User talk:Ofearna/Archive17

Realms of Fantasy, August 2006

Can you confirm the title of the story by Darrell Schweitzer in this issue? Locus1 titles it only as "Hero", and some sources title it as "The Hero Spoke". Thanks for looking. Mhhutchins 22:05, 25 May 2013 (UTC)

The Table of Contents says "Hero", but the story itself states "The Hero Stroke" Susan O'Fearna 04:22, 4 May 2015 (UTC)

Reflections in the Nile

You didn't give the source for your data in this record, so I added a couple of sources to the Note field. Secondary sources must be noted for all publication records. Thanks. Mhhutchins 13:51, 2 August 2014 (UTC)

I was just trying to get the book in to the database so I could add my book-club edition to the record... Susan O'Fearna 17:39, 27 August 2014 (UTC)

Smashwords

Re this publication: Smashwords is not a publisher. They just facilitate authors to self-publish their own work. Is Smashwords explicitly credited as the publisher in your copy of the ebook file? Thanks for checking. Mhhutchins 04:18, 10 September 2014 (UTC)

this is all the copyright info:

A Family Affair

Karen Chance

Smashwords edition

Copyright 2011 Karen Chance.

Susan O'Fearna 05:14, 10 September 2014 (UTC)

The Valdemar Companion

Re this record: If Lackey and Greenberg are not credited on the title page, they should not be credited as editors of the publication. Copyrights should not be used as a basis to assign author/editor credit unless there is no credit anywhere else in the publication. Mhhutchins 16:24, 18 September 2014 (UTC)

It's been a couple of days, so I've removed the credit based on the OCLC record and the Amazon "look-inside", neither of which show that Lackey or Greenberg are credited on the book's title page. If this is incorrect, please let me know. Mhhutchins

I put in the notes where I got Lackey & Greenberg, but I guess since they're not on the title page (sorry I did NOT see this note) they don't get credit even if they're on the copyright page... Susan O'Fearna 22:14, 24 September 2014 (UTC)

The Gray Prince cover scan

I uploaded a new version of this cover scan used by this pub record that I have verified. I'm notifying you because my new version of the image shows a completely different cover than the version you uploaded in 2012. Since the 2012 version of the image depicts the Coronet edition cover (same as this image), I guess it got uploaded by accident. Cheers, Patrick -- Herzbube ^Talk 13:07, 21 September 2014 (UTC)

Is there any way you can find out the cover artist then check with the primary verify-er and fix the record for the cover you just uploaded b/c it is NOT Jim Burns... Susan O'Fearna 19:46, 23 September 2014 (UTC)

Offerman vs Offermann

Hi, can you please check on your copy of Ghost Knight if it is indeed Andrea Offerman or whether it is Andrea Offermann? The covers look strikingly similair....--Dirk P Broer 22:44, 20 October 2014 (UTC):)

I'll do that. Susan O'Fearna 07:29, 25 October 2014 (UTC)

Price changes to Tanya Huff "Blood" eBooks

You submitted price and pubnote changes for the following

publication	from	to	existing pubnote	proposed pubnote
NOS4A2	$12.99	$12.85	ASIN: B009NF6Z2K. Amazon Kindle's page count 709. Data from Amazon.com as of 2014-06-30. Price from Barnes & Noble as of 2014-06-30	EPub Edition ©May 2013
Blood Price	$7.99	$5.99	ASIN: B004W5MFEI. Amazon Kindle's page count 273. Data from Amazon.com as of 2014-12-19. Price from Barnes & Noble as of 2014-03-14	©1991 by Tanya Huff DAW Collectors No. 8503 release date for e-book edition from Amazon.com
Blood Trail	$7.99	$5.99	ASIN: B004W5MFFC. Amazon Kindle's page count 304. Data from Amazon.com as of 2014-12-19. Price from Barnes & Noble as of 2014-03-14	©1992 by Tanya Huff DAW Collectors No. 873 release date per Amazon.com
Blood Lines	$7.99	$5.99	ASIN: B004W5MFFM. Amazon Kindle's page count 275. Data from Amazon.com as of 2014-12-19. Price from Barnes & Noble as of 2014-03-14	©1993 by Tanya Huff DAW Collectors No. 901 release date from Amazon.com
Blood Pact	$7.99	$5.99	ASIN: B004W5MFES. Amazon Kindle's page count 336. Data from Amazon.com as of 2014-12-19. Price from Barnes & Noble as of 2014-03-14	©1993 by Tanya Huff DAW Book Collectors No. 931 release date from Amazon.com none of these 5 books, in e-book format, have cover images associated with the file itself

Generally on ISFDB we would create a new publication (using clone-pub) if a publication is available at a new price unless there's strong evidence we are using a price that a publication was never sold for. For example, sometimes prior to publication a publisher will announce an upcoming book will be available an a certain price but it's released at a different price. When I see that I'll add a note that explaining that "On 2015-01-12 the publisher announced it would be $13.95 but it was released 2015-04-05 at $14.99." The goal is that we try to not loose information.

I'm also concerned that you want to edit the pubnotes to remove what appears to be valid information regarding sources of data.

On the last of the five submissions you included in your version of the pubnotes "none of these 5 books, in e-book format, have cover images associated with the file itself". I suspect that note should go on each of the records and also for you to specify which eBook reader you are using. It's possible a cover image is available on a Kindle but not a Nook. Also, as information about eBooks seems to change rapidly and may well vary from source to source or device to device that we likely should include the both the date and source when documenting things in the notes.

At present I have all five submissions on hold as you may have a reason for making the proposed changes. I suspect though we should reject all five and to instead convert them into clone-publications at the new prices and with your notes on the new records. --Marc Kupper|talk 23:02, 8 April 2015 (UTC)

I think prices from amazon or b&n for e-books should be left blank -- unless you're buying the book from the publisher, the price can vary and there is never a price "printed" on the book.

Also, about page counts, since you can edit your own fonts and some e-readers have bigger screens, the page count is arbitrary, I like to leave it blank.

Also, since the copyright "page" of many e-books that are basically scans of the print book, and they have the original ISBN number shown the ASIN number is only from Amazon, shouldn't the ASIN not be included unless it was a Amazon/Kindle-only available item? Like Nina Hoffman's newer re-prints of some of her newer yet still oop stories?

if anything is specifically different and there are notes, like in the NOS4A2, should I create a new record for this version of the ebook?

as for the "blood" books by Tanya Huff, the e-books don't have cover pages/screens, they just start with a title page, but the sellers (smashwords/amazon/B&N) have "cover images" from the book that was basically scanned. The notes were already there or added by someone else since I like to use the list option for various I was just making changes (you have them on hold) to match the info IN the epub file ... not sure how you want that handled.

well, please LMK :D Susan O'Fearna 23:23, 21 April 2015 (UTC)

Sorry on the delay. For NOS4A2

1. I accepted your submission. This changes the price on the record from $12.99 to $12.85 which you has submitted. Somewhere along the line you or someone else had submitted another edit that changed the publication notes to "EPub Edition ©May 2013" which is what you wanted.
2. I cloned the record to create 514218 which has the original $12.99 price and publication notes. Normally we would have rejected your submission and cloned a new record priced at $12.99. As you had already verified the original record and another moderator allowed you change the publication notes I did this one backwards from the normal practice.
3. I cloned the record again to create 514223 which has the current the $10.99 price from Amazon. I set the publication date on this record to 0000-00-00 as this is a "later printing" done at an unknown date. We don't know when the publisher changed the price to $10.99.

I'll tackle the blood books either on Saturday or Sunday as it's late in the evening and I need to be up early.

With dead-tree books we create a separate publication record if anything about the book is different. For example, we would create a new record if the cover art changes, the price changes, the printing number changes, etc. E-books are a bit tricky in that it seems customers are getting exactly the same data file regardless of the list price at the time of purchase and that they don't have a printing number line. For a long time we did not allow for eBook submissions to ISFDB at all due to the verifiability issues they created. I suspect we should start an ISFDB:Community Portal or Rules and standards discussions thread to take up your suggestion of leaving the price blank as the eBook files don't seem to have a price printed on them. --Marc Kupper|talk 04:43, 9 May 2015 (UTC)

I have started Rules and standards discussions#Leave the publication price field blank for ebooks?. You are welcome to contribute to that thread. --Marc Kupper|talk 05:06, 9 May 2015 (UTC)

I did not get a chance to tackle the blood books over the weekend but in summary believe what I'll do to reject all four submissions and to replace them with clone-publications using the data you are providing. You would need to shift the primary-verified from the existing records to the new ones. The overall goal is we never should be removing information from ISFDB. Even in those cases where I have seen wrong information I'll handle it by adding a note documenting the information that was wrong plus data sources used to and reasoning that lead to why I removed it from the record. In that case I'm moving the information from something like the price or cover artist field to the notes but am still not deleting it entirely. --Marc Kupper|talk 08:05, 11 May 2015 (UTC)

I'll wait for them to disappear from my pending and then I'll do that, thanks Susan O'Fearna 16:31, 11 May 2015 (UTC)

I finally cleared this off the queue.

• Blood Price - Pub-edit of 494363 canceled and instead cloned to 516595.
• Blood Trail - Pub-edit of 494364 canceled and instead cloned to 516596.
• Blood Lines - Pub-edit of 494362 canceled and instead cloned to 516597.
• Blood Pact - Pub-edit of 494354 canceled and instead cloned to 516598.

For each of the Blood books please change the primary verification to "none" for you in the original record and instead you can verify the new records.

I added a note to each of the new publication records with "The e-book delivered to customers does not have a cover image. The cover image shown in this ISFDB record is from the Amazon page for the publication." The prices are getting messy. Amazon has removed the "Price set by the publisher" message they had a couple of weeks ago and now are only showing the print list price and a discounted price. At the moment it's Blood Price $5.90, Blood Trail $5.99, Blood Lines $6.29, and Blood Pact $5.99. --Marc Kupper|talk 20:42, 23 May 2015 (UTC)

Susan, I looked at the publisher's web site and am thinking we should not have records at $5.99 unless we can show that the publisher's list price was $5.99. We have never documented discounted prices on ISFDB. Here's a table of what's available from the publisher's web site for Tanya Huff's Blood books:

Title	tp	pb	e-book
Blood Price	$15.00	$7.99	$7.99
Blood Trail	$15.00	$7.99	$7.99
Blood Lines	$15.00	$7.99	$7.99
Blood Pact	$15.00	$7.99	$7.99
Blood Debt	$15.00	$7.99	$7.99
Blood Bank	N/A	$7.99	N/A

--Marc Kupper|talk 21:28, 23 May 2015 (UTC)

Fear of/the Darkness

You want to variant these records, but the note to the moderators states "Fear *the* darkness is not the same as Fear *of* darkness". If they're not the same they should not be varianted, but considered two separate stories. Mhhutchins 01:18, 2 May 2015 (UTC)

Perhaps you meant to say that the titles are different and that they're the same storiy. That's understood when you want to variant a work which was published under two different titles. I've accepted the submission. Let me know if they're NOT the same work. Mhhutchins 05:47, 2 May 2015 (UTC)

You rejected my first submission to variant them based on titles being the same. it's the same chapterlet/story but in one instance of its appearance it was titled Fear of Darkness instead of Fear the Darkness... Susan O'Fearna 03:36, 4 May 2015 (UTC)

No, I rejected the first submission because, as I stated in my rejection, "New parent title is identical to the supposed variant". The variant submission form consists of two different functions. An editor must make sure to click on the submit button for the function of the form they're using. The top function variants a record to an existing record. The bottom function creates a new parent record. If you complete the top portion and click on the bottom submit button, you create a parent record which is identical to the variant. I had no choice but to reject. Mhhutchins 04:03, 4 May 2015 (UTC)

Seems to be the way it needs to be now... thanks Susan O'Fearna 18:43, 5 May 2015 (UTC)

Reflections in the Nile

Re this publication: I changed the publisher to "Warner Books / BCE", moved the retail edition's ISBN from the ISBN/Catalog number field to the Note field, and added the book club's ID number to the ISBN/Catalog number field. The same ISFDB standards for the SFBC apply for editions from other book clubs ran by Bookspan. Thanks. Mhhutchins 01:36, 5 May 2015 (UTC)

Re the synopsis added to this title: Please give the source for it, unless you wrote it yourself (it reads like a publisher's blurb.) Mhhutchins 01:39, 5 May 2015 (UTC)

Thanks for fixing the ISBN/BCE #... and the synopsis? I wrote it on the fly while entering it! :D Susan O'Fearna 18:03, 5 May 2015 (UTC)

Landscapes of the Imagination

Hello, can you check if the title of this pub is _Landscapes of the Imagination_ as entered of _Landscape of the Imagination_ as per cover? Thanks. Hauck 19:34, 5 May 2015 (UTC)

Dang, you're right... I think I fixed it where it needs...? Susan O'Fearna 19:39, 5 May 2015 (UTC)

Charles de Lint master series

What is your source of having Newford, Cerin Songweaver, and Wildlings as part of a super-series? I cold find nothing about this on the author's website. Thanks. Mhhutchins

If you've read the books, and I put it in the notes, the super-series is obvious. Like the "universe" encompassing several series but not really having a NAME for the Universe? Cerin & Meran went to Santa Feliz, CA ("The Drowned Man's Reel") then moved to Newford. The Wildlings takes place in Santa Feliz. Several of the characters from the Newford series appear in passing or are mentioned in the other books. I'm gonna start a re-read of all his stuff, I can put those cross-over notes in the title notes?

Susan O'Fearna 23:32, 6 May 2015 (UTC)

The part I'm uncomfortable about is the name given to this "universe". If it's not authorized (as in author-sanctioned), it wouldn't be right for the ISFDB to create a name. Surely the author must have documented this somewhere and given it a name, or even acknowledged its existence. I'm afraid others might start using the name based on the authority of the ISFDB itself, and that's beyond our purpose. I'll accept the submissions, but ask that you create add notes to the super-series, supplying a rationale for its existence. Mhhutchins 00:19, 8 May 2015 (UTC)

Of course, I've already done that with several (again, check "The Drowned Man's Reel") Thanks Susan O'Fearna 01:46, 8 May 2015 (UTC)

Xaviere Daumarie / Angilram

You created a pseudonym, but didn't create variants. As has been brought to your attention before, creating pseudonyms and making variants of titles credited to a pseudonym are two different functions. Doing one doesn't automatically do the other. It must be done manually. Please go to the summary page for Angilram and create a variant for every title to one crediting the canonical name, Xaviere Daumarie. Mhhutchins 06:11, 7 May 2015 (UTC)

I was waiting for the psedonym to be approved... Susan O'Fearna 16:50, 7 May 2015 (UTC)

You don't have to wait. As I said, it's two different functions. One has nothing to do with the other. You can variant records immediately after making the submission to create a pseudonym without waiting for the submission to be approved. Mhhutchins 18:40, 7 May 2015 (UTC)

I don't think I did that right... Susan O'Fearna 01:47, 8 May 2015 (UTC)

Deadly Forecast

Hello, Susan! I have put your submission for adding an ebook on hold. Shouldn't the publisher be Obsidian Mystery / New American Library as with the other publications? Stonecreek 03:45, 11 May 2015 (UTC)

Nope, copyright page states that the print editions were NAL, but not this one...

Thanks for that, I'll approve of it. Christian Stonecreek 04:12, 11 May 2015 (UTC)

cool, should I delete those 2 scans? Susan O'Fearna 04:16, 11 May 2015 (UTC)

Yes, they don't seem to be needed anymore. Christian Stonecreek 12:49, 12 May 2015 (UTC)

It says "an imprint of New American Library" quite clearly. The record should match other publications from this imprint. Or am I misunderstanding the reason for this discussion? 00:45, 14 May 2015 (UTC)

Twa Corbies

With this submission you would make one title into a variant of another, seemingly identical title. There are two ways to avoid this: 1) Merging the two instead and add a note to the title that explains the differences. 2) Credit the graphic format also to Vess, which would demand a discussion with the other verifiers of the related publications. Christian Stonecreek 13:03, 12 May 2015 (UTC)

it's a variant b/c the graphic version is not identical to the prose version -- they're the same story, but variations thereof Susan O'Fearna 16:34, 12 May 2015 (UTC)

I'll reject the submission: in either case it would be superfluous. I'd recommend to submit a merger and add a note to the title: after all, the same story is told in both cases, though with less words in the graphic format, it seems. Christian Stonecreek 03:35, 13 May 2015 (UTC)

OK Susan O'Fearna 05:11, 13 May 2015 (UTC)

Sorry, I have to disagree. The records for these two versions of the same story should not be merged unless the text is basically the same. If the graphic version has substantially different text (most graphic adaptations severely abridges the text of the original story), the records should be neither merged nor varianted. The variant function should not be used to establish a relationship between two works unless there is a change in either title or author credit. A change in text is not covered under the variant function. The record of the graphic version should remain separate, but be updated with a "Graphic Format" flag. Mhhutchins 00:52, 14 May 2015 (UTC)

Yes, that's even better. Thanks, Michael! Stonecreek 03:49, 14 May 2015 (UTC)

Thanks; I knew if the "variant" option didn't work I sure wasn't merging them! Susan O'Fearna 06:38, 14 May 2015 (UTC)

Maybe one day we'll get a "relationship" function, but until then... Mhhutchins 17:01, 15 May 2015 (UTC)

looks like it'll stay as-is for now. Susan O'Fearna 18:45, 15 May 2015 (UTC)

Art series ...

... aren't supported and won't display, so maybe it's better to cancel your submissions for them. At an earlier time I also would have liked such a Feature, but now I'm glad that it wasn't installed. If you like, you may well ask for a support, for example at the help desk. Christian Stonecreek 05:49, 15 May 2015 (UTC)

HUH? Susan O'Fearna 06:17, 15 May 2015 (UTC)

Art series...again

As stated above, art records can not be placed into series. When you attempted to do this a few days ago, I rejected them and gave the reason why. It would be a good idea to go to your rejected edits list every now and again to see which submissions have been rejected. In most cases, the moderator will note the reason why the submission was rejected (if they don't leave a message on your talk page.) Mhhutchins 16:56, 18 May 2015 (UTC)

But *some* of the "zombie cards" are already in the Rot & Ruin series, just trying to be consistent. Also, the "huh" on the previous message meant I had no idea what you were trying to say.

Susan O'Fearna 17:10, 18 May 2015 (UTC)

That was another moderator, but I will try to explain. If you look at the artist's summary page for Rob Sacchetto, you will see that none of the INTERIORART records are displayed as part of a series. That's because the software doesn't allow the display of art records in a series on an author/artist summary page. It would be the same whether the record is COVERART or INTERIORART. So even though you can update art records and add series data for the next century, none of them will be displayed on the artist's page. The quirk is that they are displayed in the series list, which makes for a very messy list, IMHO. It's possible that the software could be "fixed" to display art series, but I don't believe that there is legitimate reason to combine art records to text records. If you believe differently (as obviously you do), please start a discussion on the Rules & Standards discussion page. You might be able to convince enough editors and moderators to make it happen. Whether it's actually possible to change the software is beyond my knowledge. Thanks. Mhhutchins 17:25, 18 May 2015 (UTC)

I believe that it should show up on the series list, but if you don't maybe you can remove the 5 or so that are already there? Susan O'Fearna 17:31, 18 May 2015 (UTC)

Barlowe's Guide to Fantasy

Re this publication: If the publication is credited to "Wayne Douglas Barlowe", then the illustrations should be as well...unless it explicitly credits "Wayne Barlowe" for the interior illustrations. Also, the roman numeral in the page count field shouldn't be capitalized. Thanks. Mhhutchins 05:19, 26 May 2015 (UTC)

thanks... Susan O'Fearna 16:33, 26 May 2015 (UTC)

Now go to the summary page for Wayne Douglas Barlowe and variant each of the new titles you just created. Click on the title, choose "Make This Title a Variant Title or Pseudonymous Work" link under the Editing Tools menu, and at the bottom of the next screen change "Wayne Douglas Barlowe" to "Wayne Barlowe". Then click the "Create New Parent Title" button. This will move the titles from the pseudonym's page to the canonical's page. Thanks. Mhhutchins 16:43, 26 May 2015 (UTC)

Linking using standard HTML

A few of your title record links are coming up as invalid because you're not adding the quotation marks around the URL. Even though some browsers are able to read the HTML and link correctly, others may not.

For example in this record you link to

<a href=http://www.isfdb.org/cgi-bin/pe.cgi?1154><b>Witch-World Saga</b></a>

when it should be

<a href="http://www.isfdb.org/cgi-bin/pe.cgi?1154"><b>Witch-World Saga</b></a>

It's also not a good idea to nest other HTML attributes within the link, as you've done with the bolding of the title. The display of the link is sufficient to separate the linked text from the non-linked text. Mhhutchins 19:13, 26 May 2015 (UTC)

ok Susan O'Fearna 23:13, 27 May 2015 (UTC)

Colleen Doran's A Distant Soil

I had to create a new sub-series for the graphic novels because the numbering conflicted with Immigrant Song and Knights of the Angels. If these two titles are comic book issues and are not graphic novels (whether they're created by combining issues or not), they are not eligible for the database. That's why I had to reject your submission to add a record for A Distant Soil #29. For example, the graphic novel of Alan Moore's Watchmen is eligible for the database but the 12 individual issues of the comic books series from which it was formed are not. That's the job of a comic books database, and we just can't compete, and shouldn't be expected to. Thanks. Mhhutchins 19:25, 26 May 2015 (UTC)

So, how do I get the short stories that were published in issues 27-30? (these are prose stories included w/minimal illustration)

1. 27 = A Matter of Dreams by Sharon Lee & Steve Miller
2. 28 = Red Cloak by Ellen Kushner
3. 29 = The Tragedy of King Arthur the Stag by Delia Sherman
4. 30 = Of The Driving Away of A Certain Water Monster By The Virtues of The Holy Clan or What Really Happened At Loch Ness In The Summer of 565 A.D. by Bud Websters

Susan O'Fearna 19:38, 26 May 2015 (UTC)

Three of them are already in the database. I'll create a title record for the other one. Then you can add notes to each of their title records, giving publication data for their appearance in the comic book. Mhhutchins 20:04, 26 May 2015 (UTC)

cool, thanks Susan O'Fearna 20:26, 26 May 2015 (UTC)

Here is a record for the Sherman story. I've added notes. Feel free to elaborate. Mhhutchins 20:43, 26 May 2015 (UTC)

Correcting links in the content title records

As noted above about using standard HTML, please correct the links in 22 title records in the contents of this publication. Thanks. Mhhutchins 06:28, 27 May 2015 (UTC)

Also, there remain two content records, the introduction and the sketchbook, which have yet to be varianted to the artist's canonical name. Mhhutchins 06:38, 27 May 2015 (UTC)

On it :D Susan O'Fearna 23:13, 27 May 2015 (UTC)

Done! Susan O'Fearna 08:21, 28 May 2015 (UTC) :D

Unpublished

Hi, to answer your question: We use 8888-00-00 as the publication date to mark something "unpublished". We use 9999-00-00 as the publication date to mark something "forthcoming". How you could have known that on your own, I can't say. I couldn't find the information in the help. I'm sure it's there somewhere.... Anyway, I modified Book 2: The World Below to use 8888-00-00, and you'll see it is now marked "unpublished". --MartyD 16:34, 28 May 2015 (UTC)

p.s. I also modified the publication to match, since having a publication date there makes no sense with an "unpublished" title.... --MartyD 16:37, 28 May 2015 (UTC)

Cool, thanks ! Susan O'Fearna 18:11, 28 May 2015 (UTC)

Barlowe's Guide to Extraterrestrials

The titles contained in this publication have to be varianted to Wayne Barlowe. Thanks. Mhhutchins 03:35, 31 May 2015 (UTC)

I'm working on it... we had no internet in northern arizona on Friday and I'm out and about all days most saturdays Susan O'Fearna 04:08, 31 May 2015 (UTC)