuerus]] ([[User talk:Ahasuerus|talk]]) 14:31, 5 March 2024 (EST)
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:: Thanks. What you've added makes sense, but it's still not clear (to me at least) from the text there that the directories all get updated when new zips are created. Are the 0-9/a-f (and the 2 digit subdirectories) just arbitrary hex digits, maybe the first digits of a checksum or something like that?  (That question is slightly rhetorical; I imagine I could find the answer out for myself if I looked through the source code.)
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:: If the tarballs had date suffixes, similar to the database backups, then I think that would make it more obvious that the full set needs re-downloading. However, I guess the downside of that is that it would break any existing tooling for downloading the image backups, and that if you weren't careful you might end up with multiple dated tarballs and/or image directories. [[User:ErsatzCulture|ErsatzCulture]] ([[User talk:ErsatzCulture|talk]]) 18:25, 5 March 2024 (EST)
  
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: I have merged the publisher records and updated the affected pubs' Notes to clarify what different secondary sources state. Thanks! [[User:Ahasuerus|Ahasuerus]] 20:13, 27 February 2021 (EST)
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::: Oh, oh... OK, I think I see what the problem is. "0-9" and "a-f" are subdirectory names created by the MediWiki software to store uploaded images. I am so used to this naming convention that it never occurred to me that it may be confusing. A blind spot, if you will. Let me edit the page and explain the naming convention. Thanks! [[User:Ahasuerus|Ahasuerus]] ([[User talk:Ahasuerus|talk]]) 19:15, 5 March 2024 (EST)
  
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I've recently started using Bookscans.com and have added a ton of covers here, including Devil Sex and Swap Academy. However, their site says the ID for Devil Sex is SP13, not PEC 13, --[[User:Username|Username]] 00:33, 6 April 2021 (EDT)
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:::: Ha, I think this is also a blind spot on my part.  Because I don't generally upload my own images (I think it must be in single digits) I forgot that that is all handled by the Mediawiki side of things, and it didn't cross my mind that the directory structure of the images was something that wasn't part of the core ISFDB code. Thanks for clarifying! [[User:ErsatzCulture|ErsatzCulture]] ([[User talk:ErsatzCulture|talk]]) 05:31, 6 March 2024 (EST)
  
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: Re: "Devil Sex", the [http://www.isfdb.org/cgi-bin/pl.cgi?704234 cover that we currently link to] has "sPECial 13" -- with "PEC" highlighted -- in the top right corner. I suspect that the person who created the Bookscans.com record assumed that the first two letters were the catalog ID, but it's possible that there is another ID on the spine. I have updated the record. [[User:Ahasuerus|Ahasuerus]] 10:24, 6 April 2021 (EDT)
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== New hotlink site permission ==
  
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and their cover for Swap Academy is censored with black bars over the woman's breasts and butt. Is your copy censored and, if not, is there a way for you to upload your cover? --[[User:Username|Username]] 00:33, 6 April 2021 (EDT)
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We have permission to hotlink cover images to a new site, possibly. You can see it [https://www.isfdb.org/wiki/index.php?title=User_talk%3ALawDagstine&type=revision&diff=682322&oldid=682319 here]. If that is sufficient, can we add it to the list? ···[[User:Nihonjoe|<font color="darkgreen">日本穣</font>]] · <small>[[Special:Contributions/Nihonjoe|<font color="blue">投稿</font>]] · [[User talk:Nihonjoe|Talk to Nihonjoe]]</small> 13:18, 21 March 2024 (EDT)
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:In anticipation of this being acceptable, there is [https://www.isfdb.org/cgi-bin/pl.cgi?1000727 one publication] that is currently hotlinking to the site. ···[[User:Nihonjoe|<font color="darkgreen">日本穣</font>]] · <small>[[Special:Contributions/Nihonjoe|<font color="blue">投稿</font>]] · [[User talk:Nihonjoe|Talk to Nihonjoe]]</small> 13:29, 21 March 2024 (EDT)
  
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: Since the 2008 discussion about linking explicit images was inconclusive, I have updated the record with the scan that I uploaded to the Wiki back then. Thanks for the heads up! [[User:Ahasuerus|Ahasuerus]] 10:29, 6 April 2021 (EDT)
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:: All done. The [https://www.isfdb.org/cgi-bin/pl.cgi?1000727 publication page] now credits "Lawrence Dagstine". [[Template:Image Host Sites]] has been updated. Thanks. [[User:Ahasuerus|Ahasuerus]] ([[User talk:Ahasuerus|talk]]) 15:58, 21 March 2024 (EDT)
  
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== Leinster's The Last Space Ship ==
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:::Thanks! ···[[User:Nihonjoe|<font color="darkgreen">日本穣</font>]] · <small>[[Special:Contributions/Nihonjoe|<font color="blue">投稿</font>]] · [[User talk:Nihonjoe|Talk to Nihonjoe]]</small> 17:12, 21 March 2024 (EDT)
  
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Hi
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== Place Submission on Hold ==
  
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We have two publication records for the Fell edition of ''The Last Space Ship'', [http://www.isfdb.org/cgi-bin/pl.cgi?42862 one] of which you've verified. That record has a note that there is no stated publication date. The [http://www.isfdb.org/cgi-bin/pl.cgi?531560 other] record notes a stated publication date of November 1949.  Happily, I also found a [https://hdl.handle.net/2027/uva.x000380434?urlappend=%3Bseq=8 scan] that verifies the date appears on the copyright page.  Could you double check that your copy doesn't have a stated date. If so, I think we should probably change that publication to an unknown date and move the many of the secondary verifications to the other copy. I'm happy to handle that, but you've done the Tuck verification, so I'll leave that one to you.  I'm also checking with [[User:Biomassbob|Bob]] as he has also verified the copy.  Of course, if both your copies actually have the publication date, we just need to combine the two records. Thanks for checking. --Ron ~ [[User:Rtrace|Rtrace]]<sup>[[User talk:Rtrace|Talk]]</sup> 09:27, 28 February 2021 (EST)
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After placing a submission on hold, it would be nice if the resultant page had links back to the submission - both the moderator view and the public view. Currently, it only has a link to the Submission List. But usually when I put something on hold, it is because I plan to do something with that submission. Yes, I can just hit the back button to get the moderator view again. But I often want the public view so I can include the link in a question to the submitter so having that on the on hold page would save a click. Thanks. --&nbsp;[[User:JLaTondre|JLaTondre]] ([[User talk:JLaTondre#top|talk]]) 10:21, 24 March 2024 (EDT)
  
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: Unfortunately, my copy of ''The Last Space Ship'' is in the part of my collection which was boxed in 2015 and I can't get to it :-( I really need to do something about that... [[User:Ahasuerus|Ahasuerus]] 10:26, 28 February 2021 (EST)
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: Thanks, I'll take a look. [[User:Ahasuerus|Ahasuerus]] ([[User talk:Ahasuerus|talk]]) 10:45, 24 March 2024 (EDT)
  
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::I see Bob found his copy. I've moved the appropriate verifications, except for Tuck.  I've left that slot open on the first printing. Thanks. --Ron ~ [[User:Rtrace|Rtrace]]<sup>[[User talk:Rtrace|Talk]]</sup> 12:39, 28 February 2021 (EST)
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:: Done. Hopefully, the layout and the colors look OK. [[User:Ahasuerus|Ahasuerus]] ([[User talk:Ahasuerus|talk]]) 18:07, 24 March 2024 (EDT)
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:::Thank you! Looks fine. --&nbsp;[[User:JLaTondre|JLaTondre]] ([[User talk:JLaTondre#top|talk]]) 18:52, 24 March 2024 (EDT)
  
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== Rip Van Winkle ==
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:::: Great! [[User:Ahasuerus|Ahasuerus]] ([[User talk:Ahasuerus|talk]]) 19:00, 24 March 2024 (EDT)
  
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There is something wrong associated with the yellow warning message for the cover on [http://www.isfdb.org/cgi-bin/view_submission.cgi?4928335 this import content submission]. It says the publication tag should be GRLSGDTVMP2003. However, I added the image from the publication upload link. And if you go to {{P|826515|publication}} and click the "Upload new cover scan", the resultant file is RPVNWNKLTX1894.jpg. So something is not consistent. Thanks. --&nbsp;[[User:JLaTondre|JLaTondre]] ([[User talk:JLaTondre#top|talk]]) 17:50, 3 March 2021 (EST)
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== Galactic Central  ==
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:Possibly related: I've seen this with a few author photos I've uploaded, even though there isn't a link to upload an author photo on the author page itself, and even though (as far as I know) there's no way to even know what the internal tag is for an author. It's only started happening in the last several days for me. I wonder if some recent update tweaked something? ···[[User:Nihonjoe|<font color="darkgreen">日本穣</font>]] · <small>[[Special:Contributions/Nihonjoe|<font color="blue">投稿</font>]] · [[User talk:Nihonjoe|Talk to Nihonjoe]]</small> 19:24, 3 March 2021 (EST)
 
  
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:: It's a recently discovered issue with this type of yellow warnings -- see {{Bug|765}}, "Entering an author image URL can generate a spurious yellow warning". The way the submission display software is designed, there is no easy way for the code to distinguish between author images and publication images. I may need to remove this warning until the software is made smart enough to distinguish between the two types of images. [[User:Ahasuerus|Ahasuerus]] 21:58, 3 March 2021 (EST)
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Given that the ISFDB is currently heavily dependent on Galactic Central images (12k publication images as of last database dump) and they seem to be in no hurry to implement HTTPS, --&nbsp;[[User:JLaTondre|JLaTondre]] ([[User talk:JLaTondre#top|talk]]) 13:52, 3 April 2024 (EDT)
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:::My issue was a publication image and not an author image. The import screen is using the wrong publication ID in its validation logic. --&nbsp;[[User:JLaTondre|JLaTondre]] ([[User talk:JLaTondre#top|talk]]) 16:35, 4 March 2021 (EST)
 
  
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:::: Oh, I see. Sorry about the confusion! I'll take a closer look. [[User:Ahasuerus|Ahasuerus]] 17:17, 4 March 2021 (EST)
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: Last I heard the owner had no plans to convert to HTTPS. It's possible that his plans may change at some point since browser manufacturers continue to add restrictions to HTTP-only sites. [[User:Ahasuerus|Ahasuerus]] ([[User talk:Ahasuerus|talk]]) 14:08, 3 April 2024 (EDT)
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:::::You may have already figured this out, but it occurred to me what is happening in this case. GRLSGDTVMP2003 (the publication id it is checking against) equates to this {{P|GRLSGDTVMP2003|this pub}} which has a pub id of 91841. That number is the also title id of the {{T|91841|short story}} being imported in this edit. So the verification check is incorrectly using the short story title id instead of the chapbook pub id. --&nbsp;[[User:JLaTondre|JLaTondre]] ([[User talk:JLaTondre#top|talk]]) 09:05, 6 March 2021 (EST)
 
  
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:::::: Thanks! The logic appears to be working correctly for NewPub submissions, but it fails for Clone/Import/Export submissions. The software checks the value of the 'Record' element in the XML payload, but, as luck would have it, 'Record' has a different meaning in Clone/Import/Export submissions. Working on it... [[User:Ahasuerus|Ahasuerus]] 10:32, 6 March 2021 (EST)
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have you given consideration to implementing a proxy service?  Apache has a [https://httpd.apache.org/docs/2.4/mod/mod_proxy.html mod_proxy] module or it's pretty straightforward to implement your own[https://stackoverflow.com/questions/3011222/dealing-with-http-content-in-https-pages]. --&nbsp;[[User:JLaTondre|JLaTondre]] ([[User talk:JLaTondre#top|talk]]) 13:52, 3 April 2024 (EDT)
  
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::::::: Fixed -- see [http://www.isfdb.org/cgi-bin/view_submission.cgi?4928335 the original example]. Thanks for spotting the problem! [[User:Ahasuerus|Ahasuerus]] 10:54, 6 March 2021 (EST)
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: Thanks for letting me know about these options. I wasn't aware of them. I'll add it to my list of things to look into, but it's a long list, so I am not sure when I may get to it. [[User:Ahasuerus|Ahasuerus]] ([[User talk:Ahasuerus|talk]]) 14:08, 3 April 2024 (EDT)
  
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== Magazines with no Fiction Titles ==
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Or should we create a clean-up project to start moving these images over to the ISFDB wiki? --&nbsp;[[User:JLaTondre|JLaTondre]] ([[User talk:JLaTondre#top|talk]]) 13:52, 3 April 2024 (EDT)
  
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When marking a title as ignored on the [http://www.isfdb.org/cgi-bin/edit/cleanup_report.cgi?241 Magazines with no Fiction Titles] cleanup report, can it take you back to the subpage you were on instead of the "main" page? When ignoring multiple issues within a year, the current behavior is a pain. Thanks. --&nbsp;[[User:JLaTondre|JLaTondre]] ([[User talk:JLaTondre#top|talk]]) 12:10, 26 March 2021 (EDT)
+
: It would certainly make things easier, in part because of the HTTPS issue and in part because they would be incorporated into our publicly available backup files. However, 12K images is a lot images to migrate. Do we expect to have enough volunteer man-hours to make it feasible? [[User:Ahasuerus|Ahasuerus]] ([[User talk:Ahasuerus|talk]]) 14:08, 3 April 2024 (EDT)
−
: Yes, please! That is annoying. [[User:Anniemod|Annie]] 12:19, 26 March 2021 (EDT)
+
:: Part of the price of self-moderation? ../[[User:Holmesd|Doug H]] ([[User talk:Holmesd|talk]]) 21:53, 3 April 2024 (EDT)
 +
::I have been migrating them as I edit pubs that use them. It will be slow going, but the current broken images are not ISFDB user friendly. --&nbsp;[[User:JLaTondre|JLaTondre]] ([[User talk:JLaTondre#top|talk]]) 08:44, 6 April 2024 (EDT)
  
−
:: Done! [[User:Ahasuerus|Ahasuerus]] 14:22, 26 March 2021 (EDT)
+
::: I have created {{FR|1601}}, "Enhance display of HTTP-served images". [[User:Ahasuerus|Ahasuerus]] ([[User talk:Ahasuerus|talk]]) 10:44, 6 April 2024 (EDT)
−
:::Thank you! --&nbsp;[[User:JLaTondre|JLaTondre]] ([[User talk:JLaTondre#top|talk]]) 08:24, 27 March 2021 (EDT)
 
  
−
== Invalid Prices ==
+
== Baen ISBNs ==
  
−
Is it possible to put a yellow warning on invalid prices at submission? Something that would catch cases like [http://www.isfdb.org/cgi-bin/view_submission.cgi?4944780 this one]. That way they would be more likely to get fixed at submission instead of waiting on the cleanup report. Thanks. --&nbsp;[[User:JLaTondre|JLaTondre]] ([[User talk:JLaTondre#top|talk]]) 08:23, 27 March 2021 (EDT)
+
''{{p|998070 |Toll of Honor}}'' just came out, and we have the ISBN formatted as 978-1-982193-31-7. The back of the book as well as the copyright page have it formatted as 978-1-9821-9331-7. Do we need to look at the code that adds in the dashes? This may affect more than just Baen books. ···[[User:Nihonjoe|<font color="darkgreen">日本穣</font>]] · <small>[[Special:Contributions/Nihonjoe|<font color="blue">投稿</font>]] · [[User talk:Nihonjoe|Talk to Nihonjoe]]</small> 17:33, 5 April 2024 (EDT)
  
−
: Good point -- {{FR|1406}}, "Add a yellow warning for invalid prices", has been created. [[User:Ahasuerus|Ahasuerus]] 18:26, 27 March 2021 (EDT)
+
: Checking [https://www.isbn-international.org/range_file_generation the official "ISBN Ranges" page], I see that the hyphenation rules have changed and become more complex. It used to be that the rules for "978-0-" ISBNs had only 6 cases, but now it's up to 21. "978-1- ISBNs also used to have 6 cases, but now they are up to around 50 cases. Other language-specific ISBN rules have also been affected, although not as severely. Let me create a new FR for this change. Thanks for letting me know! [[User:Ahasuerus|Ahasuerus]] ([[User talk:Ahasuerus|talk]]) 17:55, 5 April 2024 (EDT)
  
−
:: Done -- see [http://www.isfdb.org/wiki/index.php/ISFDB:Community_Portal#Yellow_warning_for_prices this Community Portal announcement]. [[User:Ahasuerus|Ahasuerus]] 20:39, 26 May 2021 (EDT)
+
:: {{FR|1600}} "Update the ISBN hyphenation rules" has been created. [[User:Ahasuerus|Ahasuerus]] ([[User talk:Ahasuerus|talk]]) 18:02, 5 April 2024 (EDT)
  
−
== Series Names That May Need Disambiguation ==
+
::: And done -- see [https://isfdb.org/wiki/index.php/ISFDB:Community_Portal#ISBN_hyphenation_changed this Community Portal announcement]. [[User:Ahasuerus|Ahasuerus]] ([[User talk:Ahasuerus|talk]]) 14:08, 16 April 2024 (EDT)
  
−
When the series is a subseries of the reported match, I'm not sure we need it to show up on the "Series Names That May Need Disambiguation" report. Example: {{S|49075|Crónica de Tinieblas}} and {{S|50035|Crónica de Tinieblas (short fiction)}} were on the report (I ignored them). Since this is a pretty typical case, it could be skipped (though it is easy enough to ignore so low priority suggested change). --&nbsp;[[User:JLaTondre|JLaTondre]] ([[User talk:JLaTondre#top|talk]]) 08:42, 27 March 2021 (EDT)
+
== Murder in Millennium VI ==
  
−
: Another fair point. {{FR|1407}} has been created. [[User:Ahasuerus|Ahasuerus]] 18:43, 27 March 2021 (EDT)
+
Please see [https://www.isfdb.org/cgi-bin/view_submission.cgi?5896021 this edit] that impacts your verified pub. Let me know if you agree with changing the credit. Thanks. --&nbsp;[[User:JLaTondre|JLaTondre]] ([[User talk:JLaTondre#top|talk]]) 08:41, 6 April 2024 (EDT)
  
−
:: [http://www.isfdb.org/wiki/index.php/ISFDB:Community_Portal#.27Series_Names_That_May_Need_Disambiguation.27_enhanced Done]. [[User:Ahasuerus|Ahasuerus]] 22:03, 26 May 2021 (EDT)
+
: I don't have this issue handy right now, but the [https://archive.org/details/Dynamic_Science_Fiction_v01n03_1953-06_slpn/page/n65/mode/2up Archive.org copy] is readable. Here is what I see:
 +
:* The title page of the review column, "Readin' and Writhin'" (p.46), credits "Damon Knight and the Editor".
 +
:* There are three reviews. The first two, "Murder in Millennium VI" and "Seetee Ship", are not credited. The third one, "Beachheads in Space" on page 67, is signed "RWL".
 +
:* Of the three reviews, only "Murder in Millennium VI" was reprinted in Damon Knight's ''In Search of Wonder''.
 +
:* We currently credit "Damon Knight and Robert A. W. Lowndes" as the authors of the first two reviews and "RWL" as the author of the third review. We then variant them to their actual authors based on reprint history and textual research.
 +
:* The publication record has notes explaining who the actual authors are and what our evidence is, but individual REVIEW records do not.
 +
: Based on the above, how about we use "uncredited" as the author of the first two reviews instead of "Damon Knight and Robert A. W. Lowndes"? The current variants would remain in place, but we would copy explanatory notes from the publication record to each title record. What do you think? [[User:Ahasuerus|Ahasuerus]] ([[User talk:Ahasuerus|talk]]) 10:00, 6 April 2024 (EDT)
 +
::I pointed Swfritter to this discussion since he has also verified the pub. As you two are the verifiers, I will defer to you both, but your suggestion makes sense to me. --&nbsp;[[User:JLaTondre|JLaTondre]] ([[User talk:JLaTondre#top|talk]]) 10:08, 6 April 2024 (EDT)
 +
:::Sounds OK to me. Especially since there will be plenty of documentation.--[[User:Swfritter|swfritter]] ([[User talk:Swfritter|talk]]) 20:40, 6 April 2024 (EDT)
  
−
== Security Warnings ==
+
:::: OK, I think I [https://www.isfdb.org/cgi-bin/pl.cgi?102771 got it]. Thanks! [[User:Ahasuerus|Ahasuerus]] ([[User talk:Ahasuerus|talk]]) 23:37, 6 April 2024 (EDT)
 +
:::::Thanks. Original edit has been rejected with an explanation of the change. --&nbsp;[[User:JLaTondre|JLaTondre]] ([[User talk:JLaTondre#top|talk]]) 06:56, 7 April 2024 (EDT)
  
−
Please see [[User_talk:TempSECURITYFAULT|this discussion]]. As browser security warnings have gotten more stringent, I have to suspect that is impacting new user signups. --&nbsp;[[User:JLaTondre|JLaTondre]] ([[User talk:JLaTondre#top|talk]]) 08:45, 28 March 2021 (EDT)
+
== Wily Writers ==
  
−
: Thanks for the heads-up! When Al last surfaced a few months ago, he said that he was planning to concentrate on the HTTPS upgrade and the Wiki upgrade. Unfortunately, he hasn't been seen since then. I'll see if I can ping him. [[User:Ahasuerus|Ahasuerus]] 09:27, 28 March 2021 (EDT)
+
https://www.isfdb.org/cgi-bin/title.cgi?2112269; The web page link gave me a red warning for not being safe. Also, shouldn't title/variant be 2013, not 2014? --[[User:Username|Username]] ([[User talk:Username|talk]]) 19:10, 15 April 2024 (EDT)
 +
:It gives me a 403 error when I try to visit. There must be something going on with the server there. ···[[User:Nihonjoe|<font color="darkgreen">日本穣</font>]] · <small>[[Special:Contributions/Nihonjoe|<font color="blue">投稿</font>]] · [[User talk:Nihonjoe|Talk to Nihonjoe]]</small> 19:43, 15 April 2024 (EDT)
  
−
:: I have received an update from Al. He has been investigating, but it's more complicated than it looks. [[User:Ahasuerus|Ahasuerus]] 12:52, 5 April 2021 (EDT)
+
:: Apparently the "Wily Writers"' Web site died at some point in the late 2010s. Eventually it was picked up by someone else, but the new owners didn't configure their security certificate correctly, hence the security warning displayed by the browser. I have changed the dates from 2014 to 2013 and replaced the affected links with Wayback machine versions. Thanks for the heads-up. [[User:Ahasuerus|Ahasuerus]] ([[User talk:Ahasuerus|talk]]) 20:23, 15 April 2024 (EDT)
  
−
== Advanced Search Request ==
+
== How Far Alongside Night? ==
  
−
Greetings, Is it possible to add more lines in the selection criteria screen? There have been times I have needed to merge more than six titles. Since I am not a moderator, I have to wait for approval of each merge before I can submit the next one. Most elegant solution would be for the user to be able to continuously add  search lines as needed. Thanks for your consideration. John, [[User:Scifibones|Scifibones]] 10:50, 27 April 2021 (EDT)
+
https://www.isfdb.org/cgi-bin/pl.cgi?428089; I have some edits adding archived links to the Crown and Ace editions of Alongside Night and another adding afterword mentioned in '87 Avon edition's note; searching for the name Konkin and not finding anything I then noticed you entered the essay in this 2013 edition but name is Konklin (as it also is for another essay). So I think after approval the 2 essays should be merged under the name Konkin; the '99 Pulpless edition is on Google Books and it says Samuel Edward Konkin, III so that's how I entered it, not having any copies or photos of the Avon to verify (no page number, of course). --[[User:Username|Username]] ([[User talk:Username|talk]]) 09:39, 20 April 2024 (EDT)
  
−
: Thanks for reporting the problem! Originally, Advanced Search pages were limited to three rows and supported a small number of searchable fields. When I last redesigned Advanced Search, I thought that six rows whould be sufficient in the vast majority of cases, but it looks like it's not always true.
+
: It was, indeed, a typo. Everything has been approved and merged. I have moved the URL associated with the essay to the Title record and updated Konkin's author page with biographical data and links. Thanks. [[User:Ahasuerus|Ahasuerus]] ([[User talk:Ahasuerus|talk]]) 13:29, 20 April 2024 (EDT)
  
−
: As you said, the most elegant way to address the issue would be to allow adding an unlimited number of search lines. Unfortunately, it wouldn't be viable because:
+
== Space Viking ==
−
:* each search value is added to the resulting URL, and
 
−
:* URLs with more than 2,000 characters can't be correctly processed by some older browsers and even by some servers.
 
−
: Bumping the number of rows to 10 is probably the easiest and least impactful compromise solution, at least until older browsers with their 2K limitations are a distant memory. Let me [http://www.isfdb.org/wiki/index.php/ISFDB:Community_Portal#Increasing_the_number_of_Advanced_Search_rows_from_6_to_10.3F ask on the Community Portal].
 
  
−
: Oh, and are you familiar with "Show All Titles" in the navigation bar displayed on Summary pages? It lets you merge a bunch of titles for a single author, which may help depending on your use case. [[User:Ahasuerus|Ahasuerus]] 21:24, 27 April 2021 (EDT)
+
Adding cover artist, notes and external IDs to your PVd [https://www.isfdb.org/cgi-bin/pl.cgi?31466 Space Vikings].10:59, 21 April 2024 (EDT) {{unsigned|SFJuggler}}
−
:: Advanced Search is really the best tool for the purpose I have in mind. Many times we have myriad title records for the same map or drawing, when it occurs in multiple volumes in a series. I try to clean this up as I encounter them. I'll post a comment on the Community Portal. Thank you John, [[User:Scifibones|Scifibones]] 07:18, 28 April 2021 (EDT)
 
  
−
::: Done -- please see [http://www.isfdb.org/wiki/index.php/ISFDB:Community_Portal#Increasing_the_number_of_Advanced_Search_rows_from_6_to_10.3F my last Community Portal response]. [[User:Ahasuerus|Ahasuerus]] 15:18, 3 May 2021 (EDT)
+
: I have approved the submission and expanded the Notes section. One thing to keep in mind is that the dates listed in early Catalog of Copyright volumes are actually "dates of publication as given in the application". It's possible for the actual publication date to be different due to printer- or publisher-originated delays, so I find it useful to add the phrase "date of publication as given in the application" to the Notes field. I have updated the Title record as well. (Later Catalog of Copyright volumes distinguish between "Date of Publication" and "Registration Date", but that's a different kettle of fish.) Thanks! [[User:Ahasuerus|Ahasuerus]] ([[User talk:Ahasuerus|talk]]) 12:45, 21 April 2024 (EDT)
  
−
== WatchDate report not working? ==
+
== Weird series ordering ==
  
−
[http://www.isfdb.org/cgi-bin/pl.cgi?720942 This pub] has the { { WatchDate } } template in its Notes. However, it doesn't show up [http://www.isfdb.org/cgi-bin/edit/cleanup_report.cgi?295 in the report].
+
On [https://www.isfdb.org/cgi-bin/pe.cgi?29172 this series], it's not numbering them in order as it ought to. Any ideas why it's switching things around? ···[[User:Nihonjoe|<font color="darkgreen">日本穣</font>]] · <small>[[Special:Contributions/Nihonjoe|<font color="blue">投稿</font>]] · [[User talk:Nihonjoe|Talk to Nihonjoe]]</small> 14:16, 24 April 2024 (EDT)
 +
: That looks like expected actually - titles and subseries do not mix in the series ordered views so you got all numbered Titles first followed by all numbered subseries. [[User:Anniemod|Annie]] ([[User talk:Anniemod|talk]]) 14:57, 24 April 2024 (EDT)
  
−
Querying Saturday's copy of the database:
+
:: That's exactly right. If the ISFDB software displayed numbered titles and numbered sub-series together, then we'd have anomalies like:
 +
::* Book #1
 +
::* Sub-series trilogy #1
 +
::** Book A
 +
::** Book B
 +
::** Book C
 +
::* Book #2
 +
::* Sub-series trilogy #2
 +
::** Book X
 +
::** Book Y
 +
::** Book Z
 +
::* Book #3
 +
:: That said, titles and sub-series currently use the same offset and font. Perhaps we should make them look different to facilitate distinguishing between the two type of elements that title series can contain. [[User:Ahasuerus|Ahasuerus]] ([[User talk:Ahasuerus|talk]]) 15:12, 24 April 2024 (EDT)
  
−
    select * from notes where note_note like '%{ {WatchDate} }%'; -- (remove the spaces between the curly parens)
+
:::From my view, if the subseries is ''numbered'' as part of the series, that numbering should be in order. I can see pushing subseries to the bottom of the main series if they aren't ''numbered'' as part of the series. That makes sense. But doing it so that the numbering is 1, 2, 3, 4, 6, 5, 7 doesn't make any sense and will likely cause confusion for anyone viewing the page because people generally expect numbered things to be in order. ···[[User:Nihonjoe|<font color="darkgreen">日本穣</font>]] · <small>[[Special:Contributions/Nihonjoe|<font color="blue">投稿</font>]] · [[User talk:Nihonjoe|Talk to Nihonjoe]]</small> 16:18, 24 April 2024 (EDT)
  
−
finds 7 matches, but only 4 records are shown in the report.  I note that of the 7 matches, 4 are "watchDate", 1 is "watchdate" and 2 (mine) are "WatchDate", which makes me wonder if it's maybe a case-sensitivity thing?  I've not looked at the code, but [https://sourceforge.net/p/isfdb/feature-requests/1400/ the ticket] implies that "WatchDate" is the "official" form:
+
(unindent)
 +
(I have moved the discussion of archive.org-derived information to [[ISFDB:Research_Assistance#Moribito_series]]). [[User:Ahasuerus|Ahasuerus]] ([[User talk:Ahasuerus|talk]]) 20:16, 24 April 2024 (EDT)
  
−
    Create a 'WatchDate' template and a corresponding cleanup report.
+
After mulling it over and running a few database searches, I am beginning to suspect that we may have two different scenarios here. The first one can be seen on [https://www.isfdb.org/cgi-bin/pe.cgi?26381 this Series page] for {{A|Jonathan Maberry}}'s ''Pine Deep''. The original trilogy (2006-2008) is numbered 1-3. There is a follow-up series, [https://www.isfdb.org/cgi-bin/pe.cgi?58892 ''Monk Addison''], which an editor tried to configure -- cumulatively -- as number 4 in the main series. It didn't work too well because the sub-series appears after various unnumbered short fictions titles within the main series.
  
−
Or is the report maybe showing old data? [[User:ErsatzCulture|ErsatzCulture]] 12:42, 28 April 2021 (EDT)
+
The second scenario can be found [https://www.isfdb.org/cgi-bin/pe.cgi?7597 here]. ''Gotrek and Felix'' consists of 17 novels and a few dozen works of short fiction. It also contains 3 sub-series for the 3 different omnibus editions of the main series. The sub-series are numbered 1, 2 and 3 and appear at the bottom of the page, i.e. after the short fiction. Unlike the ''Pine Deep'' scenario, this is, unambiguously, the expected behavior since the omnibus sub-series are not part of the main numbering scheme.
  
−
EDIT: That the template as I've used it in the linked pub gets replaced by the text message, would indicate that I've used it correctly, so maybe it's just the report not picking things up properly, or being updated? [[User:ErsatzCulture|ErsatzCulture]] 12:59, 28 April 2021 (EDT)
+
If my understanding is correct, then the ISFDB software currently supports the second scenario, but not the first one. Does this sound about right? [[User:Ahasuerus|Ahasuerus]] ([[User talk:Ahasuerus|talk]]) 20:32, 24 April 2024 (EDT)
 +
:Yes, that seems accurate. ···[[User:Nihonjoe|<font color="darkgreen">日本穣</font>]] · <small>[[Special:Contributions/Nihonjoe|<font color="blue">投稿</font>]] · [[User talk:Nihonjoe|Talk to Nihonjoe]]</small> 20:43, 24 April 2024 (EDT)
  
−
: Thanks, I'll take a look... [[User:Ahasuerus|Ahasuerus]] 14:03, 28 April 2021 (EDT)
+
:: I guess the next question is what we can do about this situation. Let me sleep on it... [[User:Ahasuerus|Ahasuerus]] ([[User talk:Ahasuerus|talk]]) 21:13, 24 April 2024 (EDT)
  
−
:: It turns out that it was a typo in the display code. Thanks for spotting the issue!
+
::: No bright ideas so far, I am afraid. I can't think of a way to accommodate these two different scenarios using the database fields that we currently have. Maybe something will germinate over the next few days. [[User:Ahasuerus|Ahasuerus]] ([[User talk:Ahasuerus|talk]]) 14:34, 25 April 2024 (EDT)
 +
:::: How about an obvious solution: add a flag/checkbox on the series page which tells the software if it needs to show series and titles mixed based on the numbers OR if they need to be kept separate? With the default being showing them separately (aka "things as they stand now"). [[User:Anniemod|Annie]] ([[User talk:Anniemod|talk]]) 17:32, 25 April 2024 (EDT)
 +
:::: PS: Oops. Did not see your note about using  existing DB fields. You know... maybe we can use the "Series Parent Position" creatively? Add a letter to the number if you want them to sort inside of the titles series (so instead of 1, use 1M (for mixed))? [[User:Anniemod|Annie]] ([[User talk:Anniemod|talk]]) 17:34, 25 April 2024 (EDT)
 +
:::: And we do not even need to show that weird numbering scheme to the editors - make that the DB field value but change the UI to actually show a checkbox. Or something along these lines. The only thing that may be a bit of a hassle is that this field is actually integer, right? So... add an big number to the actual value and drop it for sorting? So instead of 1, record 1001 (how many series we need that need 1000 as a number on the series order?). [[User:Anniemod|Annie]] ([[User talk:Anniemod|talk]]) 17:38, 25 April 2024 (EDT)
  
−
:: P.S. Notes templates are case-insensitive, so we should be good on that front. [[User:Ahasuerus|Ahasuerus]] 14:42, 28 April 2021 (EDT)
+
::::: Re: "flag/checkbox on the series page which tells the software if it needs to show series and titles mixed based on the numbers OR if they need to be kept separate", it's possible for a series to have both types of sub-series. The first type covers sub-series which should be treated as titles for ordering purposes. The second type covers sub-series which should be displayed after all regular titles, including unnumbered titles. If a new flag is to be implemented, it will presumably need to be added to each sub-series, specifying what kind of sub-series it is.
  
−
== Contento Link ==
+
::::: That said, I think the first thing that we need to do is to determine what kind of impact having certain sub-series displayed within the main title sequence would have. A few things come to mind:
 +
:::::* We have a cleanup report that finds duplicate series numbers within a series. It would presumably need to be enhanced to look for duplicate numbers of the new type (or a new cleanup report will need to be created.)
 +
:::::* Having a long sub-series -- especially if it has nested sub-series of its own -- appear in the middle of numbered titles could make it harder for our users to understand what the actual order of the main series is. For certain major universes like Warhammer, the resulting "series tree" could be overwhelming.
 +
:::::* Development considerations. Currently the software module responsible for displaying series (a) calls itself recursively AND (b) shares code with our Bibliographic pages. It's a delicate and messy area which is high on my list of things to rewrite once I am done with Fixer migration. Adding additional complexity to it before the code is rewritten may not be optimal.
 +
::::: [[User:Ahasuerus|Ahasuerus]] ([[User talk:Ahasuerus|talk]]) 20:49, 25 April 2024 (EDT)
  
−
It appears that the link to Contento1 has changed.  The link we do have in the secondary verifications list, http://www.philsp.com/homeville/ISFAC/0start.htm, now returns a 404.  The new link is http://www.philsp.com/resources/ISFAC/0start.htm.  I assume it's either a software or properties change. I've gone ahead and changed it [[Reference:Contento1|here]].  Thanks. --Ron ~ [[User:Rtrace|Rtrace]]<sup>[[User talk:Rtrace|Talk]]</sup> 21:17, 3 May 2021 (EDT)
+
== Japanese collaboration ==
  
−
: I'll take a look, thanks! [[User:Ahasuerus|Ahasuerus]] 21:41, 3 May 2021 (EDT)
+
I haven't asked them yet, but [https://www.isfdb.org/cgi-bin/ea.cgi?212106 one of the authors in our database] was the creator of the [https://staff.fukuoka-edu.ac.jp/kanamitu/sf/sfdb/index.html Japanese SF Book Database] and the [https://staff.fukuoka-edu.ac.jp/kanamitu/sf/sfdb/sfmgz.html Japanese SF Magazine Database]. He's in his 90s now, and I wondered if I should reach out to him to see if he (or one of his colleagues) might be interested in entering all the information from those databases into ISFDB in order to make it more broadly accessible (since most people outside of Japan have never heard of his two databases). I don't know what their database system is, but there might even be a way to (at least partially) automate the transfer of information. I know they've had some database issues recently so their sites aren't working properly, so I think it's even more important to try to get that information into ISFDB before he dies. Thoughts? ···[[User:Nihonjoe|<font color="darkgreen">日本穣</font>]] · <small>[[Special:Contributions/Nihonjoe|<font color="blue">投稿</font>]] · [[User talk:Nihonjoe|Talk to Nihonjoe]]</small> 17:46, 25 April 2024 (EDT)
  
−
:: Fixed! [[User:Ahasuerus|Ahasuerus]] 13:32, 6 May 2021 (EDT)
+
: The idea certainly has merit. Here are some steps that come to mind:
 +
:* We'll need to determine whether the current database owners/maintainers are able and willing to share the data. There may be pre-existing obligations or commitments which may prevent them from sharing the data.
 +
:* The fact that the Web site is currently partially non-functional raises a flag. We'll need to determine whether they have coherent database backups and database documentation. We'll also need to know how many records the backups contain.
 +
:* If they have a coherent database backup and are willing to share it, then it's likely that we should be able to use it. Directly importing data into the ISFDB database would be suboptimal, in part because it would leave us without Edit History, but creating Fixer-style submissions using their data should be viable. We have a number of people with software development backgrounds who may be interested in working on this task.
 +
:* The ISFDB Web API supports putting submissions on hold on behalf of a moderator. We'll probably want to hold these submissions for moderators who have a working knowledge of Japanese.
 +
: Based on the above I would suggest that we start by contacting the owners/maintainers to get answers to the first two issues listed above. [[User:Ahasuerus|Ahasuerus]] ([[User talk:Ahasuerus|talk]]) 18:24, 25 April 2024 (EDT)
  
−
:::Thanks!  I meant to comment on the Community Portal discussion, but I was kind of ambivalent as to which way we went.  This certainly does have the virtue of being easier to update when the external urls change. Anyway, it looks good. --Ron ~ [[User:Rtrace|Rtrace]]<sup>[[User talk:Rtrace|Talk]]</sup> 18:05, 6 May 2021 (EDT)
+
::Okay, I'll start by doing that. An additional thing to consider is instances where we already have one of the titles in ISFDB. I guess that could be handled by the existing duplicate checker. ···[[User:Nihonjoe|<font color="darkgreen">日本穣</font>]] · <small>[[Special:Contributions/Nihonjoe|<font color="blue">投稿</font>]] · [[User talk:Nihonjoe|Talk to Nihonjoe]]</small> 12:47, 26 April 2024 (EDT)
  
−
== Cleanup report count mismatch ==
+
::: True, although whoever ends up doing development work for this project will presumably have a local copy of the ISFDB database. It should be possible to query it to see if the data is already on file. [[User:Ahasuerus|Ahasuerus]] ([[User talk:Ahasuerus|talk]]) 13:22, 26 April 2024 (EDT)
  
−
I just noticed that on [http://www.isfdb.org/cgi-bin/edit/cleanup.cgi the cleanup report page], we have "Publications with Invalid Prices (4)", but if you click through to [http://www.isfdb.org/cgi-bin/edit/cleanup_report.cgi?100 the report], only 3 rows are shown.
+
== The Shadow of Heaven ==
  
−
Maybe this is just a caching issue where one of the errors has been fixed, but thought I should let you know in case it's something else? [[User:ErsatzCulture|ErsatzCulture]] 13:12, 22 May 2021 (EDT)
+
Hello Ahasuerus, I'm following up on [https://isfdb.org/wiki/index.php/ISFDB:Community_Portal/Archive/Archive55#Gollancz_-_10_new_series_titles this conversation] and will be adding {{P|46957|this pub}} to {{PubSeries|12004|name=Gollancz SF Series (6)}}. Regards, Kev. --[[User:BanjoKev|BanjoKev]] ([[User talk:BanjoKev|talk]]) 18:39, 26 April 2024 (EDT)
  
−
: Yes, it's a timing issue. As the "Legend" section at the top of the Cleanup Reports list says:
+
: Sounds good! [[User:Ahasuerus|Ahasuerus]] ([[User talk:Ahasuerus|talk]]) 20:47, 26 April 2024 (EDT)
−
:* The numbers in parentheses show how many problem records were found when each report was last regenerated; the current numbers may be lower.
 
−
: That being said, sometimes the report generation logic and the report display logic get out of sync when I tweak the code, as was the case when you reported the previous issue.
 
−
 
 
−
: Ideally, each cleanup report would use the same code base when generating/displaying reports, but that would require a major rewrite. In addition, it may not be feasible in certain cases due to performance issues. While it's not a big deal if a report takes 15 seconds to compile (as long as it doesn't affect other users), the display side is more demanding. [[User:Ahasuerus|Ahasuerus]] 13:30, 22 May 2021 (EDT)
 
−
:: Ah, apologies for failing to notice that text, and consequently wasting your time :-( [[User:ErsatzCulture|ErsatzCulture]] 13:41, 22 May 2021 (EDT)
 
−
 
 
−
::: No worries! :) [[User:Ahasuerus|Ahasuerus]] 13:43, 22 May 2021 (EDT)
 
−
 
 
−
== Serial vs. Shortfiction ==
 
−
 
 
−
Ran across {{T|2622385|this record}} which caused me to do [http://www.isfdb.org/cgi-bin/adv_search_results.cgi?USE_1=title_title&O_1=contains&TERM_1=+%28part&C=AND&USE_2=title_ttype&O_2=exact&TERM_2=SHORTFICTION&USE_3=title_title&O_3=exact&TERM_3=&USE_4=title_title&O_4=exact&TERM_4=&USE_5=title_title&O_5=exact&TERM_5=&USE_6=title_title&O_6=exact&TERM_6=&USE_7=title_title&O_7=exact&TERM_7=&USE_8=title_title&O_8=exact&TERM_8=&USE_9=title_title&O_9=exact&TERM_9=&USE_10=title_title&O_10=exact&TERM_10=&ORDERBY=title_title&ACTION=query&START=0&TYPE=Title this search]. Seems like the need for a cleanup report that find titles with " (Part" but are not SERIAL type. There may be some valid cases, but many of those look like they should be serials. --&nbsp;[[User:JLaTondre|JLaTondre]] ([[User talk:JLaTondre#top|talk]]) 14:04, 22 May 2021 (EDT)
 
−
 
 
−
: Oh boy! I didn't realize how many problematic records we had. {{FR|1417}} has been created. Thanks! [[User:Ahasuerus|Ahasuerus]] 18:06, 22 May 2021 (EDT)
 
−
 
 
−
:: Done -- see [http://www.isfdb.org/wiki/index.php/ISFDB:Community_Portal#New_cleanup_report_--_SHORTFICTION_title_records_with_.22.28Part.22_in_the_title_field the Community Portal announcement]. [[User:Ahasuerus|Ahasuerus]] 12:46, 26 May 2021 (EDT)
 
−
 
 
−
== Transmaniacon ==
 
−
 
 
−
Cover artist for [http://www.isfdb.org/cgi-bin/pl.cgi?186013 this] confirmed as Les Edwards via email from the artist. --[[User:Mavmaramis|Mavmaramis]] 14:38, 10 June 2021 (EDT)
 
−
 
 
−
: Approved and tweaked, thanks! [[User:Ahasuerus|Ahasuerus]] 15:29, 10 June 2021 (EDT)
 
−
 
 
−
== A serious problem with submitting ==
 
−
 
 
−
Hi, Ahasuerus! Is there some general problem going on or is it just my special status? I tried to submit an update for a publication ([http://www.isfdb.org/cgi-bin/pl.cgi?841359 this one]) and got the message / answer 'Moderator privileges are required for this option'. Christian [[User:Stonecreek|Stonecreek]] 12:58, 15 June 2021 (EDT)
 
−
 
 
−
: Not that I know of. Let me take a look... [[User:Ahasuerus|Ahasuerus]] 13:07, 15 June 2021 (EDT)
 
−
 
 
−
:: After setting up a self-approver user on the development server and creating a new submission, I received the same error message. It looks like one of the recent software updates may have had an unintended side-effect. Investigating... [[User:Ahasuerus|Ahasuerus]] 13:15, 15 June 2021 (EDT)
 
−
 
 
−
::: Yup, it was an unintended side effect of the patch which I installed earlier today. Sorry about that! Fixing it now... [[User:Ahasuerus|Ahasuerus]] 13:24, 15 June 2021 (EDT)
 
−
 
 
−
:::: The fix has been installed. Could you please try it again and let me know if it's back to normal? [[User:Ahasuerus|Ahasuerus]] 13:28, 15 June 2021 (EDT)
 
−
 
 
−
::::: Many thanks for the quick help! All seems to be back as it was a few hours earlier. Christian [[User:Stonecreek|Stonecreek]] 23:25, 15 June 2021 (EDT)
 
−
 
 
−
:::::: Excellent! :) [[User:Ahasuerus|Ahasuerus]] 23:53, 15 June 2021 (EDT)
 
−
 
 
−
== Top Contributors and similar reports ==
 
−
 
 
−
I'm suspicious that the nightly update of the Top Contributors and similar reports may be failing.  My evidence for this is that the last user update for me on verified publications is showing as 2021-06-17 which is correct.  However, my date on the reports is stuck at 2021-06-14.  Not an urgent issue, but I wanted to bring it to your attention.  Thanks. --Ron ~ [[User:Rtrace|Rtrace]]<sup>[[User talk:Rtrace|Talk]]</sup> 06:52, 18 June 2021 (EDT)
 
−
 
 
−
: You are right -- the Facebook-related changes that I have been working on caused the nightly reports to fail starting earlier this week. Thanks for identifying the issue! [[User:Ahasuerus|Ahasuerus]] 09:14, 18 June 2021 (EDT)
 
−
 
 
−
:: Fixed. The data will become available tomorrow morning. Thanks again! [[User:Ahasuerus|Ahasuerus]] 10:33, 18 June 2021 (EDT)
 
−
 
 
−
:::Alas, the reports don't appear to be updated this morning.  --Ron ~ [[User:Rtrace|Rtrace]]<sup>[[User talk:Rtrace|Talk]]</sup> 06:26, 19 June 2021 (EDT)
 
−
 
 
−
:::: Well, the good news is that the fix that I installed yesterday worked as expected. The bad news is that one of the subsequent patches broke the nightly job ''again'' -- I keep forgetting to test it every time I update the core ISFDB module invoked by all Web pages and by standalone processes :-(
 
−
 
 
−
:::: I have fixed the nightly job yet again and, hopefully, nothing else will get broken as I pump out more patches. Thanks for your patience! [[User:Ahasuerus|Ahasuerus]] 13:38, 19 June 2021 (EDT)
 
−
 
 
−
::::: No worries.  I'm a java programmer, so I know how things go.  Hopefully, it will back tomorrow.  Thanks again. --Ron ~ [[User:Rtrace|Rtrace]]<sup>[[User talk:Rtrace|Talk]]</sup> 17:07, 19 June 2021 (EDT)
 
−
 
 
−
:::::: Everything looks great this morning.  Thanks again. --Ron ~ [[User:Rtrace|Rtrace]]<sup>[[User talk:Rtrace|Talk]]</sup> 06:32, 20 June 2021 (EDT)
 
−
 
 
−
::::::: Excellent! :) [[User:Ahasuerus|Ahasuerus]] 07:16, 20 June 2021 (EDT)
 
−
 
 
−
:::::::: Looks like this glitch has returned. [[User:Scifibones|<b>John</b> <small>Scifibones</small>]] 08:09, 21 July 2021 (EDT)
 
−
 
 
−
::::::::: The nightly reports didn't even try to run at 1am. It looks like the server crashed again around midnight. Investigating... [[User:Ahasuerus|Ahasuerus]] 12:03, 21 July 2021 (EDT)
 
−
 
 
−
:::::::::: The nightly reports have been rerun, so the numbers should be correct now. [[User:Ahasuerus|Ahasuerus]] 13:14, 21 July 2021 (EDT)
 
−
 
 
−
(unindent) I think this problem has cropped up again.  Thanks. --Ron ~ [[User:Rtrace|Rtrace]]<sup>[[User talk:Rtrace|Talk]]</sup> 07:20, 5 September 2021 (EDT)
 
−
 
 
−
: It looks like the server was rebooted overnight, which interrupted nightly processing. Hopefully, things will go back to normal tomorrow morning. [[User:Ahasuerus|Ahasuerus]] 12:05, 5 September 2021 (EDT)
 
−
 
 
−
:: It would appear that everything was back to normal as of this morning. [[User:Ahasuerus|Ahasuerus]] 20:04, 6 September 2021 (EDT)
 
−
 
 
−
== Notes/changes needed to Ryk E. Spoor entry ==
 
−
 
 
−
Hi, this is Ryk himself with a few notes on my page. Hopefully this works, I have never worked on a site that functions quite like this one
 
−
 
 
−
There's a few additions/changes that need to be done to my entry, as follows:
 
−
 
 
−
1: Jamaica Blue Magic is the second in Fall of Veils, so should be under that heading.
 
−
 
 
−
2: _Shadows of Hyperion_ is now out, and is the fourth in the Grand Central Arena, AKA Arenaverse, series.
 
−
 
 
−
3: On-Site for the Apocalypse is in the same setting as Princess Holy Aura (setting is called “The Ethical Magical Girl” and I’ll be starting the second book in the series very soon)
 
−
 
 
−
4: Training and Truth is in the Zarathan/Zahralandar universe (it’s part of the first book in the forthcoming “Spirit Warriors” trilogy)
 
−
 
 
−
5: Preparations and Alliances is part of the Arenaverse series.
 
−
 
 
−
 
 
−
 
 
−
Thanks, whenever you (or someone else) could do these. And thanks for maintaining this awesome database! {{unsigned|Seawasp}}
 
−
 
 
−
: Done, done and done -- thanks for the updates! :-) [[User:Ahasuerus|Ahasuerus]] 13:19, 19 June 2021 (EDT)
 
−
 
 
−
== A new bug ==
 
−
 
 
−
I noticed the following problem yesterday. If you are not logged in and access an author's page, the option button "Never display translations" is active. If you select it, you get the following error message. "Author not found: XXX+None" [[User:Scifibones|<b>John</b> <small>Scifibones</small>]] 08:35, 23 June 2021 (EDT)
 
−
 
 
−
: Thanks, I'll take a look. [[User:Ahasuerus|Ahasuerus]] 10:07, 23 June 2021 (EDT)
 
−
 
 
−
:: Fixed! [[User:Ahasuerus|Ahasuerus]] 10:46, 23 June 2021 (EDT)
 
−
 
 
−
== Problem logging in ==
 
−
 
 
−
I've been trying to log in for a week.  While I could log in as Biomassbob, I couldn't make any changes, including replying to messages on my talk page or editing existing pubs.  I thought the website was dead.  But today I created a new account, new username and password, and using that identity, I can at least do those things.  I did get a new computer, but don't know if that caused the problem.  I'd like to be able to use my old identity if possible.  What do I need to do? [[User:Balboabeach|Balboabeach]] 10:36, 2 July 2021 (EDT)
 
−
 
 
−
: Answered on [[User talk:Balboabeach]]. [[User:Ahasuerus|Ahasuerus]] 11:33, 2 July 2021 (EDT)
 
−
 
 
−
== Марс пробуждается ==
 
−
 
 
−
Is {{P|844669|Марс пробуждается}} an English work or was that a data entry mistake? Thanks. --&nbsp;[[User:JLaTondre|JLaTondre]] ([[User talk:JLaTondre#top|talk]]) 17:56, 5 July 2021 (EDT)
 
−
 
 
−
: Sorry, my bad! The records have been fixed. Thanks for the heads-up! [[User:Ahasuerus|Ahasuerus]] 18:23, 5 July 2021 (EDT)
 
−
:: [http://www.isfdb.org/cgi-bin/title.cgi?2876639 Parents] also need fixing in such cases (done now) :) [[User:Anniemod|Annie]] 20:38, 5 July 2021 (EDT)
 
−
 
 
−
::: Thanks! [[User:Ahasuerus|Ahasuerus]] 20:56, 5 July 2021 (EDT)
 
−
 
 
−
== Commune 2000 A.D. / Mack Reynolds ==
 
−
 
 
−
Please check conversation at [[http://www.isfdb.org/wiki/index.php/User_talk:GlennMcG#Commune_2000_A.D._.2F_Mack_Reynolds]]. Thanks! --[[User:GlennMcG|GlennMcG]] 02:28, 6 July 2021 (EDT)
 
−
 
 
−
== Incident on Ath cover art issue. ==
 
−
 
 
−
It might be easier to contnue the discussion of this specific issue here as opposed to the other message board. Thanks again for your patience with this. It must be very frustrating and damn annoying. I'm guessing no one knows what caused "The Incident" in the first place ? --[[User:Mavmaramis|Mavmaramis]] 15:55, 22 July 2021 (EDT)
 
−
 
 
−
: I am afraid I haven't heard anything from the hosting company. A hardware failure would be my first guess, but it could really be any number of things. I'd have to ping Al and he'd have to ping the hosting company and even then we may not learn much. Ultimately, the impact on our databases was the same whether they lost power or whether something more involved happened.
 
−
 
 
−
: Going back to the immediate issue, do you happen to have your new scan -- which I assume is an improved version of www.isfdb.org/wiki/index.php/Image:NCDNTNTHVT1981.jpg -- stored somewhere where I could access it? Google Drive, Drop Box, etc? If you could send me a link, I could then download it to the development server and try to upload it to the Wiki using various tricks. It would be much faster than trying to walk you through the same tricks remotely. [[User:Ahasuerus|Ahasuerus]] 16:02, 22 July 2021 (EDT)
 
−
:: Quick question - are you absolutely sure that it is not uploading? According to [http://www.isfdb.org/wiki/index.php/Image:NCDNTNTHVT1981.jpg the history page], you uploaded it 3 times today. Keep in mind that the caches can be very annoying sometimes - you WILL see the old image for awhile even though the image was swapped... So can you look at it from a different browser/device and make sure it is not just the cache thing? [[User:Anniemod|Annie]] 16:14, 22 July 2021 (EDT)
 
−
 
 
−
::: That's a very good point. Doing a full page reload -- Control-F5 under most browsers -- would be another way to make sure that your browser is not using an old version of the image. [[User:Ahasuerus|Ahasuerus]] 16:32, 22 July 2021 (EDT)
 
−
 
 
−
:::: I am well aware of the CTRL F5 thing. Anyway the full cover now displays so everything is tickety boo. As for "The Incident" - ISFDB can't be the only site the hosting company have and they can't exactly be happy bunnies about it any more than you (and others). You've done a great job under what must have been difficult circumstances and hope you (or anyone else) hasn't had to deal with any unpleasant criciticisms. --[[User:Mavmaramis|Mavmaramis]] 22:04, 22 July 2021 (EDT)
 
−
 
 
−
::::: Thanks for the kind words! Glad to hear things are back to normal :-) [[User:Ahasuerus|Ahasuerus]] 22:08, 22 July 2021 (EDT)
 
−
 
 
−
== Henri Vernes' deathdate ==
 
−
 
 
−
[http://www.isfdb.org/cgi-bin/ea.cgi?190628 You beat me to it] :o) ! [[User:Linguist|Linguist]] 07:42, 27 July 2021 (EDT).
 
−
 
 
−
: It was a tight race! :-) [[User:Ahasuerus|Ahasuerus]] 10:15, 27 July 2021 (EDT)
 
−
 
 
−
== MediaWiki ==
 
−
 
 
−
Hi. Based on your user page I assume you are also maintaining the wiki? I was just wondering if there was a hardware/stack/local modifications reason for the fairly old version of MediaWiki? Wondering since I assume there is a fair number of known security issues which have not been patched since the version hasn't been supported for years. Not a criticism, just general interest/[[User:Lokal Profil|Lokal]][[Special:Contributions/Lokal Profil|_]][[:User talk:Lokal Profil|Profil]] 03:11, 19 August 2021 (EDT)
 
−
 
 
−
: I am currently responsible for keeping the server, including the Wiki, running, but, unfortunately, my knowledge of PHP/MediWiki is virtually non-existent. Sadly, learning new things gets harder as we get older plus my health hasn't been that great the last few years :-(
 
−
 
 
−
: For this reason, Al von Ruff, the other ISFDB administrator with developer level access to the server and some PHP experience, has taken the lead on the Wiki side -- see {{SR|51}} and {{SR|184}} for recent developments on that front. Unfortunately, Al has been very busy with non-ISFDB things lately, so this mini-project is currently on hiatus. [[User:Ahasuerus|Ahasuerus]] 12:20, 19 August 2021 (EDT)
 
−
 
 
−
== Make Alternate names: possible bug? ==
 
−
 
 
−
Hello Ahasuerus, it seems to be possible to create multiple links between primary and alternate author names - have a look here: http://www.isfdb.org/wiki/index.php/ISFDB:Moderator_noticeboard#Alternates. Regards, [[User:MagicUnk|MagicUnk]] 04:56, 19 August 2021 (EDT)
 
−
 
 
−
: Thanks for identifying the problem! I have responded on the Moderator Noticeboard and will do more digging on the development server. [[User:Ahasuerus|Ahasuerus]] 12:23, 19 August 2021 (EDT)
 
−
 
 
−
== New award  ==
 
−
 
 
−
Ping to remind you (or notify you, if you missed it) about [[ISFDB:Community Portal#Manly Wade Wellman Award|this post]]. I know you have a lot of things to do, and it's easy to miss things on some of the boards these days due to so many posts being made. TIA! ···[[User:Nihonjoe|<font color="darkgreen">日本穣</font>]] · <small>[[Special:Contributions/Nihonjoe|<font color="blue">投稿</font>]] · [[User talk:Nihonjoe|Talk to Nihonjoe]]</small> 19:54, 19 August 2021 (EDT)
 
−
 
 
−
: Oops, I missed it! Response posted. Sorry about that! [[User:Ahasuerus|Ahasuerus]] 22:06, 19 August 2021 (EDT)
 
−
 
 
−
::No worries. Thanks! ···[[User:Nihonjoe|<font color="darkgreen">日本穣</font>]] · <small>[[Special:Contributions/Nihonjoe|<font color="blue">投稿</font>]] · [[User talk:Nihonjoe|Talk to Nihonjoe]]</small> 11:26, 20 August 2021 (EDT)
 
−
 
 
−
== Accidentally edited the ISFDB_Downloads page ==
 
−
and put an old version into it. I confused two Firefox tabs while trying to enter the data in my local installation of ISFDB.
 
−
 
 
−
Hit Undo button and restored your version. Hope, this was successful. Nevertheless I would like to leave a note. [[User:Elsbernd|elsbernd]] 07:25, 22 August 2021 (EDT)
 
−
 
 
−
: No problem, everything looks good. Thanks for letting me know! [[User:Ahasuerus|Ahasuerus]] 11:59, 22 August 2021 (EDT)
 
−
 
 
−
== Missing link to 'moderator' page on Duplicate finder page. ==
 
−
 
 
−
Hello Ahasuerus, I think I found a bug. When on the Duplicate finder page (after having clicked on 'Check for duplicate titles' when on the title screen), and then clicking on the Moderator menu, I got a 'Not found' message. The URL behind the 'Moderator' menu-item reads 'http://www.isfdb.org/cgi-bin/list.cgi?N'. Regards, [[User:MagicUnk|MagicUnk]] 15:19, 26 August 2021 (EDT)
 
−
 
 
−
: Fixed. Thanks for reporting the issue! [[User:Ahasuerus|Ahasuerus]] 15:34, 26 August 2021 (EDT)
 
−
 
 
−
== Minor software change request ==
 
−
 
 
−
Ahasuerus, A somewhat unusual situation arose yesterday while working with an awards page. I made a minor edit to a title record which already had an award linked. I noticed that the award page did not re-sort to reflect the change. The change was visible, just had no effect on sort order. I asked [[User:Rtrace|Rtrace]] about it. He explained how the software makes separate titles for award purposes. It uses those for sorting, but, displays the regular title. Is it possible to unlock the title field in the award edit screen? This seems like a better solution than deleting an award and then entering it again, just to correct the sort order. [[User:Scifibones|<b>John</b> <small>Scifibones</small>]] 18:18, 6 September 2021 (EDT)
 
−
 
 
−
: Thanks for identifying the issue! I have responded on Ron's Talk page. [[User:Ahasuerus|Ahasuerus]] 20:03, 6 September 2021 (EDT)
 
−
 
 
−
== Strange translation ==
 
−
 
 
−
Hello! I found something strange. When I enter the title page of this pub [http://www.isfdb.org/cgi-bin/pl.cgi?855420 O homem que foi para Marte porque queria ficar sozinho] the complete page is translated into German. Look: [http://www.isfdb.org/cgi-bin/title.cgi?2908744 Der Mann, der zum Mars ging, weil er allein sein wollte] Regards Rudolf [[User:Rudam|Rudam]] 12:19, 7 September 2021 (EDT)
 
−
 
 
−
: That's odd. When I open the linked URLs, the metadata (like field names, Notes, etc) appears in English and the titles are in Portuguese.
 
−
 
 
−
: Thinking some more about it, Google and some browsers have features which can be configured to translate Web pages to your preferred language automatically. Is it possible that that is what's happening here? [[User:Ahasuerus|Ahasuerus]] 13:25, 7 September 2021 (EDT)
 
−
 
 
−
:: With my browser, it's still Portuguese. Christian [[User:Stonecreek|Stonecreek]] 13:55, 7 September 2021 (EDT)
 
−
 
 
−
::: First I had used Portuguese and English as preferred language and after that I tried it in German. Each time the same result. I have observed that for a milisecond it first appears in Portuguese and then it changes into German. Other Portuguese titles appear as usual. It's the only page. Rudolf [[User:Rudam|Rudam]] 14:13, 7 September 2021 (EDT)
 
−
:::: Sounds like you had told your browser to always translate this page for some reason - I know I've done that by mistake a few times because the button/link for it was just there. Try another browser (and share what browser you are using so someone can try to help you unstick the translation). [[User:Anniemod|Annie]] 14:21, 7 September 2021 (EDT)
 
−
 
 
−
::::: That's right -- "for a milisecond it first appears in Portuguese and then it changes into German" proves it conclusively. The ISFDB software is unable to translate titles on the fly, but some browsers can do it for you. [[User:Ahasuerus|Ahasuerus]] 14:29, 7 September 2021 (EDT)
 
−
 
 
−
::::::Problem solved! The browser was told to translate this page from Portuguese into German. After I withdrew it, everything was ok. Thanks for your help. Regards Rudolf [[User:Rudam|Rudam]] 15:42, 7 September 2021 (EDT)
 
−
 
 
−
::::::: Excellent! :-) [[User:Ahasuerus|Ahasuerus]] 16:40, 7 September 2021 (EDT)
 
−
 
 
−
== Jules Verne - genre vs. non-genre ==
 
−
 
 
−
I've collected most of his works in the course of my project, but only recently read some of them. Many seem to be non-genre. A good example is Around the World in Eighty Days. The Help suggests it's hard to make the distinction prior to 1800, but this is 1860's and on. I'd guess about 10-20% are genre. The concept of threshold will kick in if we start marking them. It's a can of worms, but it might be time to go fishing. Any suggestions? ../[[User:Holmesd|Doug H]] 16:33, 15 September 2021 (EDT)
 
−
: Was if possible with the technology of 1860? That’s what will define if it is genre or not, especially that early on. Eighty days is definitely genre IMO. :) [[User:Anniemod|Annie]] 16:53, 15 September 2021 (EDT)
 
−
 
 
−
:: Doing it in 80 days would have been extremely difficult -- but probably not impossible -- for a single adventurer in 1872, when the novel was published. It became a well-known challenge and people successfully circumnavigated the globe in less than 80 days just a few years later.
 
−
 
 
−
:: (after edit conflict) I am not a Jules Verne expert, but I did read a lot of his books back in the day. I agree that many were "marginally SF" at best. For example, Verne was very fond of the "stuck on a desert/tropical island" plot device to the point of writing a sequel to [http://www.isfdb.org/cgi-bin/title.cgi?1237142 "The Swiss Family Robinson"] (which was marginally speculative as we note in our record.) Fair enough. However, consider his other, better known, "stuck on a tropical island" novel -- "The Mysterious Island". Like "The Swiss Family Robinson", it's marginally speculative, but it also serves as a bridge between "Twenty Thousand Leagues Under the Seas", which is clearly SF, and "In Search of the Castaways", which has hardly any speculative elements. Everything is so intertwined that it's hard to draw a definitive line.
 
−
 
 
−
:: I would suggest asking on the Community Portal to see if other editors have thought about this issue. [[User:Ahasuerus|Ahasuerus]] 17:03, 15 September 2021 (EDT)
 
−
 
 
−
:::I tried starting a [http://www.isfdb.org/wiki/index.php/ISFDB:Community_Portal#How_much_of_Jules_Verne_is_genre.3F discussion], but it doesn't seem to be of much concern. I was looking into who the top verifiers for JV were, in hopes that a more direct appeal might work better. It turns out the top 8 account for 80% of the verifications. The second highest contributor dealt in German translations and two of the others in Dutch. Which made me realize that I was dealing in English translations which were notoriously bad and known for dropping slow/boring content. So before getting bogged down in how to assess the genre-ness of a work, I thought it better to go back to what I really wanted.
 
−
 
 
−
:::I have access to a reference work from which hundreds of publication entries might be generated for ISFDB. A future evaluation of any given title as non-genre would reduce the value of such effort, and if a threshold were to be applied and not reached, then much work would be for naught. So before investing time, I'd like to resolve the non-genre/threshold issues. The Policy is, of necessity, somewhat vague about about border-line genre and thresholds. What I'm looking for is something much more concrete in ''process'', that is a way to address a particular title or author and document the result. The latter could be as simple as genre and threshold templates that could be added to titles and authors. Moderators would control / monitor their use, ensuring the appropriate discussion / documentation were included/referenced before allowing and to check prior to deletion if a future contrary opinion were raised. Defining such a control should help structure the process for actually making assessments of genre and thresholds. I've less in the way of ideas for holding the discussions - maybe the ISFDB wiki needs polls?
 
−
 
 
−
:::My plan is to propose such a 'change' in the Community Forum, as it seems easier to get people involved in discussions if there are technical details and basic principles involved rather than particular authors or titles. Any suggestions regarding points to include/exclude to frame/contain the discussion? - I'm assuming you'll weigh in on the actual proposals in the posting. ../[[User:Holmesd|Doug H]] 10:53, 23 September 2021 (EDT)
 
−
 
 
−
:::: Sorry about the delay in responding! My brain is fried tonight, but I hope to answer tomorrow. [[User:Ahasuerus|Ahasuerus]] 21:34, 25 September 2021 (EDT)
 
−
::::: No problem. I've been thinking about some of the background information that might be required (e.g. how many people make a quorum, based on previous decisions) and how to get it. ../[[User:Holmesd|Doug H]] 23:44, 25 September 2021 (EDT)
 
−
 
 
−
(unindent) One thing to keep in mind is that, as per [[ISFDB:Policy]], we include:
 
−
* Works (both fiction and non-fiction) which are not related to speculative fiction, but were produced by authors who have otherwise published works either of or about speculative fiction over a certain threshold (see below).
 
−
Since Jules Verne is clearly "above the threshold", this means that all of his works are eligible for inclusion even if we decide that some are not SF. The only difference is whether we flip the "non-genre" flag for some works, which will make them appear at the bottom of his Author Bibliography page. [[User:Ahasuerus|Ahasuerus]] 20:21, 26 September 2021 (EDT)
 
−
: A lot of them won’t even fall down to the bottom for him though - as a lot of them are  in the same series, they will stay above the fold. [[User:Anniemod|Annie]] 20:42, 26 September 2021 (EDT)
 
−
:: We haven't counted, but as few as 18 of his 80 novels may qualify as genre. Does that warrant a 'Clearly'? My second question (assuming the first is that we do classify all of them) is whether that level might put him below the threshold? As for being in the same series, I don't think it has been resolved whether ''Voyages extraordinaires'' is a title series or publisher series, but regardless, why does being in the same series make them 'genre' (above the fold)? An interesting point about the series, if a non-genre work is in a title series, does it appear in the series or in the non-genre section of the bibliography (or is that what you were getting at when you said 'above the fold'? ../[[User:Holmesd|Doug H]] 21:59, 26 September 2021 (EDT)
 
−
::: It does not make them genre. But the way we show series will show them above the fold on the page even if you mark them as non-genre because the series has a genre work. If Jules Verne is not a genre author, we’ve veered way too away in how we define genre authors. The whole above the threshold thing had always been about genre authors vs authors writing genre occasionally. Are you seriously proposing that the father of science fiction is actually not a genre author and should be treated as someone who occasionally wrote speculative fiction? If it bothers you so much we can add a special exception that will keep him as above threshold. But removing the adventure stories of Verne will make the DB poorer. We are not accountants - numbers are not everything sometimes. [[User:Anniemod|Annie]] 22:09, 26 September 2021 (EDT)
 
−
:::: After all the works and work I've put in, I'm hardly likely to say he is not a genre author. I am, however, a bit afraid that someone might. All I'm looking for is somewhere official to record it, not really for Jules Verne, but for every time there's an [https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/argument argument (1a)] that achieves a momentary consensus. There's a change log for modifications to the policy and help entries, can we get something comparable for genre/threshold and such like decisions that are considered consensual? ../[[User:Holmesd|Doug H]] 22:40, 26 September 2021 (EDT)
 
−
:: So we're having this conversation here in Ahasuerus Talk page and asserting that Jules Verne is 'above the threshold', but what does that mean years from now when someone points out that Mathias Sandorf is non-genre and should be removed and a moderator agrees? I still think some formalization of these decisions is a good idea. Jules Verne might make a good example or test case. ../[[User:Holmesd|Doug H]] 21:59, 26 September 2021 (EDT)
 
−
::: A solution could be to clearly state in the Author record Note field why a certain author is considered 'above the threshold' even if the majority of his/her work cannot be considered spec fic. For the Jules Verne case, it can be argued that his spec fic titles have been so influential, and that he is such an iconic author for the field, that that alone warrants his inclusion in the DB as an 'above the threshold' author. When doing so there's less chance (not zero though) that an unsuspecting editor and/or moderator screws up authors categorized such... [[User:MagicUnk|MagicUnk]] 14:50, 27 September 2021 (EDT)
 
−
 
 
−
:::: That's true, but keep in mind that we also have {{FR|860}}, "Add a 'non-genre' field to Author records". I suppose we could use this proposed field as a "Yes/No" flag while specifying the rationale in the Notes field.
 
−
 
 
−
:::: Let me also point something else out. We have discussed two different approaches to the "threshold" issue. The first one would use "genre significance" as the main criterion when deciding whether an author is "above the threshold". The second one would use "proportion of genre works" as the main criterion, the idea being that we don't want our users to wonder when they come across an unlisted book by an otherwise genre author -- how would they know if it was excluded on purpose as opposed to missed?
 
−
 
 
−
:::: In many cases there is no conflict between these approaches. A "significant" genre author like Heinlein or Norton typically has a high "proportion of genre works". However, there are exceptions. For example, consider George Orwell. He wrote two very influential genre works, but most of his novels (4 out of 6) were non-genre and we do not list them.
 
−
 
 
−
:::: We were never able to decide one way or the other or to find a compromise solution. [[User:Ahasuerus|Ahasuerus]] 15:18, 27 September 2021 (EDT)
 
−
 
 
−
== Web API ==
 
−
 
 
−
There is a line in [http://www.isfdb.org/wiki/index.php/Web_API Web API] that says there are two ways to retrieve publication data, but you seem to have added a third. ../[[User:Holmesd|Doug H]] 23:52, 27 September 2021 (EDT) (No, I'm not stalking you, I've been reviewing the Wiki documentation from the top down. This was recent enough to bring to your attention.)
 
−
 
 
−
: Updated, thanks! [[User:Ahasuerus|Ahasuerus]] 09:11, 28 September 2021 (EDT)
 
−
:: Actually, you missed the spot I'd noticed under [http://www.isfdb.org/wiki/index.php/Web_API#Publication_Lookups Publication Lookups]: "At this time there are two ways to retrieve publication data from the ISFDB database". :-(  ../[[User:Holmesd|Doug H]] 11:51, 28 September 2021 (EDT)
 
−
 
 
−
::: Oops, missed that! Thanks again! [[User:Ahasuerus|Ahasuerus]] 13:12, 28 September 2021 (EDT)
 
−
 
 
−
== Bibliographic Comment ==
 
−
 
 
−
I ran across a few Wiki pages that were part of a bibliographic verification project. While a dog's breakfast and not to be approached (yet), my approach to it was through a publication page showing Bibliographic Comments field with a link (e.g. [http://www.isfdb.org/cgi-bin/pl.cgi?488689 this]). I didn't recall having ever seen the field when editing a pub. Sure enough, if you edit this particular publication, the field does not exist. I suspect the field was added to support the project and when it didn't go anywhere it was taken out of the editor, but left in the display. That would mean that the value(s) cannot be removed either. Unless it is a restricted field for project members? No current problem, but a bit of back story might help me understand what would be involved in any clean-up. ../[[User:Holmesd|Doug H]] 10:56, 29 September 2021 (EDT)
 
−
 
 
−
: There was a time when some ISFDB records didn't have "Notes" fields and Wiki pages were used instead. Wiki pages were also used to record more detailed information about certain publications even though Publication records had a Notes field. This caused a number of problems, mostly because the database and the Wiki diverged over time.
 
−
 
 
−
: Once we added Notes fields to all ISFDB records, we started the process of migrating these Wiki-based pages to the database proper -- see the "Wiki Cleanup" section of the [http://www.isfdb.org/cgi-bin/edit/cleanup.cgi Cleanup Reports] menu. Pages which cannot be easily migrated to the database -- typically because they are very long, tangential or contain graphics -- can be left in the Wiki and linked from the database side by entering the URL of the Wiki page as a "Web Page".
 
−
 
 
−
: Once everything has been cleaned up, we will remove the "Bibliographic Comments" link from Publication pages. [[User:Ahasuerus|Ahasuerus]] 12:48, 29 September 2021 (EDT)
 
−
::So the intent is to drop the database field, rather than 'edit' the publications. I'll synch my investigations up to the reports. ../[[User:Holmesd|Doug H]] 13:28, 29 September 2021 (EDT)
 
−
::: No, the intent is to move the information INTO the publication Notes field when possible - so editing the publication is guaranteed - either the notes OR the Web pages links (unless the data is already in both places). The only case where we should still have the wiki page is when the Notes field cannot hold the information due to its complexity. Wiki cleanup is one of the project I had been chipping at for years :) Probably need to give it a final push and clear these... [[User:Anniemod|Annie]] 13:33, 29 September 2021 (EDT)
 
−
 
 
−
::: (after edit conflict) I am not sure I am parsing your response correctly, so let me outline the usual sequence of events:
 
−
:::# Use the [http://www.isfdb.org/cgi-bin/edit/cleanup_report.cgi?101 "Publications with Wiki pages" cleanup report] to identify Publication records with matching Wiki pages. To use the first record displayed on the report as an example, the ISFDB record [http://www.isfdb.org/cgi-bin/pl.cgi?125 2001: A Space Odyssey] matches [http://www.isfdb.org/wiki/index.php/Publication:BKTG23438 this Wiki page].
 
−
:::# Determine whether the Wiki page should be migrated to the Publication record, then:
 
−
:::## In the case linked above, the Wiki page is too long and too complex to migrate to the Note field of the publication record, so we leave it alone. We then enter its URL in the "Web Page" field of the Note.
 
−
:::## If the Wiki page is short, e.g. see [http://www.isfdb.org/wiki/index.php/Publication:GLDTRKHQSV1978 this Wiki page] for an example, we copy the data to the Publication record's Note field. We then delete the Wiki page.
 
−
::: Hope this makes sense! [[User:Ahasuerus|Ahasuerus]] 13:40, 29 September 2021 (EDT)
 
−
:::: One more note: As non-moderators cannot delete pages, when you are done with a page, add [http://www.isfdb.org/wiki/index.php/Template:Deletion_candidate this template] on top of it. That puts in a list for the moderators to zap them later. I think I've seen Doug doing that before but just wanted to make sure the instructions are complete :) [[User:Anniemod|Annie]] 13:44, 29 September 2021 (EDT)
 
−
:::::Your process is clear as far as it goes. Is there a way to mark the Wiki pages that are not to be migrated so they aren't checked repeatedly? But the conversation drifted from the original point. In my example above, the publication displays a field called "Bibliographic Comments" in bold, just after the Notes and before the link to Upload new cover scan. Given the field does not appear on the EditPub page, it is not possible to clear the field. My question about dropping the field was to determine if such values exist in the database. I still don't know if it does and would be cleared, does, but will just be ignored by changing the interface or doesn't exist in the database and is generated automatically by the interface based on the wiki. But if there are no other cleanup steps other than those listed above, I'm okay. ../[[User:Holmesd|Doug H]] 20:05, 2 October 2021 (EDT)
 
−
::::::: For the ones that get deleted, it will disappear as soon as the page is deleted.
 
−
::::::: For the ones staying - once we finish the cleanup, the whole thing will be removed by code base and it will disappear. We already did that for a few types of pages. [[User:Anniemod|Annie]] 20:25, 2 October 2021 (EDT)
 
−
::::::::Is there a list of which one's are staying or does anyone trying this start from scratch? ../[[User:Holmesd|Doug H]] 22:46, 2 October 2021 (EDT)
 
−
 
 
−
::::::::: Wiki-specific cleanup reports ignore Wiki pages whose database counterpart has a matching "Web Page" URL. All you have to do is add the Wiki URL to the database record as a "Web Page" and it should disappear from the cleanup report. [[User:Ahasuerus|Ahasuerus]] 23:18, 2 October 2021 (EDT)
 
−
 
 
−
== Handling ASINs that are no longer valid, and any impact on Fixer ==
 
−
 
 
−
Hi, just FYI, I dunno if you have any thoughts on [[User_talk:Anniemod#No_longer_valid_.28.3F.29_ASIN_-_what_to_do]] - specifically if there's any issues with Fixer and its ASIN database?  Thanks [[User:ErsatzCulture|ErsatzCulture]] 18:25, 2 October 2021 (EDT)
 
−
: Please do not remove ASINs which had been checked to exist at one point post publication even when one of the places which uses them stops recognizing them. Amazon may have created them but they are identifiers elsewhere as well so Amazon forgetting them is NOT a reason to delete them from our data. [[User:Anniemod|Annie]] 19:17, 2 October 2021 (EDT)
 
−
 
 
−
== Artwork on the interior of a dust jacket ==
 
−
 
 
−
Will you comment [[User talk:Nihonjoe#Oathbringer|here]], please. Thanks! ···[[User:Nihonjoe|<font color="darkgreen">日本穣</font>]] · <small>[[Special:Contributions/Nihonjoe|<font color="blue">投稿</font>]] · [[User talk:Nihonjoe|Talk to Nihonjoe]]</small> 12:08, 11 October 2021 (EDT)
 
−
 
 
−
== Author match in the DB ==
 
−
 
 
−
Hi.  I was trying to help with [[ISFDB:Help_desk#Schwarze_Messen:_Dichtungen_und_Dokumente]].  Would you take a look at [http://www.isfdb.org/cgi-bin/mod/submission_review.cgi?5118106 this]?  It's not finding the existing [http://www.isfdb.org/cgi-bin/ea.cgi?5218 Gustav Meyrink] and adds a new one instead, so we end up with to having seemingly identical canonical names.  I assume something's up with the original that I can't see, although I freely admit I could be looking directly at something obvious and am not seeing it....  Tyvm!  --[[User:MartyD|MartyD]] 14:59, 13 October 2021 (EDT)
 
−
 
 
−
: It may be related to the hidden/unexpected Unicode characters in certain fields found by [http://www.isfdb.org/cgi-bin/edit/cleanup_report.cgi?6 this cleanup report]. Let me take a closer look... [[User:Ahasuerus|Ahasuerus]] 17:20, 13 October 2021 (EDT)
 
−
 
 
−
:: Preliminary results: the author name in [http://www.isfdb.org/cgi-bin/mod/submission_review.cgi?5118106 this submission] has two hidden Unicode characters, presumably a copy-and-paste artifact. Continuing the investigation. 17:24, 13 October 2021 (EDT)
 
−
 
 
−
::: Final results: the culprit is the [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Soft_hyphen Soft Hyphen] character in the Latin-1 character set, hex value "AD". I am going to add it to standard ISFDB filter later today. Thanks for helping identify the problem! [[User:Ahasuerus|Ahasuerus]] 17:49, 13 October 2021 (EDT)
 
−
 
 
−
:::: Done. [[User:Ahasuerus|Ahasuerus]] 19:46, 13 October 2021 (EDT)
 
−
 
 
−
== Amazon image link rule ==
 
−
 
 
−
I processed [http://www.isfdb.org/cgi-bin/view_submission.cgi?5119960 this submission], which flagged the image URL <pre>https://m.media-amazon.com/images/M/MV5BMjA5NzkxMjI2NF5BMl5BanBnXkFtZTcwNDczOTA1Nw@@.jpg</pre> perhaps due to the "@@"? I couldn't find anything wrong with the URL, nor did I find any alternative, so I let it through.  It seems to be working properly.  I am mentioning it in case I should not have let it through and need to be set straight or there's a regex/pattern analysis that needs tweaking.... --[[User:MartyD|MartyD]] 08:27, 16 October 2021 (EDT)
 
−
 
 
−
: That was me. Normally if I can only find an Amazon photo which is on Amazon Prime I don't use it because of that yellow warning; I decided to let this one stand because I'd fixed a lot of info for Hardy's record and wanted a photo to go along with it. The photo is in his record now so that warning doesn't seem to be a problem. Also, it took a while for someone to approve this edit; was info I changed verified by someone or was it just approved to get it out of the way? --[[User:Username|Username]] 08:41, 16 October 2021 (EDT)
 
−
 
 
−
:: We currently recognize the following letters after "/images/" in Amazon URLs:
 
−
::* G
 
−
::* I
 
−
::* P
 
−
::* S
 
−
:: Only "I" images are believed to be stable; the rest generate the following yellow warning: ''Note that Amazon URLs which do not start with "/images/I/" may not be stable.''
 
−
:: In this case, it was the fact that the image contained an "M" after "/images/" that generated a warning. I don't know if it's a recent addition to Amazon's menagerie which is supposed to be stable. If we can determine that "M" images are stable, I can add "M" to the list of recognized letters. [[User:Ahasuerus|Ahasuerus]] 10:38, 16 October 2021 (EDT)
 
−
 
 
−
:::@Ahasuerus: Yes, I have seen that warning, but the warning on this one is different: ''Unsupported formatting in an Amazon URL. Only properly structured _CR formatting codes are currently allowed.'', which is what made me suspect the "@@".  FWIW, on https://www.amazon.com/prime-video/actor/Robin-Hardy/nm0362736 the link to that image does include formatting (...Nw@@._V1_SX300_.jpg). --[[User:MartyD|MartyD]] 11:31, 16 October 2021 (EDT)
 
−
 
 
−
:::: The "Unsupported formatting" warning is triggered by any Amazon-hosted image whose URL doesn't start with a "G", an "I", a "P" or an "S". Since this is an "M" URL, it triggered the warning.
 
−
 
 
−
:::: The other warning is for "G", "P" and "S" URLs -- they are grandfathered by our software, but may not be stable in the long run and it may be best to replace them with equivalent "I" images. [[User:Ahasuerus|Ahasuerus]] 11:51, 16 October 2021 (EDT)
 
−
::::: Let me make one of these much stronger - all /P/ images need to be replaced, hopefully while most of the PVs that have books with them are around to verify the covers again. These are ISBN-based links and whatever Amazon sticks on this ISBN is what we get - new printings, an image from a secondary vendor, an image based on a typo in the ISBN of a new book - whatever takes their fancy sometimes. [[User:Anniemod|Annie]] 18:24, 16 October 2021 (EDT)
 
−
:::@Username: I did review the information and decided the edit was ok to accept.  I suspect the submission sat at least in part due to the image link warning (which required research and potentially Wiki talk page communication if the URL needed to be removed or replaced with something else) and more likely due to the change in the birth date and birth place with no explanation, requiring a moderator to go look at the available sources and see if those changes were appropriate.  Submissions requiring more than a minute or two to process often get left for someone with time and inclination.  --[[User:MartyD|MartyD]] 11:31, 16 October 2021 (EDT)
 
−
 
 
−
== Upgrading ISFDB and Testing ==
 
−
 
 
−
If you need any help (for testing or alike), do not hesitate to leave a note.
 
−
 
 
−
I recently read about your problems with python 2.5/openssl.
 
−
Well, currently run python 2.7 with no problems I'm aware of. And openssl 1.02u or 1.1.1k [[User:Elsbernd|elsbernd]] 12:58, 17 October 2021 (EDT)
 
−
 
 
−
: Thanks for volunteering and for sharing your experience with Python 2.7!
 
−
 
 
−
: Al von Ruff is currently looking into upgrading our version of OpenSSL since he was the one who last upgraded it a few years ago and has the experience.
 
−
 
 
−
: On the Python side... I have been delaying upgrading from 2.5 to 2.7 because it will require testing every feature in the system, but the issue with SFE suggests that we may have to bite the bullet and do it sooner rather than later. Probably right after we finish the HTTPS changes. [[User:Ahasuerus|Ahasuerus]] 13:04, 17 October 2021 (EDT)
 
−
:: Given any thought to setting up a test suite and automating some of the testing? There's lots of developers on board, surely we can find a tester to help organize such an effort. ../[[User:Holmesd|Doug H]] 16:49, 17 October 2021 (EDT)
 
−
::: Not to overstate the obvious but I kinda do not see anyone stepping up and offering their help about almost anything. If there is someone who wants to assist in any way or form, I am pretty sure Ahasuerus will be more than happy to find something for them to do (or a way for their pet project to be incorporated). [[User:Anniemod|Annie]] 20:23, 17 October 2021 (EDT)
 
−
 
 
−
:::: Let me first make sure that I understand what "setting up a test suite" means in this context. Does it refer to a set of automated test cases (using something like Selenium) which could then be run on test systems hosted and maintained by individual testers? [[User:Ahasuerus|Ahasuerus]] 09:55, 18 October 2021 (EDT)
 
−
::::: Let me reply by asking if there is a list of every feature to be tested. And a way to test each feature. If these don't exist, there's no point to the automation. If they do, then test cases could be generated and organized into a suite of tests to cover different testing requirements. ../[[User:Holmesd|Doug H]] 23:40, 18 October 2021 (EDT)
 
−
:::::: sourceforge user ErsatzCulture has been working on some scripts using unittest (thread https://sourceforge.net/p/isfdb/feature-requests/1305/ (2019-11-03)). Maybe a little bit outdated. I haven't read the complete discussion but Ahasuerus will remember it. [[User:Elsbernd|elsbernd]] 08:23, 19 October 2021 (EDT)
 
−
::::::: From the sound of it, this is unit/module style testing. I was wondering about more of a user acceptance type of test  (e.g. create a pub, change the contents, variant to something, find it in various lists, unvariant, add a transliterated title, more checking in another browser, delete the pub, check that the (misspelled) illustrator disappears from the database ...). Sounds like another interesting project to put on my list. ../[[User:Holmesd|Doug H]] 15:45, 19 October 2021 (EDT)
 
−
 
 
−
:::::::: That would be nice, but it would require a separate test copy of the ISFDB database/software. We can't realistically set one up on the main server, but it may be possible to do so within a third-party environment like [https://www.pythonanywhere.com/pricing/ Python Anywhere]. The publicly available version of the ISFDB database should probably work OK with their $12/mo plan, although we would need to confirm it.
 
−
 
 
−
:::::::: Also, [[ISFDB_Downloads#Installation_and_Setup]] describes how to set up a clone of the ISFDB database on an arbitrary computer; some of our editors have done it at home. If you want to give it a try, please let me know how it goes and whether the instructions work for you. [[User:Ahasuerus|Ahasuerus]] 17:22, 21 October 2021 (EDT)
 
−
 
 
−
== Nimrod Hunt edit ==
 
−
 
 
−
Please weigh in at [http://www.isfdb.org/wiki/index.php/User_talk:GlennMcG#The_Nimrod_Hunt]. Thanks. --[[User:GlennMcG|GlennMcG]] 16:33, 21 October 2021 (EDT)
 
−
 
 
−
: Done. [[User:Ahasuerus|Ahasuerus]] 17:10, 21 October 2021 (EDT)
 
−
 
 
−
== Author Image Not Matching Publication Tag Warning ==
 
−
 
 
−
Please see the warning message on [http://www.isfdb.org/cgi-bin/view_submission.cgi?5136848 this edit] and [[User_talk:Scifibones#Boles.C5.82aw_Le.C5.9Bmian_photo|this conversation]]. --&nbsp;[[User:JLaTondre|JLaTondre]] ([[User talk:JLaTondre#top|talk]]) 16:43, 30 October 2021 (EDT)
 
−
 
 
−
== Missing Pub Creation History ==
 
−
 
 
−
Can you please see [[User_talk:JLaTondre#Two_questions|this conversion]]? A publication approved today has no edit history and is not showing up in recent edits. Thanks. --&nbsp;[[User:JLaTondre|JLaTondre]] ([[User talk:JLaTondre#top|talk]]) 10:42, 31 October 2021 (EDT)
 
−
 
 
−
: Response posted. [[User:Ahasuerus|Ahasuerus]] 15:21, 31 October 2021 (EDT)
 
−
 
 
−
== Recently Removed Secondary Verifications ==
 
−
 
 
−
Recently Removed Secondary Verifications is giving an error message. See [http://www.isfdb.org/cgi-bin/removed_secondary_verifications.cgi here]. --&nbsp;[[User:JLaTondre|JLaTondre]] ([[User talk:JLaTondre#top|talk]]) 11:28, 31 October 2021 (EDT)
 
−
 
 
−
: Fixed. It was a regression issue introduced as part of the HTTPS migration project. Sorry about that! [[User:Ahasuerus|Ahasuerus]] 14:49, 31 October 2021 (EDT)
 
−
 
 
−
== 12.5 Cents ==
 
−
 
 
−
There are three pubs with a $0.125 price showing up on the Publications with Invalid Prices [http://www.isfdb.org/cgi-bin/edit/cleanup_report.cgi?100 report]. This is actually a valid price for these pubs. See [http://www.philsp.com/data/images/c/cosmopolitan_189307.jpg] and [http://www.philsp.com/data/images/c/cosmopolitan_189308.jpg] for example. I'm not sure how it worked in practice as the [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bit_(money)#United_States bit] was no longer in use by that time as far as I know, but it was the price on the cover. Could the report ignore that price? I think it's likely to be the only odd ball US one and I've seen plenty of valid errors with three decimals so wouldn't want to relax the checking to allow three decimals. --&nbsp;[[User:JLaTondre|JLaTondre]] ([[User talk:JLaTondre#top|talk]]) 11:44, 31 October 2021 (EDT)
 
−
 
 
−
: Originally, my devious plan was to wait until all the bad record were fixed and then add the ability to "ignore" false positives. At the rate we are going -- 600 records fixed in 1 month -- we'll probably get to that point by the end of the year. [[User:Ahasuerus|Ahasuerus]] 15:09, 31 October 2021 (EDT)
 
−
 
 
−
== Author name oddity ==
 
−
 
 
−
Can you check [http://www.isfdb.org/wiki/index.php/ISFDB:Moderator_noticeboard#Mikael_Bourgouin_.3D.3E_Mika.C3.ABl_Bourgouin this] and make sure that this won't cause other issues (and if it does, that loophole needs closing). [[User:Anniemod|Annie]] 19:58, 1 November 2021 (EDT)
 
−
 
 
−
: Done. [[User:Ahasuerus|Ahasuerus]] 11:32, 14 November 2021 (EST)
 
−
 
 
−
== Relative URLs in notes ==
 
−
 
 
−
Hi, could you take a look at http://www.isfdb.org/wiki/index.php/User_talk:ErsatzCulture#World.27s_Edge and add any insight?  That talk item came up when I submitted an edit to try to fix an alleged bad URL that came up in http://www.isfdb.org/cgi-bin/edit/cleanup_report.cgi?82 , which seems to object to relative URLs (NB: I haven't checked the code to see if there's more to it than that) - but that seems to be a bad idea IMHO.  Thanks.
 
−
 
 
−
: Done. [[User:Ahasuerus|Ahasuerus]] 11:31, 14 November 2021 (EST)
 
−
 
 
−
== Interesting double author issue ==
 
−
 
 
−
Please wander by [[ISFDB:Moderator noticeboard#Gorman Book and Other Problems |this discussion]]. Thanks! ···[[User:Nihonjoe|<font color="darkgreen">日本穣</font>]] · <small>[[Special:Contributions/Nihonjoe|<font color="blue">投稿</font>]] · [[User talk:Nihonjoe|Talk to Nihonjoe]]</small> 14:08, 15 November 2021 (EST)
 
−
 
 
−
== Altov & Zhuravlyova, ''Ballad of the Stars'' ==
 
−
 
 
−
Hi Ahasuerus, according to our [http://www.isfdb.org/wiki/index.php/Help:Screen:NewPub#Publication_Type Publication Type] rules under ANTHOLOGY, should [http://www.isfdb.org/cgi-bin/pl.cgi?3560 this] collection be classified an anthology? It has two authors writing separately, with only one story a joint effort. What do you think? [[User:PeteYoung|PeteYoung]] 13:27, 16 November 2021 (EST)
 
−
: For what it is worth, I still think that this is a collection under our rules. [[User:Anniemod|Annie]] 13:51, 16 November 2021 (EST)
 
−
 
 
−
:: Let's see... [[Template:PublicationFields:PubType]] says:
 
−
::* ANTHOLOGY.  A publication containing fiction by more than one author, not written in collaboration, should be typed as an ANTHOLOGY.  For example, "Late Knight Edition" contains stories by both Damon Knight and Kate Wilhelm, individually; this is an anthology, not a collection.  If a book of Conan stories contains stories which are all partly or wholly by Robert E. Howard, it is a collection; '''if one or more of the stories''' is by Lin Carter or L. Sprague de Camp, not in collaboration with Howard, then the book is an anthology.
 
−
:: In this case we have 5 stories by Altov, 3 stories by Zhuravlyova and one co-written story. If I am reading the bolded section above correctly, even a ''single'' non-collaborative story makes a book an anthology under the current rules, which would make it an anthology.
 
−
:: If Annie's interpretation is different, perhaps we could take this discussion to the Community Portal to see how other editors read this part of Help? [[User:Ahasuerus|Ahasuerus]] 15:52, 16 November 2021 (EST)
 
−
::: I could have sworn that the bolded page is not there. Nah - with it there, it is indeed an anthology. I know what happened - I was looking at just the collection definition - and it is not there. [[User:Anniemod|Annie]] 16:03, 16 November 2021 (EST)
 
−
 
 
−
:::: With everyone on the same page, I have changed the title/publication type from COLLECTION to ANTHOLOGY. We may also want to review the Help language to ensure that it's self-consistent. [[User:Ahasuerus|Ahasuerus]] 16:12, 16 November 2021 (EST)
 
−
::::: Possibly. I'd say to have the same example in both type descriptions... The way the collection one reads, one would not even read the rest as it matches. Manages to trip me now and again (I have a deja vu here) :) [[User:Anniemod|Annie]] 16:28, 16 November 2021 (EST)
 
−
 
 
−
== Another non-printable character ==
 
−
 
 
−
See the price [http://www.isfdb.org/cgi-bin/pl.cgi?372820 Die metallenen Herrscher]. It looks fine but it pings on the report. Any time I try to change it, it complains for more than one space. Feels like a weird non-printable space character in the DB. Can you check what is going on? Thanks! [[User:Anniemod|Annie]] 23:02, 16 November 2021 (EST)
 
−
: And another one with the same malady: [http://www.isfdb.org/cgi-bin/pl.cgi?292669 Nie wieder Krieg].[[User:Anniemod|Annie]] 00:30, 17 November 2021 (EST)
 
−
 
 
−
:: Will do. [[User:Ahasuerus|Ahasuerus]] 09:11, 17 November 2021 (EST)
 
−
 
 
−
::: These two prices had adjacent space characters between "DM" and the numerical value. Fixed now. [[User:Ahasuerus|Ahasuerus]] 09:18, 17 November 2021 (EST)
 
−
:::: Two more down, 11 to go :) Thanks! [[User:Anniemod|Annie]] 14:40, 17 November 2021 (EST)
 
−
 
 
−
== Editors vs Authors ==
 
−
 
 
−
Can the new pub and edit pub forms be changed to display Editor instead of Author when it is an anthology or magazine? Seem like it should be pretty straight forward to have JavaScript update the label based on the pub type. The use of Author for these pub types continually confuses new editors. --&nbsp;[[User:JLaTondre|JLaTondre]] ([[User talk:JLaTondre#top|talk]]) 09:17, 25 November 2021 (EST)
 
−
 
 
−
: Let me take a look... [[User:Ahasuerus|Ahasuerus]] 10:22, 25 November 2021 (EST)
 
−
 
 
−
:: It looks doable. {{FR|1469}} "Change 'author' to 'editor' for anthologies, magazines and fanzines" has been created. I'll make the necessary changes it once I am feeling better. [[User:Ahasuerus|Ahasuerus]] 11:59, 25 November 2021 (EST)
 
−
 
 
−
== Ongoing work on HTTPS-Support of ISFDB ==
 
−
Modern browsers like Firefox, Chrome, Edge try to access the HTTPS-port of a site first. You have done a lot of work to support a HTTPS-Implementation in the python code. Thank you for your effort. My own trunk of ISFDB runs this version.
 
−
 
 
−
It seems, that only the actual HTTPS-configuration is missing on the machine. But that's not the case.
 
−
 
 
−
I would like to point to more problems, which could be barriers:
 
−
* The actual browsers accept only TLS versions above 1.1; "Mozilla, Google, Apple and Microsoft have committed to disabling TLS 1.0 and TLS 1.1 as default options for secure connections" ([https://hacks.mozilla.org/2020/02/its-the-boot-for-tls-1-0-and-tls-1-1/ hacks mozilla.org])
 
−
* nmap reports a linux kernel version [https://kernelnewbies.org/Linux_3.2 3.2]: This is quite old, around 2012, I assume. I don't know the real implementation of [www.isfdb.org], but I doubt, that this OS has support for a newer TLS-Version greater than 1.0.x
 
−
* ISFDB uses python 2.5 (correct me, if this isn't the case). I currently run python 2.7(released 2008).18 without any problems. Python 2.7 is EOL January 2021. [https://www.activestate.com/products/python/python-2-7/ ActiveState] has assessed dozens of critical and high severity Python vulnerabilities impacting Python 2 to date.
 
−
* Future OS might drop support of python 2; Python 3 (released 2006) is NOT backwards-compatible.
 
−
* Actual MediaWiki release is [https://releases.wikimedia.org/mediawiki/ 1.37]. www.isfdb.org runs currently [http://www.isfdb.org/wiki/index.php/Special:Version 1.12.0rc1]
 
−
* MySQLdb version 5.0. Actual MySQL version 8 is out. I'm using mariadb 10.3.24 which is compatible to mysql version 5.5
 
−
* haven't looked at the HTTP-Server, but I assume, that it running an old patch level. MediaWiki >=1.36 requires internationalization extension in apache, according to release notes.
 
−
* don't know, if the current letsencrypt will work on the system
 
−
 
 
−
So actually introducing HTTPS-Service would require (IMHO) the following steps:
 
−
* upgrading OS to a current one including web-server
 
−
* upgrading python to at least 2.7
 
−
* upgrading MediaWiki to 1.3x
 
−
* activating letsencrypt
 
−
* working on upgrade-path of python 3 (currently 3.10)
 
−
 
 
−
I may miss a lot of other dependencies.
 
−
 
 
−
But there is although light at the end of the tunnel: Without any problems (I haven't looked in the fancy corners of all ISFDB-Features) current SVN revision 817 runs with python 2.7.18 on MariaDB 10.3, latest Apache 2.4.51, MediaWiki 1.36 (with small modifications)on my more modern OpenIndiana.
 
−
 
 
−
Any suggestions, ideas, what could be done on these problems?
 
−
Any help needed?
 
−
 
 
−
Enough for today and get well soon! [[User:Elsbernd|elsbernd]] 06:47, 28 November 2021 (EST)
 
−
 
 
−
----
 
−
 
 
−
: Many thanks for the overview! I have been sicker than usual the last few weeks and I am still recovering, so I may have to respond in chunks. In no particular order:
 
−
 
 
−
:* I am aware of two potential issues with upgrading our MediaWiki software from 1.12.0rc1 to 1.3x:
 
−
:** The first one is the fact that MediaWiki 1.30 and higher [https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Compatibility#Database requires MySQL 5.5.8 or higher], so we'll need to upgrade the database first. Luckily, it shouldn't be an issue since I have been running MySQL 5.5.17 on the development server with no issues. There has been only one case when a query that worked under 5.5 didn't work under 5.0 and it was easily fixed.
 
−
:** The second one is the fact that we don't have much disk space on the live server. I am forced to run [https://sourceforge.net/p/isfdb/code-svn/HEAD/tree/trunk/scripts/wikitrim.py the Python script wikitrim.py] on a regular (roughly annual) basis. It deletes old revisions of Wiki pages, which frees up enough space and lets us continue to operate. We'll need to test this script under MediaWiki 1.30 to make sure that it doesn't mess up the tables. Alternatively, we'll need to get more disk space. [[User:Ahasuerus|Ahasuerus]] 18:19, 27 November 2021 (EST)
 
−
:* The TLS issue is complicated. We currently use an older version of OpenSSL, which doesn't support TLS 1.2. Moreover, Python 2.5.4 doesn't support outgoing connections over TLS 1.2, which is what prompted {{FR|1451}} "Change the ISFDB software to work with the new SFE Web site". The last line in that FR's Description field reads "I have sent Al a message to see if he may be able to update our OpenSSL". I'll need to ping Al to see if he has had any luck upgrading OpenSSL. It may or may not require upgrading the Linux Kernel, which is also very old and needs to be upgraded anyway. Ditto our Apache server. [[User:Ahasuerus|Ahasuerus]] 18:38, 27 November 2021 (EST)
 
−
:* Upgrading Python from 2.5.4 to 2.7.18 should be relatively simple. Just change the configuration file to use the 2.7.18 executable and re-run all of the use cases, including the background jobs. Upgrading to version 3+ is likely to be a chore, but we'd have to run the automated upgrade tool first to see how much manual work will be required. [[User:Ahasuerus|Ahasuerus]] 18:49, 27 November 2021 (EST)
 
−
:* There is still some Python work that needs to be done before the software is fully ready to work under HTTPS. If you look at function ISFDBTemplates in common/library, you'll notice that many third party URLs start with 'http:' even though their respective sites have migrated to HTTPS, e.g. Deutsche Nationalbibliothek. We also have 114,719 HTTP links to third party Web sites and 411,344 HTTP links to third party-hosted images. Many of these linked third parties support HTTPS, e.g. we have 210,426 links to Amazon images. Ditto Wikipedia links, OCLC links, etc. Clearly, they need to be converted to HTTPS, preferably programmatically. If we don't do it as part of the HTTPS migration, many of our pages will be considered "mixed content" by modern browsers, which can cause problems. [[User:Ahasuerus|Ahasuerus]] 19:04, 27 November 2021 (EST)
 
−
: Based on the list above, here is my tentative plan:
 
−
:* Things that I can do on my end:
 
−
:** Finish updating the Python code and auto-convert the 600,000+ HTTP links in the ISFDB database.
 
−
:** Test the ISFDB software under Python 2.7.18 and fix anything that may be broken.
 
−
:** Possibly install the MediaWiki software on my development server and test the upgrade path. It may take a while since I am not familiar with PHP/MediaWiki beyond tweaking our configuration files some years ago.
 
−
:* Ask Al to stop by and read this discussion. I lack the knowledge and the direct connection to the hosting company to do much about the Linux Kernel, the OpenSSL version, the Apache version or any other OS-level issues. I don't know why our versions are so far behind -- there may be dependencies and backward incompatibilities that I am not aware of. It's also possible that other hosting options may serve our needs better in 2022 and beyond. [[User:Ahasuerus|Ahasuerus]] 19:15, 27 November 2021 (EST)
 
−
----
 
−
::There is no need to act precipitately; please get well soon; Only some short notes:
 
−
::* The [https://sourceforge.net/p/isfdb/code-svn/HEAD/tree/trunk/scripts/wikitrim.py wikitrim.py] stored in scripts/ won't work with MediaWiki 1.36, because [https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Manual:Revision_table  rev_text_id] in mw_revision isn't used any more.
 
−
::* Left a note to [[User:Alvonruff|Al von Ruff]]; Maybe other user, who have discussed these issues, should be invited too?
 
−
::* Maybe someone could have a look on my mysql-scripts in [https://sourceforge.net/p/isfdb/feature-requests/1298/?page=3 isfdb-20211008.zip], updating all references in the (MediaWiki)-Database from http://www.isfdb.org to https://www.isfdb.org and references to other HTTPS-capable-sites, like amazon, dns, ..., which I identified during my own conversion of the database.
 
−
::* Although upgrading to newer OS/Services/Python... won't go smooth, even after intensively testing and wishes. But everyone will give his/her best. :-)
 
−
::* More space, more money. Don't know nothing about costs, running the ISFDB site. Is there any possibility/need to contribute?
 
−
:: --[[User:Elsbernd|elsbernd]] 06:47, 28 November 2021 (EST)
 

Latest revision as of 20:47, 26 April 2024

See User talk:Ahasuerus/Archive for discussions prior to 2024.

PLEASE NOTE:

If you're writing to inform me that you've either added a COVER IMAGE or NOTES to any of my VERIFIED PUBS, please follow THIS LINK and add it to the bottom of the list. A link to the pub record would be appreciated. Once the pub has been reviewed, I'll remove your note from the list. Thanks!

Corrupted publication record

I saw this one on one of the cleanup reports. The software will not allow corrections. Do we need to create a new publication record and delete this one? John Scifibones 08:53, 27 January 2024 (EST)

Could you please clarify what you mean by "the software will not allow corrections"? The External ID field had a very long URL (instead of an ID), which distorted the display in some browsers, but I could still access the "Edit" link by scrolling to the right in Firefox. I then found the right PORBASE ID and replaced the long URL with it. It seems to have fixed the issue. Does it look OK now? Ahasuerus (talk) 10:28, 27 January 2024 (EST)
When I entered the correct PORBASE ID, It reverted back to the incorrect previous link when looking at the Proposed Publication Update Submission' screen. As a result, I cancelled the edit. Not sure why that didn't happen to you. Regardless, it is correct now.
P.S. It probably was allowing the change but the proposed changes column was likely off my screen. Thanks, John Scifibones 12:37, 27 January 2024 (EST)
Oh, I see. I vaguely recall experimenting with HTML tables to ensure that they wouldn't do this at some resolutions, but I think I ran into various technical issues and catch-22s. Ahasuerus (talk) 13:44, 27 January 2024 (EST)

Human-Machines

https://www.isfdb.org/cgi-bin/pl.cgi?17511; Archive.org cover has a price sticker so you may want to find another image to replace the unstable Amazon one that's there now. --Username (talk) 18:22, 2 February 2024 (EST)

Updated, thanks. Ahasuerus (talk) 18:33, 2 February 2024 (EST)

Hidden World

https://www.isfdb.org/cgi-bin/view_submission.cgi?5884849; PDF, cover, Mantong. --Username (talk) 23:14, 7 February 2024 (EST)

Approved, thanks. Ahasuerus (talk) 08:56, 8 February 2024 (EST)

Deryni Magic Question

Hi Ahasuerus -

Annie has posed this question on my talk page. I found that original edits may may have been yours back in 2006. Could you take a peek when you have a moment (and if you can remember why you did something 18 years ago!). Thanks. --Ron ~ RtraceTalk 21:18, 13 February 2024 (EST)

Done. Thanks for the ping. Ahasuerus (talk) 22:49, 13 February 2024 (EST)

What we enter in the "Artist" field

Ahasuerus: The table 'What we enter in the "Artist" field' which you created in your post 11:33, 19 February 2024 (EST) under this thread is very useful. It is much easier to follow and understand than the wording under bullet point "Artist" in Template:PublicationFields:CoverArt. I recently referred to the table for a separate issue about cover artists here.
Could you please add the table to the help page. Teallach (talk) 17:04, 24 February 2024 (EST)

Thanks for the reminder! I have been sick most of the last week and didn't want to touch Rules and Standards discussions until I was back up to 100%. Once I feel better, I'll make sure to check on the R&S page that it's OK to add the table to Help. Thanks. Ahasuerus (talk) 17:50, 24 February 2024 (EST)
No problem. There is no hurry. I am sorry to hear you have been unwell and wish you a speedy recovery. Teallach (talk) 12:47, 25 February 2024 (EST)
Thank you! Ahasuerus (talk) 13:20, 25 February 2024 (EST)

Image backups

Hi,

I see you updated the downloads page to note that image backups are being redone. This reminds me of something that's puzzled me for a while, and which I meant to ask you about months (years?) ago.

Am I right in thinking that when those zips are generated, it's not an incremental backup style thing where you just need to download the changes/deltas, but rather that they are completely regenerated, and that you'd have to download the full set of zips to have an accurate and complete collection? I vaguely recall that at some point in the past, I'd been downloading the zips in a fairly leisurely manner over a period of days/weeks, and had got maybe 80% of the way through them, and then the zips were regenerated, and I assumed that I had to restart the set.

Would it be possible to have a bit more information on the download page about how they work? NB: I haven't actually ever done anything with the zips I downloaded - I rarely run the full Apache website locally, which I imagine is the main intended use case for the image backups - but I always thought they had the potential to be the foundation of an interesting project. Thanks! ErsatzCulture (talk) 04:35, 5 March 2024 (EST)

That's right: the images hosted by Google Drive are a complete copy of the images hosted by the live ISFDB server. I have added a few more details to the description. Does it make more sense now? Ahasuerus (talk) 14:31, 5 March 2024 (EST)
Thanks. What you've added makes sense, but it's still not clear (to me at least) from the text there that the directories all get updated when new zips are created. Are the 0-9/a-f (and the 2 digit subdirectories) just arbitrary hex digits, maybe the first digits of a checksum or something like that? (That question is slightly rhetorical; I imagine I could find the answer out for myself if I looked through the source code.)
If the tarballs had date suffixes, similar to the database backups, then I think that would make it more obvious that the full set needs re-downloading. However, I guess the downside of that is that it would break any existing tooling for downloading the image backups, and that if you weren't careful you might end up with multiple dated tarballs and/or image directories. ErsatzCulture (talk) 18:25, 5 March 2024 (EST)
Oh, oh... OK, I think I see what the problem is. "0-9" and "a-f" are subdirectory names created by the MediWiki software to store uploaded images. I am so used to this naming convention that it never occurred to me that it may be confusing. A blind spot, if you will. Let me edit the page and explain the naming convention. Thanks! Ahasuerus (talk) 19:15, 5 March 2024 (EST)
Ha, I think this is also a blind spot on my part. Because I don't generally upload my own images (I think it must be in single digits) I forgot that that is all handled by the Mediawiki side of things, and it didn't cross my mind that the directory structure of the images was something that wasn't part of the core ISFDB code. Thanks for clarifying! ErsatzCulture (talk) 05:31, 6 March 2024 (EST)

New hotlink site permission

We have permission to hotlink cover images to a new site, possibly. You can see it here. If that is sufficient, can we add it to the list? ···日本穣 · 投稿 · Talk to Nihonjoe 13:18, 21 March 2024 (EDT)

In anticipation of this being acceptable, there is one publication that is currently hotlinking to the site. ···日本穣 · 投稿 · Talk to Nihonjoe 13:29, 21 March 2024 (EDT)
All done. The publication page now credits "Lawrence Dagstine". Template:Image Host Sites has been updated. Thanks. Ahasuerus (talk) 15:58, 21 March 2024 (EDT)
Thanks! ···日本穣 · 投稿 · Talk to Nihonjoe 17:12, 21 March 2024 (EDT)

Place Submission on Hold

After placing a submission on hold, it would be nice if the resultant page had links back to the submission - both the moderator view and the public view. Currently, it only has a link to the Submission List. But usually when I put something on hold, it is because I plan to do something with that submission. Yes, I can just hit the back button to get the moderator view again. But I often want the public view so I can include the link in a question to the submitter so having that on the on hold page would save a click. Thanks. -- JLaTondre (talk) 10:21, 24 March 2024 (EDT)

Thanks, I'll take a look. Ahasuerus (talk) 10:45, 24 March 2024 (EDT)
Done. Hopefully, the layout and the colors look OK. Ahasuerus (talk) 18:07, 24 March 2024 (EDT)
Thank you! Looks fine. -- JLaTondre (talk) 18:52, 24 March 2024 (EDT)
Great! Ahasuerus (talk) 19:00, 24 March 2024 (EDT)

Galactic Central

Given that the ISFDB is currently heavily dependent on Galactic Central images (12k publication images as of last database dump) and they seem to be in no hurry to implement HTTPS, -- JLaTondre (talk) 13:52, 3 April 2024 (EDT)

Last I heard the owner had no plans to convert to HTTPS. It's possible that his plans may change at some point since browser manufacturers continue to add restrictions to HTTP-only sites. Ahasuerus (talk) 14:08, 3 April 2024 (EDT)

have you given consideration to implementing a proxy service? Apache has a mod_proxy module or it's pretty straightforward to implement your own[1]. -- JLaTondre (talk) 13:52, 3 April 2024 (EDT)

Thanks for letting me know about these options. I wasn't aware of them. I'll add it to my list of things to look into, but it's a long list, so I am not sure when I may get to it. Ahasuerus (talk) 14:08, 3 April 2024 (EDT)

Or should we create a clean-up project to start moving these images over to the ISFDB wiki? -- JLaTondre (talk) 13:52, 3 April 2024 (EDT)

It would certainly make things easier, in part because of the HTTPS issue and in part because they would be incorporated into our publicly available backup files. However, 12K images is a lot images to migrate. Do we expect to have enough volunteer man-hours to make it feasible? Ahasuerus (talk) 14:08, 3 April 2024 (EDT)
Part of the price of self-moderation? ../Doug H (talk) 21:53, 3 April 2024 (EDT)
I have been migrating them as I edit pubs that use them. It will be slow going, but the current broken images are not ISFDB user friendly. -- JLaTondre (talk) 08:44, 6 April 2024 (EDT)
I have created FR 1601, "Enhance display of HTTP-served images". Ahasuerus (talk) 10:44, 6 April 2024 (EDT)

Baen ISBNs

Toll of Honor just came out, and we have the ISBN formatted as 978-1-982193-31-7. The back of the book as well as the copyright page have it formatted as 978-1-9821-9331-7. Do we need to look at the code that adds in the dashes? This may affect more than just Baen books. ···日本穣 · 投稿 · Talk to Nihonjoe 17:33, 5 April 2024 (EDT)

Checking the official "ISBN Ranges" page, I see that the hyphenation rules have changed and become more complex. It used to be that the rules for "978-0-" ISBNs had only 6 cases, but now it's up to 21. "978-1- ISBNs also used to have 6 cases, but now they are up to around 50 cases. Other language-specific ISBN rules have also been affected, although not as severely. Let me create a new FR for this change. Thanks for letting me know! Ahasuerus (talk) 17:55, 5 April 2024 (EDT)
FR 1600 "Update the ISBN hyphenation rules" has been created. Ahasuerus (talk) 18:02, 5 April 2024 (EDT)
And done -- see this Community Portal announcement. Ahasuerus (talk) 14:08, 16 April 2024 (EDT)

Murder in Millennium VI

Please see this edit that impacts your verified pub. Let me know if you agree with changing the credit. Thanks. -- JLaTondre (talk) 08:41, 6 April 2024 (EDT)

I don't have this issue handy right now, but the Archive.org copy is readable. Here is what I see:
  • The title page of the review column, "Readin' and Writhin'" (p.46), credits "Damon Knight and the Editor".
  • There are three reviews. The first two, "Murder in Millennium VI" and "Seetee Ship", are not credited. The third one, "Beachheads in Space" on page 67, is signed "RWL".
  • Of the three reviews, only "Murder in Millennium VI" was reprinted in Damon Knight's In Search of Wonder.
  • We currently credit "Damon Knight and Robert A. W. Lowndes" as the authors of the first two reviews and "RWL" as the author of the third review. We then variant them to their actual authors based on reprint history and textual research.
  • The publication record has notes explaining who the actual authors are and what our evidence is, but individual REVIEW records do not.
Based on the above, how about we use "uncredited" as the author of the first two reviews instead of "Damon Knight and Robert A. W. Lowndes"? The current variants would remain in place, but we would copy explanatory notes from the publication record to each title record. What do you think? Ahasuerus (talk) 10:00, 6 April 2024 (EDT)
I pointed Swfritter to this discussion since he has also verified the pub. As you two are the verifiers, I will defer to you both, but your suggestion makes sense to me. -- JLaTondre (talk) 10:08, 6 April 2024 (EDT)
Sounds OK to me. Especially since there will be plenty of documentation.--swfritter (talk) 20:40, 6 April 2024 (EDT)
OK, I think I got it. Thanks! Ahasuerus (talk) 23:37, 6 April 2024 (EDT)
Thanks. Original edit has been rejected with an explanation of the change. -- JLaTondre (talk) 06:56, 7 April 2024 (EDT)

Wily Writers

https://www.isfdb.org/cgi-bin/title.cgi?2112269; The web page link gave me a red warning for not being safe. Also, shouldn't title/variant be 2013, not 2014? --Username (talk) 19:10, 15 April 2024 (EDT)

It gives me a 403 error when I try to visit. There must be something going on with the server there. ···日本穣 · 投稿 · Talk to Nihonjoe 19:43, 15 April 2024 (EDT)
Apparently the "Wily Writers"' Web site died at some point in the late 2010s. Eventually it was picked up by someone else, but the new owners didn't configure their security certificate correctly, hence the security warning displayed by the browser. I have changed the dates from 2014 to 2013 and replaced the affected links with Wayback machine versions. Thanks for the heads-up. Ahasuerus (talk) 20:23, 15 April 2024 (EDT)

How Far Alongside Night?

https://www.isfdb.org/cgi-bin/pl.cgi?428089; I have some edits adding archived links to the Crown and Ace editions of Alongside Night and another adding afterword mentioned in '87 Avon edition's note; searching for the name Konkin and not finding anything I then noticed you entered the essay in this 2013 edition but name is Konklin (as it also is for another essay). So I think after approval the 2 essays should be merged under the name Konkin; the '99 Pulpless edition is on Google Books and it says Samuel Edward Konkin, III so that's how I entered it, not having any copies or photos of the Avon to verify (no page number, of course). --Username (talk) 09:39, 20 April 2024 (EDT)

It was, indeed, a typo. Everything has been approved and merged. I have moved the URL associated with the essay to the Title record and updated Konkin's author page with biographical data and links. Thanks. Ahasuerus (talk) 13:29, 20 April 2024 (EDT)

Space Viking

Adding cover artist, notes and external IDs to your PVd Space Vikings.10:59, 21 April 2024 (EDT) —The preceding unsigned comment was added by SFJuggler (talk • contribs) .

I have approved the submission and expanded the Notes section. One thing to keep in mind is that the dates listed in early Catalog of Copyright volumes are actually "dates of publication as given in the application". It's possible for the actual publication date to be different due to printer- or publisher-originated delays, so I find it useful to add the phrase "date of publication as given in the application" to the Notes field. I have updated the Title record as well. (Later Catalog of Copyright volumes distinguish between "Date of Publication" and "Registration Date", but that's a different kettle of fish.) Thanks! Ahasuerus (talk) 12:45, 21 April 2024 (EDT)

Weird series ordering

On this series, it's not numbering them in order as it ought to. Any ideas why it's switching things around? ···日本穣 · 投稿 · Talk to Nihonjoe 14:16, 24 April 2024 (EDT)

That looks like expected actually - titles and subseries do not mix in the series ordered views so you got all numbered Titles first followed by all numbered subseries. Annie (talk) 14:57, 24 April 2024 (EDT)
That's exactly right. If the ISFDB software displayed numbered titles and numbered sub-series together, then we'd have anomalies like:
  • Book #1
  • Sub-series trilogy #1
    • Book A
    • Book B
    • Book C
  • Book #2
  • Sub-series trilogy #2
    • Book X
    • Book Y
    • Book Z
  • Book #3
That said, titles and sub-series currently use the same offset and font. Perhaps we should make them look different to facilitate distinguishing between the two type of elements that title series can contain. Ahasuerus (talk) 15:12, 24 April 2024 (EDT)
From my view, if the subseries is numbered as part of the series, that numbering should be in order. I can see pushing subseries to the bottom of the main series if they aren't numbered as part of the series. That makes sense. But doing it so that the numbering is 1, 2, 3, 4, 6, 5, 7 doesn't make any sense and will likely cause confusion for anyone viewing the page because people generally expect numbered things to be in order. ···日本穣 · 投稿 · Talk to Nihonjoe 16:18, 24 April 2024 (EDT)

(unindent) (I have moved the discussion of archive.org-derived information to ISFDB:Research_Assistance#Moribito_series). Ahasuerus (talk) 20:16, 24 April 2024 (EDT)

After mulling it over and running a few database searches, I am beginning to suspect that we may have two different scenarios here. The first one can be seen on this Series page for Jonathan Maberry's Pine Deep. The original trilogy (2006-2008) is numbered 1-3. There is a follow-up series, Monk Addison, which an editor tried to configure -- cumulatively -- as number 4 in the main series. It didn't work too well because the sub-series appears after various unnumbered short fictions titles within the main series.

The second scenario can be found here. Gotrek and Felix consists of 17 novels and a few dozen works of short fiction. It also contains 3 sub-series for the 3 different omnibus editions of the main series. The sub-series are numbered 1, 2 and 3 and appear at the bottom of the page, i.e. after the short fiction. Unlike the Pine Deep scenario, this is, unambiguously, the expected behavior since the omnibus sub-series are not part of the main numbering scheme.

If my understanding is correct, then the ISFDB software currently supports the second scenario, but not the first one. Does this sound about right? Ahasuerus (talk) 20:32, 24 April 2024 (EDT)

Yes, that seems accurate. ···日本穣 · 投稿 · Talk to Nihonjoe 20:43, 24 April 2024 (EDT)
I guess the next question is what we can do about this situation. Let me sleep on it... Ahasuerus (talk) 21:13, 24 April 2024 (EDT)
No bright ideas so far, I am afraid. I can't think of a way to accommodate these two different scenarios using the database fields that we currently have. Maybe something will germinate over the next few days. Ahasuerus (talk) 14:34, 25 April 2024 (EDT)
How about an obvious solution: add a flag/checkbox on the series page which tells the software if it needs to show series and titles mixed based on the numbers OR if they need to be kept separate? With the default being showing them separately (aka "things as they stand now"). Annie (talk) 17:32, 25 April 2024 (EDT)
PS: Oops. Did not see your note about using existing DB fields. You know... maybe we can use the "Series Parent Position" creatively? Add a letter to the number if you want them to sort inside of the titles series (so instead of 1, use 1M (for mixed))? Annie (talk) 17:34, 25 April 2024 (EDT)
And we do not even need to show that weird numbering scheme to the editors - make that the DB field value but change the UI to actually show a checkbox. Or something along these lines. The only thing that may be a bit of a hassle is that this field is actually integer, right? So... add an big number to the actual value and drop it for sorting? So instead of 1, record 1001 (how many series we need that need 1000 as a number on the series order?). Annie (talk) 17:38, 25 April 2024 (EDT)
Re: "flag/checkbox on the series page which tells the software if it needs to show series and titles mixed based on the numbers OR if they need to be kept separate", it's possible for a series to have both types of sub-series. The first type covers sub-series which should be treated as titles for ordering purposes. The second type covers sub-series which should be displayed after all regular titles, including unnumbered titles. If a new flag is to be implemented, it will presumably need to be added to each sub-series, specifying what kind of sub-series it is.
That said, I think the first thing that we need to do is to determine what kind of impact having certain sub-series displayed within the main title sequence would have. A few things come to mind:
  • We have a cleanup report that finds duplicate series numbers within a series. It would presumably need to be enhanced to look for duplicate numbers of the new type (or a new cleanup report will need to be created.)
  • Having a long sub-series -- especially if it has nested sub-series of its own -- appear in the middle of numbered titles could make it harder for our users to understand what the actual order of the main series is. For certain major universes like Warhammer, the resulting "series tree" could be overwhelming.
  • Development considerations. Currently the software module responsible for displaying series (a) calls itself recursively AND (b) shares code with our Bibliographic pages. It's a delicate and messy area which is high on my list of things to rewrite once I am done with Fixer migration. Adding additional complexity to it before the code is rewritten may not be optimal.
Ahasuerus (talk) 20:49, 25 April 2024 (EDT)

Japanese collaboration

I haven't asked them yet, but one of the authors in our database was the creator of the Japanese SF Book Database and the Japanese SF Magazine Database. He's in his 90s now, and I wondered if I should reach out to him to see if he (or one of his colleagues) might be interested in entering all the information from those databases into ISFDB in order to make it more broadly accessible (since most people outside of Japan have never heard of his two databases). I don't know what their database system is, but there might even be a way to (at least partially) automate the transfer of information. I know they've had some database issues recently so their sites aren't working properly, so I think it's even more important to try to get that information into ISFDB before he dies. Thoughts? ···日本穣 · 投稿 · Talk to Nihonjoe 17:46, 25 April 2024 (EDT)

The idea certainly has merit. Here are some steps that come to mind:
  • We'll need to determine whether the current database owners/maintainers are able and willing to share the data. There may be pre-existing obligations or commitments which may prevent them from sharing the data.
  • The fact that the Web site is currently partially non-functional raises a flag. We'll need to determine whether they have coherent database backups and database documentation. We'll also need to know how many records the backups contain.
  • If they have a coherent database backup and are willing to share it, then it's likely that we should be able to use it. Directly importing data into the ISFDB database would be suboptimal, in part because it would leave us without Edit History, but creating Fixer-style submissions using their data should be viable. We have a number of people with software development backgrounds who may be interested in working on this task.
  • The ISFDB Web API supports putting submissions on hold on behalf of a moderator. We'll probably want to hold these submissions for moderators who have a working knowledge of Japanese.
Based on the above I would suggest that we start by contacting the owners/maintainers to get answers to the first two issues listed above. Ahasuerus (talk) 18:24, 25 April 2024 (EDT)
Okay, I'll start by doing that. An additional thing to consider is instances where we already have one of the titles in ISFDB. I guess that could be handled by the existing duplicate checker. ···日本穣 · 投稿 · Talk to Nihonjoe 12:47, 26 April 2024 (EDT)
True, although whoever ends up doing development work for this project will presumably have a local copy of the ISFDB database. It should be possible to query it to see if the data is already on file. Ahasuerus (talk) 13:22, 26 April 2024 (EDT)

The Shadow of Heaven

Hello Ahasuerus, I'm following up on this conversation and will be adding this pub to Gollancz SF Series (6). Regards, Kev. --BanjoKev (talk) 18:39, 26 April 2024 (EDT)

Sounds good! Ahasuerus (talk) 20:47, 26 April 2024 (EDT)
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