ISFDB:Help desk

Jump to navigation Jump to search

ISFDB Discussion Pages and Noticeboards
Before posting to this page, consider whether one of the other discussion pages or noticeboards might suit your needs better.
If you're looking for help remembering a book title, check out the resources in our FAQ.
Please also see our Help pages.
Help desk
Questions about doing a specific task, or how to correct information when the solution is not immediately obvious.
• New post • Archives
Verification requests
Help with bibliographic, image credit, and other questions which require a physical check of the work in question.
• New post • Archives
Rules and standards
Discussions about the rules and standards, as well as questions about interpretation and application of those rules.
• New post • Rules changelog • Archives
Community Portal
General discussion about anything not covered by the more specialized noticeboards to the left.
• New post • Archives
Moderator noticeboard
Get the attention of moderators regarding submission questions.
• New post • Archives • Cancel submission
Roadmap: For the original discussion of Roadmap 2017 see this archived section. For the current implementation status, see What's New#Roadmap 2017.

Archive Quick Links
Archives of old discussions from the Help desk.

1 · 2 · 3 · 4 · 5 · 6 · 7 · 8 · 9 · 10 · 11 · 12 · 13 · 14 · 15 · 16 · 17 · 18 · 19 · 20 · 21 · 22 · 23 · 24 · 25 · 26 · 27 · 28 · 29 · 30 · 31 · 32 · 33 · 34 · 35

Expanded archive listing

Star Trek series vs publication series

I've started PVing my Star Trek books, and have tripped over what seems to be inconsistencies in whether whether a numbered sequence should be entered as a (sub)series, or a publication series. E.g., Star Trek Pocket Books vs Star Trek: The Next Generation Numbered, Star Trek: Voyager, etc.

It seems like it might be safer to not poke the bear, but I'd interested in what folks think. --Glenn (talk) 20:47, 3 October 2022 (EDT)

The way I think about distinguishing between publication and title series is to ask: If the same book were published by a completely different publisher, would (could) they do so under the same series? If the answer is "no", it's a publication series; if the answer is "yes", it's a title series. For your examples, anyone could publish a "Star Trek: Voyager" book, but no one else could publish a "Star Trek Pocket Book" book. --MartyD (talk) 09:59, 4 October 2022 (EDT)

Is there a master list of spec fiction sub-genres?

Apologies in advance for being new and not knowing my way around, but if there is such a list, I couldn't find it. Can someone please direct me? Thanks. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by VShannon (talkcontribs) .

Our inclusion policy defines speculative fiction here. Not quite the same thing as a master list of all sub-genres (which I think I credible argument could be made against the feasibility of accomplishing such a list), but the closest we have. -- JLaTondre (talk) 19:46, 8 October 2022 (EDT)
The Speculative fiction template over on Wikipedia has a pretty good list. ···日本穣 · 投稿 · Talk to Nihonjoe 14:45, 11 October 2022 (EDT)

Login Issue

I have been a member for several years, but suddenly my login is rejected. I assume I need to update my password, but can't find anything on the Wiki page about that. Wcornette

Have you had a chance to check ISFDB:FAQ#What_do_I_do_if_I_have_problems_logging_in.3F? I have added a clarification re: the 2022-09-06 server move, specifically:
  • If you were able to log in before September 6, 2022 (which is when the ISFDB site was upgraded to HTTPS) and have been unable to log in since, you need to log in to the ISFDB Wiki first. Once you do that, you should be able to log in on the ISFDB side as well.
Ahasuerus (talk) 18:26, 9 October 2022 (EDT)
I had to change my password because my old one somehow didn't comply with PW complexity rules anymore. Somehow the system didn't accept my old PW anymore... So, you may have to change your password anyway, making sure it complies with current PW rules. MagicUnk (talk) 06:26, 13 October 2022 (EDT)

Can we split an author, please?

Author record 22465 contains information about two distinct authors:

  • Hyacinthe Hill was born Virginia Rose Cronin in Manhattan on 24 May 1920. She married John L. Anderson and wrote as Hyacinthe Hill. She died on 25 March 1989 in Marin County, California.
  • Virginia 'Nanek' Anderson was born Virginia Hadie Combs in Elizabeth City, Virginia on 20 March 1920. She married Carl W. K. Anderson and wrote as Nanek as well as her own name. She died on 25 May 1987 in Milwaukee, Wisconsin.

Could we please break this up into two author entries? Sylvar (talk) 13:05, 13 October 2022 (EDT)

I think I got them untangled. Look at Hyacinthe Hill and the old record and let me know if I got something wrong. Annie (talk) 13:25, 13 October 2022 (EDT)
That looks right to me. Thank you very much! Sylvar (talk) 11:32, 18 October 2022 (EDT)
I added some comppressed biographical information to each of the two "Virginia Anderson"s. Chavey (talk) 14:03, 13 March 2023 (EDT)

Le Guin Award "finalists" not looking quite right

A few days ago, the new Le Guin award announced a winner and two "finalists" from the previously announced 9 nominees. I've just updated 3 records, but - as can be seen from the linked page - the 2 "finalists" appear below the nominees, which doesn't really reflect that those 2 books were recognized. Is there anything that can be tweaked to make them appear in the order winner>finalists>nominees, or is that just how it works with the data model?

(FWIW I don't know that there was any indication prior to the winner announcement that there'd be a "finalist" category...) ErsatzCulture (talk) 17:27, 23 October 2022 (EDT)

In our data model, "winners" correspond to Award Level 1, "nominees" correspond to Award Level 9 and "finalists" correspond to Award Level 90. This is due to the fact that we assume that a "finalist" is a work which made it to the final round of jury/voter selection, but didn't become an official "nominee".
Also, as Help:Screen:EditAward says:
  • ISFDB supports two varieties of award types: poll-based and non-poll-based. For poll-based award types, you will see a "Poll place" radio button; enter the numeric award ranking between 1 and 70. For non-poll-based award types, you will see a "Win" radio button and a "Nomination" radio button; check the appropriate button.
Up until now, it was our understanding that The Ursula K. Le Guin Prize for Fiction didn't rank nominees beyond announcing the winner. Now that we know that they do rank them, we should probably change the Award Type definition from "Not Poll" to "Poll". Once we do that, we should be able to make the "finalists" Award Level 2 and the rest of the nominees Award level 3. Ahasuerus (talk) 22:30, 23 October 2022 (EDT)
That will be even more confusing than what we have now and a bad idea IMO. We need the ability to order the categories of nominees on the page (for things like short and ling lists for example or fir Finalists). A few of the Russian aware have the same issue. Just adding an explanation in the description on what Finalist means keeps the things a bit cleaner, order on the page notwithstanding. Annie (talk) 23:34, 23 October 2022 (EDT)
Back when the current version of the award model was implemented, we identified a few areas where it didn't adequately reflect the variety of scenarios that existed in the real world. After a discussion of possible permutations, FR 656, "Add support for Displayed Award Levels", was created. A few years later FR 1086, "Change the award year field to a drop-down list", was created to support certain other scenarios. (We also have FR 583 and FR 269 to support linking awards to authors and publishers, but that's a different can of worms.)
For now, we handle awards which use the terms "nominee" and "finalist" interchangeably in a number of ways. Hugo, Campbell/Astounding and Lodestar are currently set up as "Polls" with voting details given in Notes, e.g. see this 2022 award record. In certain cases, we use "Finalists" in the database sense of the world (Award Level 90), which can be confusing, e.g. see the 1977 Campbell/Astounding list, where "Finalists" are listed below "Withdrawn -- Ineligible". (We may want to review the internal Award Level values and swap some of them in order to sort more logically.)
Another possible way to handle the Le Guin situation would be to keep the "Poll" flag for this Award Type set to "No". We would then turn all 2022 nominees back to "Nominee", then add notes explaining that 2 of them were singled out as "finalists". Ahasuerus (talk) 10:42, 24 October 2022 (EDT)
Does the following workaround yield your desired result? Select the 'Special' radio button rather than the 'Nomination' radio button. Then choose 'Preliminary Nominees' from the dropdown list. John Scifibones 11:24, 24 October 2022 (EDT)
It may work for this year but whoever adds them next year may not realize how to enter them (or someone may decide to 'fix' this year's nominations because they are not really preliminary nominations). As a stop-gap, it can work and we can keep an eye on it (and add a note at the award Note explaining the naming). Annie (talk) 11:41, 24 October 2022 (EDT)
And then if we are not careful, different years in the same award may also use a different mechanism. In a perfect world, we should be able to set the precedence of the level inside of the category - so if one day an award does something like semi-finalists for example, we do not need to twist the UI yet again :) Annie (talk) 11:41, 24 October 2022 (EDT)

Help Desk history missing content

Viewing the Help Desk history, e.g. Revision as of 14:04, 15 November 2019 by Ahasuerus ( seems to show empty content.

FlaSheridn (talk) 21:57, 23 October 2022 (EDT)

We only keep the last 50 versions of Wiki pages due to limited disk space. However, old sections are periodically archive, so they are not lost. In this case November 2019 sections can be found in Archive 31, specifically ISFDB:Help_desk/archives/archive_31#My_Votes_in_.28Internal_and.2For_External.29_Chronological_Order. Ahasuerus (talk) 22:12, 23 October 2022 (EDT)

Problem finding license types for uploaded image files

When uploading files (eg. an author image) to the wiki, shouldn't there be a drop down box in File Description that allows you to select the license? The only option I see is "None selected". Ultimately I'm looking for the area where I can specify the license type, image creator, source, etc. Thanks. PeteYoung (talk) 13:21, 24 October 2022 (EDT)

Hmm, the Upload file page has a link (at least for moderators?) for editing MediaWiki:Licenses which controls the pull down. Looking at the Wikipedia version, it looks like it only allows for simply static licenses. So we could make use of it, but people would still need to add information to allow linking back to the database (author id, etc.). If people think it would useful for having at least partial templates, I would be willing to enter them. -- JLaTondre (talk) 13:41, 24 October 2022 (EDT)
Right now, Category:Image License Tags is linked from the image upload page. Instead of selecting a license from the list (which isn't populated right now), you should use one of the templates listed in that category. The correct template will include the correct license. ···日本穣 · 投稿 · Talk to Nihonjoe 15:16, 24 October 2022 (EDT)
I've updated the list based on the list of templates in Category:Image License Tags. Let us know if that works for you. ···日本穣 · 投稿 · Talk to Nihonjoe 16:23, 24 October 2022 (EDT)
That looks ideal, thanks. Will use this list tomorrow and report back on any problems. Cheers. PeteYoung (talk) 16:27, 24 October 2022 (EDT)
You will need to edit the image page afterward in order to fill in the appropriate information. You'll also have to copy the parameters from the template page so you know what you need to fill in for the template. ···日本穣 · 投稿 · Talk to Nihonjoe 16:30, 24 October 2022 (EDT)

Two authors same name, needs (I)?

These do appear to be two different authors, but then shouldn't one of them be (I)? Thanks. gzuckier (talk) 00:56, 31 October 2022 (EDT)

The only difference in the two names is the use, or lack, of a diacritic dot under the e in the last name. The first step is to confirm that we didn't make a data entry error. A check of the attribution in issue 1 of 34 Orchard confirms the name was entered correctly. Based on the available bios, it appears this is just one author.
The proper way to handle is to make Ernest O. Ògúnyemí and alternate name of Ernest O. Ògúnyẹmí. Then make Christmas Chicken a variant title. Sumit these two edits and I will approve them. Thanks for finding this, John Scifibones 09:28, 31 October 2022 (EDT)

Narrator template and multiple narrators

I've recently started adding audiobooks, and a few of them have more than one narrator. In those cases I've just added multiple separate narrator templates, but I've just seen this omnibus pub where 5 narrators are listed in one template, separated by " and ". Is one or both of these correct usage? Neither Template:PublicationFields:PubNote nor Help:Using_Templates_and_HTML_in_Note_Fields have anything to say on this particular use case (which may well be equally applicable to other templates like A.

My guess is that right now, it doesn't make much difference, but if/when the current use of templates is superseded by having some sort of "role" functionality for contributors to pubs, then having something that can be easily and unambiguously parsed would be preferable. From a quick SQL query of the database, I note that there are 87 author records that contain the text ' and '. Granted, most of those are unlikely to ever be narrators, but could easily be referenced in A templates, and it might be preferable to have some consistent handling across template types, rather than special casing Narrator? ErsatzCulture (talk) 16:18, 7 November 2022 (EST)

It is the same issue as with the translator template - we can deal with all possibilities when we are ready to convert one day. I use "and" and "," as separators between the names and rarely use the A (author) template inside of the Translator/Narrator. And when working internationally, we have an extra challenge of adding the transliterations inside of the template (as there is no space for them elsewhere as it will be if they become proper author records). So pick up a way to record and when it comes to parsing, there won't be that many options to cover anyway. If and when the special characters become an issue, we can revisit but for now as long as the data is there, I am not too worried about converting later. Annie (talk) 16:23, 7 November 2022 (EST)

Name of the artist misspelled

. Good day,

The name of an illusterator in the recent issue of GHOSTS & SCHOLARS (no.43) is misspelled.

Instead of 'Carl Lavoir', it should be: Carl Lavoie.

There's already a page for him:

Could the name please be corrected and the illustration credit linked to the illustrator's profile?

Thank you, and have a wonderful day!


-Carl Lavoie —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Jahrel (talkcontribs) . 07:57, 17 November 2022‎ (EST) .

Thanks for letting us know. I've asked the person who verified that issue to come comment here. ···日本穣 · 投稿 · Talk to Nihonjoe 16:00, 17 November 2022 (EST)
Looking at the issue, it appears that was already corrected. It's current showing as "Carl Lavoie". ···日本穣 · 投稿 · Talk to Nihonjoe 16:06, 17 November 2022 (EST)

Capitalization/varianting of David D. Levine's Tk'tk'tk aka Tk'Tk'Tk

At least some pubs of this story use the form "Tk'Tk'Tk", rather than the currently recorded "Tk'tk'tk". Examples of the former are the 21st Century SF anthology (*), the Space Magic anthology, and the derived chapbook that includes just that story; examples that use the latter are Escape Pod 54. Is this something that we should try to record the particular pub's usage exactly as far as possible using variant titles, or are there perhaps R&S capitalization rules that override things? I would have assumed the former, but given that this is a reasonably high-profile short story - albeit with an annoyingly-hard-to-get-right title - I'd have thought this one might have been caught before now?

(* - at least per the contents listing of the ebook, the title on the story itself appears in all caps) ErsatzCulture (talk) 16:30, 17 November 2022 (EST)

Sarah Monette's "Letter from a Teddy Bear on Veterans Day"

I stumbled across a duplicate and have a couple of questions about making a variant. From the web page, I can see that the original publication, "Letter from a Teddy Bear on Veteran's Day," is correctly listed but I don't have access to the anthologies which print it as "Letter from a Teddy Bear on Veterans' Day" (I didn't see it immediately but the difference is the plural possessive apostrophe vs. the singular) so I'm not sure if that's correctly listed or not. Both titles are actually wrong in terms of the name of the holiday which is "Veterans Day" (no apostrophe at all) so I don't know which should be canonical (presumably the first publication). And, while I doubt it, should there be a sort of redirect alternate title with the correct punctuation because, when you search for "Veterans Day," only "Veterans Day" by Cat Sparks shows up and this one doesn't. --J-Sun (talk) 15:14, 18 November 2022 (EST)

Wow, this is so complicated it almost seems like one of mine, but I'll try to sort it out. I (Username) added both links, 1 for each variant of the title, and when the 1 that was accepted recently was approved I think I'd completely forgotten that I added the other one late last year until I just looked at them now. The one spelled "Veteran's" is a 2006 page but the Archive link was in 2015 for some reason, while the one spelled "Veterans'" doesn't have a date on it but the Archive link is from 2007. Monette's Prime Books collection with this story is on and I checked it; it's "Veterans'". The Prime Books anthology it appeared in, which was apparently one of many they did which got cancelled before making it to the shelves, also, according to the linked blog post in the record, has "Veterans'". So here's what I say; she corrected the title in later appearances, so that should be the parent and "Veteran's" should be the variant. --Username (talk) 15:35, 18 November 2022 (EST)

Dating variants

I am unclear what to do in case we have a title by a variant author name that's dated earlier than the same title but published by the canonical author name. this one, for example, confuses me. The story 'Party Favors' has been published under the variant author name Alex Nathan Shumate in 1994. Only later was this title published under the author's canonical name Nathan Shumate in 2015. Currently, the parent title (by Nathan Shumate) is dated 1994, whereas it actually got published only in 2015 under the author's canonical name. I know we've been discussing this on and off, but to my knowledge we never got a clear set of rules for these, or do we?

Should we re-date the parent title to 2015? But if we do, we will have a parent title that's published later than its variant title by Alex Nathan Shumate of 1994. And the author's bibliography will show the title as published in 2015, not in 1994 as it should.

Conversely, should we date the parent title to the date of the first appearance of said title, whether it's the variant date or not? That will result in correct date in author's bibliography, but will result in wrong date of when the title actually appeared. (probably need to move to r&s, but hey, I'm confused...) MagicUnk (talk) 07:23, 19 November 2022 (EST)

Parents are dated based on the first appearance of the story (excluding translations) under any title or author credit. The only exception is if a translation was published first. In that case, we still use the first date published in the author's canonical language. -- JLaTondre (talk) 08:24, 19 November 2022 (EST)
Yes, I agree - that is the only case where a title is not dated based on its own publications but based on all publications in the title’s original language. That way it stays where it belongs in the publication order. The parent serves a double function for us - it is one of the titles (as any variant it carries) but it is also the main record for a text/book. As such, it is not treated as a regular variant (that’s why we can also have empty parents but not empty variants for example). Some DBs and sites solve that by having a “canonical” record which never belongs into a work. In ours we just use a record using the canonical name of the author when one with the correct title exists. Annie (talk) 12:18, 19 November 2022 (EST)
OK, that's clear, thanks. Shouldn't we add this rule explicitly into the rules somewhere for future reference? MagicUnk (talk) 16:05, 22 November 2022 (EST)

Can't log in and nothing works

Trying to add a new collection to my page. My old login is being rejected. All the notices tell me what to do, but not how to do it. Why is it so hard to log in? —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Lwoolley (talkcontribs) . 15:49, 22 November 2022‎ (EST)

Which page? Please share the URL. Also, what is your old username (since you said you're having trouble logging in)?
To login, you should login here on the wiki first. That should log you into the database side of ISFDB. ···日本穣 · 投稿 · Talk to Nihonjoe 17:54, 22 November 2022 (EST)

Harlequin Pub Series with sub-series?

The Harlequin Publication Series Harlequin American Romance has a paranormal romance-themed miniseries/sub-series, More Than Men (here's another Goodreads list). The books in More Than Men all have pub series numbers listed for the Harlequin American Romance pub series (for instance, Neptune's Bride is HAR 509, but they don't appear to have pub series numbers listed for the More Than Men miniseries. Is it preferable to list the More Than Men books in the Harlequin American Romance pub series with their pub series numbers included? Or should I list them in a new More Than Men pub series without any pub series numbers? Or do something else?

(Several of the More Than Men books are also in different Harlequin pub series, e.g. a Neptune's Bride reprint is in Silhouette pub series Dreamscapes: Whispers of Love.) Morebooks (talk) 23:40, 30 November 2022 (EST)

Is it correct to assume that 'Harlequin American Romance' is devoted not only to speculative titles? Than, in my view, the case is similar to Phantastische Bibliothek and Suhrkamp Taschenbuch, with the books published in 'Phantastische Bibliothek' all also having a publication series no. within (and being part of) 'Suhrkamp Taschenbuch'. We decided to do it this way because the first series is devoted to speculative fiction titles and we are a site devoted to the same area. So, yes, under the above assumption I'd think the books within the 'More Than Men' should be indexed here with their own pub. series (and accompanying no.). Hope that helps, Christian Stonecreek (talk) 04:27, 1 December 2022 (EST)
Yes, Harlequin American Romance contains both specfic and non-specfic titles, while More Than Men is only specfic. More Than Men doesn’t have corresponding pub series numbers like Harlequin American Romance does. Should I put the books in a new More Than Men pub series while giving them the pub series numbers from Harlequin American Romance? Or should I put the books in More Than Men pub series and leave the pub series numbers blank? Morebooks (talk) 06:01, 1 December 2022 (EST)
Or what if I name the new pub series "Harlequin American Romance: More Than Men" and then include the HAR pub series numbers? Morebooks (talk) 16:34, 1 December 2022 (EST)
Either works but make sure the decision is documented in the notes of the series so people can understand what we are naming and numbering :) Annie (talk) 17:05, 1 December 2022 (EST)
Poking around more Harlequin paranormal romances, this is apparently going to be an ongoing issue with the publisher. E.g Harlequin has another pub series, Harlequin Temptation, that's a mixture of specfic and non-specfic titles; Temptation in turn has at least 2 sub-series that are also mixtures of specfic & non-specfic titles, Lovers & Legends and Secret Fantasies. And so on & so forth across various other Harlequin pub series & imprints. So what's the preferable way to handle this consistently? Keep creating new pub series for the sub-series? Ignore the sub-series? Move the pub series like Harlequin Temptation into a new separate publisher listing so the sub-series can be pub series for that imprint? Morebooks (talk) 03:09, 2 December 2022 (EST)
Ideally, we would implement FR 327, "Allow nested publication series". Unfortunately, it would take a significant amount of development time, so it's not on my short list of things to do. For now, any of the proposed solutions would work as long as we document what we are doing in Notes. Ahasuerus (talk) 09:19, 2 December 2022 (EST)
Just as a reminder, we also have the MultiPubS template (no parameters) which is to be used when a book is in two publication series (nested or not) and which should make it easier to untangle these when/if we ever can do nested and/or multiple pub series. I tend to add the other series name and number (if one is available). See this for an example. :) Annie (talk) 13:13, 2 December 2022 (EST)

The Eye of the Lens

The novelette "The Eye of the Lens" is a concatenation of three short stories, "The Hall of Machines", "The Coming of the Sun", and "The Eye of the Lens," apparently with no changes to the stories. We don't have a listing for the short story "The Eye of the Lens" yet, I'm about to add one. I've separated out the three pubs of the short story from the pubs of the novelette. Where the three short stories are published, they are all three together, so it's as if the novelette was published, but the subsections listed. None of the short stories appear anywhere on their own without the other two.

My question is do I make the three separate short stories a variant of the novelette in some way? Or just have a note to relate them?

Thanks. gzuckier (talk) 00:31, 1 December 2022 (EST)

No, they won't be variants unless they were serialized (aka - it was always one story, just published in pieces - in which case the smaller pieces become serials instead of stories). There are 2 ways to record that if we do not go the serials route:
  • Always include the 3 stories where the new bigger story is published. That works if the split is obvious in the big story.
  • Use notes to connect the fix-up story to its stories. We do that usually for fix-up novels which do not get treated as collections but it can work here as well.
However if the 3 short stories never appear on their own after their initial publication and always appear as part of the novelette, then they sound more like chapters/serialization than separate stories. If so, we may actually be better off making the initial ones SERIAL and connecting them to their parent. Intent matters here - it is important to know if they were planned to be one story or if they were 3 separate stories that then got fixed-up into a single entity. Annie (talk) 17:13, 1 December 2022 (EST)
OK, I'll do some mental activity. It's one of those New Wave type writings that doesn't fit into any categories politely. gzuckier (talk) 23:28, 1 December 2022 (EST)

How to Convert a Chapbook to a Novel

I am editing and PVing Christopher Ruocchio / The Lesser Devil. It is 56329 words long so comfortably a novel, however, it is currently recorded as a Chapbook. I have found this help page: How to convert a novel to a chapbook but I cannot find a help page telling me how to do the reverse. Can someone please point me in the direction of the appropriate help page or, if there isn't one, tell me what to do. Thanks. Teallach (talk) 18:48, 1 December 2022 (EST)

Step one: Change the short fiction title (this one to a novel.
Step 2-x: Go into each of the chapbook publications and use "Remove Title from Publication" to eject the Chapbook record.
Step Last: If the novella was in any collections and anthologies, check if they do not need to be changed to Omnibuses. If it is in a magazine, you will need to replace it in the magazine with the Complete Novel serial. If it was serialized, make sure the rules for novels and not for stories are applied to the dating. If the book has variants, all of them need to be changed the same way with steps 1-x :) Annie (talk) 18:56, 1 December 2022 (EST)
Forgot one step of course somewhere in the copying around: Once the short story is changed to a novel AND the chapbook is ejected (both need to be approved first), the publication needs to be changed to a novel as well. As you won't even be able to submit these pub type changes before the other two changes are approved, it may make sense to actually add a moderator note to ask the handling moderator to assist -- and just check at the end to make sure they did and submit if they missed it. :) That one is now all approved. Thanks for finding out the length. Annie (talk) 23:52, 2 December 2022 (EST)
1) Thanks for updating the pub records. As I stated in the Notes to Moderator, I was going to do this myself because I don't like asking moderators to do stuff that I can do. However, given your recommendation, I will do so if I come across this scenario again in the future. I presume you've suggested this because otherwise the inconsistent pub record(s) will get flagged in a cleanup report whilst my edit is waiting to be approved.
2) Now that we've done all these edits, there is an empty Chapbook record hanging around. Should I submit an edit to delete it or will it automatically get deleted as a result of some cleanup process? Teallach (talk) 16:48, 3 December 2022 (EST)
That helps not having the inconsistent formats stay a long time in the DB, get flagged on a report and needing someone to get to them. You submitting also works - and I would recommend checking just in case the handling moderator missed the note - sometimes it happens. I would usually do that step when I am approving even without a note (this one is just a bit clunky due to the inability to submit it early). We will fix it sooner or later (we have a report for it) but we don’t work all reports daily (or even weekly) :)
Oops, I thought I deleted it. Now I did. But yes - if it is not deleted, submit the deletion. It will show up on a report and we will zap it one day when someone works through the report but a deletion is needed so if you notice it, off it goes. Basically authors, publishers and publication series get deleted automatically when the last entry under them is deleted; titles and series need a delete submission when they are empty. Annie (talk) 20:00, 3 December 2022 (EST)

Adding a new issue of a magazine (Lackington's 24)?

Hi there,

I'm trying to figure out how to add a new issue for a magazine that already exists in the database. Would one do that with the "new magazine" function, or is there some way to make sure the submission fits within an already established magazine record? Specifically, I'm trying to add Lackington's 24 (, while the extent issues in the database only go up to 2020. Thanks so much for your help! —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Godzilla13 (talkcontribs) .

Use “Add New Magazine”. When you open the page, there is a link to the help page at the very top of the page. Please read it before submitting the issue of the magazine. It is also a good idea to read the help pages for each field (even when they sound logical) - we do have some not so straight forward conventions. Once it is approved, it will show up under the magazine page if you add the correct series to it (can also be done as a second step). So check the help pages (pay close attention on the help page for the title and the date fields - we have specific format for the first and special rules for dating magazines) and try to add it. Ich my have any specific questions, feel free to post back. Annie (talk) 22:29, 12 December 2022 (EST)

Adding stories to a collection

Back after a long time away without much experience then. I can't figure out how to add existing stories to a new (author-published) collection. Most of the stories are already in the db, a few aren't. Do both kinds go into the Regular Titles fields? Do I do something different for the existing stories? Did this once and created duplicate stories, but never learned how to do it right. Sfmvnterry (talk) 23:19, 20 December 2022 (EST)

Just chose 'Add New Collection' on the left tool bar (just scroll down a bit). Enter the publication data and the new shortfiction titles (it's best to import the existing titles after the submission was approved, but it's also possible to enter all the contents and merge the double titles later). Please do add some information in the notes (is it a first edition?, from where do stem the date of publication and the cover art credit?, analogous to other collections, like here or here (I suppose the collection isn't already indexed at ISFDB, if it is there you can add stories just by editing it). Christian Stonecreek (talk) 05:18, 21 December 2022 (EST)".
"if it is there you can add stories just by editing it" is going to achieve the opposite of what they are trying to achieve - namely NOT to create duplicates. Just saying. :) Annie (talk) 10:14, 21 December 2022 (EST)
To answer the question directly: when the book contains stories/essays/poems we already have, don't type the titles in the Regular Titles section, just add the ones we do not have. Submit the book with the stories we do not have and once approved, go to the Import menu on the left side of the screen when you have a publication open and import the stories you skipped (it will allow you to add page numbers on the second screen of the import). If all the stories are already in the DB, submit the initial book with no contents; if the book is already in the DB and you are just adding contents, just submit an Import (if the book is here but is a mix of stories we have and we do not, start with an Import again, add the stories we have with it and on the second screen of the Import process, you can add the stories we are missing thus adding the complete contents in a single submission) :)
The import has two options: importing the complete contents of another book (useful when you are adding a new format of a book we have for example) and importing individual titles based on their IDs. The ID of a title is in the top right corner when you open a title. The help page for the import function is here (it is also linked at the top of the page after you click on "Import Content" from the publication menu. Let me know if you have any questions and/or need any additional details. Annie (talk) 10:14, 21 December 2022 (EST)
Thank you to both! Finished it up with the nonexisting stories and sent it on its way; will try to import the existing stories next. Thanks again. Sfmvnterry (talk) 22:27, 21 December 2022 (EST)

SFE pseudonym links

If the SFE has an entry which says merely that the name is a pseudonym, should the link be added to the pseudonym page or the canonical name page? —Rosab618 (talk) 01:03, 27 December 2022 (EST)

I treat them somewhat differently depending on the type of the pseudonym. For house names like Alexander Blade and Will Garth, I usually add the SFE link to the house name page, but not to the canonical names associated with the house name. For single author pseudonyms like Grendel Briarton, I tend to add the link to both records. Having it appear on the pseudonym's page helps explain the source of our attribution. I also tend to add brief notes to more obscure or specialized pseudonyms, e.g. see Julie Light, which says:
  • "Julie Light" was a pseudonym briefly used by JC Andrijeski during 2020. At the end of the year the pseudonym was abandoned. All books originally published as by "Julie Light" were republished as by "JC Andrijeski".
or Hunter T. Castle, which says:
  • JC Andrijeski's pseudonym used for her juvenile novels.
Ahasuerus (talk) 10:45, 27 December 2022 (EST)
Thank you, A. (How are you, by the way?)—Rosab618 (talk) 19:18, 27 December 2022 (EST)
Still kicking, one software patch at a time :-) Ahasuerus (talk) 20:07, 27 December 2022 (EST)

Excerpt of incomplete work

The Splendor and Misery of Bodies, of Cities was originally defined as an unfinished work. An excerpt from Splendor was printed in the Review of Contemporary Fiction in September, 1996. The TOC for this publication gives the title as "From The Splendor and Misery of Bodies, of Cities". The excerpt has now been published without the "From" in Out of the Ruins. Since this appears to be its final form based on interviews with the author, do we still consider it an excerpt? Since the "From" version was printed first is that the canonical title with the later printings as variants? Tom (talk) 23:14, 28 December 2022 (EST)

Twentieth Century Discovery

This Isaac Asimov nonfiction title appears when I type in the specific title, but it does not appear on Asimov's bibliography page. It should be in nonfiction in the year 1969, but it is not. At least, I cannot find it. Can anyone help me? Mike (talk) 01:42, 2 January 2023 (EST)

Well it's there when I take a look at his summary page, after The Shaping of England and before Asimov's Guide to Shakespeare, Volume One. Maybe you looked by accident into the department 'Nonfiction Series' or 'Essays'? His bibliography is rather longish. Christian Stonecreek (talk) 05:23, 2 January 2023 (EST)
Thanks for checking for me. I was looking at non-genre titles at the bottom of the page. Mike (talk) 10:16, 2 January 2023 (EST)

Canonical name incorrect

Forrest Ackerman's "canonical name" is incorrect. It has a period after the J. and Ackerman was very insistent throughout his life that his middle initial did NOT have a period. It should be "Forrest J Ackerman." It does have a period in LCNAF but that's because a name entry in LC must end with one of the following punctuation marks: . ) - " Same as, when writing, we end a sentence with a period -- the period is not part of or attached to the last word, it's just there as an end-indication. Thanks! —The preceding unsigned comment added by Delphi Psmith (talkcontribs) 10:43, January 6, 2023‎.

Thanks for pointing out this problem and welcome to the project!
There are a couple of different issues here. First, as per the ISFDB FAQ, we enter author names "the way they appear on the publication's title page". We then set up "the most recognized name for the author within the SF genre" as his or her "canonical name" and all other names as "alternate names".
Second, originally (1995-ca.2010) we always entered a period after initials. The idea was that a missing initial was just a typographical convention, similar to how some magazines used lowercase forms of authors' names, e.g. "robert a heinlein". It wasn't until later that we were reminded that some authors do not use periods after initial on purpose or have single-letter middle names as in the case of Steven H Silver. We now have Steven H. Silver -- which has been used by some publishers -- set up as an alternate name for Steven H Silver. We also have a number of authors whose canonical names use "merged" initials, e.g. "CJ Cooke, which is how their works are published.
In the case of Forrest J Ackerman, it would appear that most of his works were published without a period after the "J", but only 30ish of our records are entered that way. I am going to ask the primary verifiers of the publications where his works appeared to double check them. Once the records have been corrected, we'll revisit the canonical name issue.
Thanks again! Ahasuerus (talk) 16:50, 7 January 2023 (EST)

Date error dialogue

I'm trying to clone a 2011 pub to enter my 12th print of same with date as 0000-00-00. Pressing the 'Clone Pub' button to finish the process brings up a dialogue "Date must be in YYYY, YYYY-MM or YYYY-MM-DD format, 0000-00-00 means "Unknown",.....etc". I've not seen this before and I can't get past it. What's the problem? Thanks, Kev. --BanjoKev (talk) 08:53, 9 January 2023 (EST)

Could you please clarify whether you entered "0000-00-00" in the "Publication Metadata" section or in the "Content Section"? Also, which publication was it? Ahasuerus (talk) 09:50, 9 January 2023 (EST)
Cloning this pub to 0000-00-00 in the "Publication Metadata" section.--BanjoKev (talk) 09:56, 9 January 2023 (EST)
Thanks for clarifying. After pulling it up and using the "Clone" option, I entered "0000-00-00" in the "Date" field and clicked "Clone Pub". The submission went through -- here is the result. I wonder what was different on your side. Did you, perchance, only change the first 4 characters in the date field, resulting in a "0000-05-00" value? Ahasuerus (talk) 10:02, 9 January 2023 (EST)
Mmmm. I entered the full 0000-00-00. I'll close my browser and then try again. Thanks, Kev. --BanjoKev (talk) 10:05, 9 January 2023 (EST)
That's strange. Didn't close browser, went back to China's summary page and clicked through to the 2011 title and entered everything the same again. It went through ok. Thanks for your time. Kev. --BanjoKev (talk) 10:16, 9 January 2023 (EST)
No worries, glad it worked out. It's entirely possible that there is an obscure bug lurking in the ISFDB code and that it is only triggered under rare circumstances. Unfortunately, they can be hard to replicate... Ahasuerus (talk) 10:22, 9 January 2023 (EST)

Ryman - Air (or, Have Not Have)

Looking at this title page, it seems to me that all the just plain "Air" titles should be varianted to the full, earlier 2004-09-00 St. Martin's Griffin title "Air (or, Have Not Have)". Would that be correct? Thanks, Kev. --BanjoKev (talk) 00:56, 12 January 2023 (EST)

The two Air (or, Have Not Have) pubs should be unmerged and the old & new records varianted to each other. However, I would use Air as the parent as it is the most common and we base canonical titles on the most used title, not the first title. -- JLaTondre (talk) 17:36, 12 January 2023 (EST)
Thanks for your help. Kev. --BanjoKev (talk) 03:17, 13 January 2023 (EST)

Lost Dorsai audiobook & MP3 CD

In preparing to add the audiobook & MP3 CD for "Lost Dorsai", I found that the descriptions on Amazon and Audible only mention the novella title here. Since the existing pubs are all collections that contain "Lost Dorsai" and additional stories, it seems to me that the best way to add the audiobook & MP3 CD would be to first create an chapbook and then merge the novella title created from that into the existing novella title here. I could then add pubs to it for the audiobook and MP3 CD. Is there a better way to do this? Phil (talk) 09:52, 13 January 2023 (EST)

Yep - either create an empty chapbook and then import the novella (with a note for the handling moderator on why you do not have a short fiction record) or create the chapbook with the novella and then merge. Both are 2 steps so either way works. Then clone from the chapbook for the rest of the formats. Annie (talk) 12:18, 13 January 2023 (EST)

I, Robot -- merge question

How do I merge I, Robot (new) into I, Robot (good)? --Glenn (talk) 17:23, 16 January 2023 (EST)

Go to Eando Binder and select 'Check for Duplicate Titles' from the 'Editing Tools:' menu. You will see the title pair you want to merge. John Scifibones 18:37, 16 January 2023 (EST)
Ahhh. I assumed that it would only merge titles showing on that page. --Glenn (talk) 19:06, 16 January 2023 (EST)
When you cannot find an author/publication where to merge from (usually due to typos), you can also use Advanced search to find the two titles and bring them on a merge-able screen. :) Annie (talk) 12:23, 17 January 2023 (EST)

"The Wooden Ham" (Fantastic Adventures, December 1943)

In the SFE entry on House Names, it says, "It is believed that Leroy Yerxa wrote almost the entire December 1943 issue of Fantastic Adventures with stories under house names except for one, Morris J Steele, which was usually the pen name of Raymond A Palmer himself but was here used by Berkeley Livingston." In that issue, "The Wooden Ham" is the only story by "Morris J. Steele," but it's varianted to Leroy Yerxa. Should the primary author be changed to Berkeley Livingstone? —Rosab618 (talk) 02:27, 19 January 2023 (EST)

Philip K. Dick's Electric Dreams: Volume One - info wanted

This is a call for help with unverified pubs for this title. Please refer to Stonecreek's page for what I'm trying to do.

If anyone has a copy of an unverified pub, any info would be welcome. Thanks, Kev. --BanjoKev (talk) 10:08, 19 January 2023 (EST)

The Fifth Time Out - Author tweak

When PVing Terra SF: ... I found that the author is given on both the inline page and the TOC is given with a ring A (Mårtensson). The Canadian edition also is entered with Martensson, but the only PV is inactive. I strong suspect that both the U.S. and Canadian editions are the same in this respect. Thoughts? --Glenn (talk) 22:29, 19 January 2023 (EST)

That seems like a reasonable assumption. In the absence of an available verifier, I would change it and add a note to the Canadian edition that the lettering in the credit was originally recorded as "a" but was changed to "å" as seen in the U.S. edition and has not been (re)verified as of this date. --MartyD (talk) 10:23, 20 January 2023 (EST)
Trying to figure out the best approach. Should I just edit the title record and add notes to the publication? Or add new titles to the publication, remove the old ones, and merge (?) afterwords? Or some other non-obvious way, at least to me? --Glenn (talk) 16:49, 20 January 2023 (EST)
As the title is only used in this book and the title is not a parent, just change the title record author and update the notes on the publication and you are all set. If there were other books where the current record had to remain as is, you would have needed to either unmerge and change the title (and variant the new title back under the parent) OR add title/remove title/variant again. Annie (talk) 18:10, 20 January 2023 (EST)

Collections with Abridged or Expanded Contents

What is the correct way to record collections with abridged or expanded contents? I have come across examples that seem to me to be recorded inconsistently.
1) Sturgeon: A Way Home - hc and A Way Home - pb. The pb is abridged (two stories cut). These two pubs have two different title records which are not varianted and have "Do Not Merge" notes.
2) Sturgeon: A Touch of Strange - hc and A Touch of Strange - pb. The pb is abridged (two stories cut). These two pubs have the same title record.
3) Butler: Bloodchild and Other Stories - hc and Bloodchild and Other Stories, Second Edition - tp. The tp is expanded (two additional stories). These two pubs have two different title records which are varianted.
Teallach (talk) 18:37, 21 January 2023 (EST)

It seems that there are different approaches to that problem: I'm in favor of having same-titled collections that are expanded (or abridged) for new editions to be subsumed under one entry title, and add an explaining note to the title record. Only when the contents are exchanged for a great part, I would add a new record. In my opinion that does help to have the author summary pages aren't overloaded.
This way also the translations of collections (which also often have additional or omitted pieces) are handled more easily. Christian Stonecreek (talk) 06:53, 22 January 2023 (EST)

Advance Reader Copy

I have an ARC that Amazon gives the mass-market release date as 2021-06-17. On the spine is "June 2021". Back cover has ISBN (same as Amazon's) '3rd June 2021' '£9.99' 'Advance Reader Copy - Not For Resale'. I gather that ARCs are generally released 3-6 months in advance. I can't find anything in the Help, so how should I enter the date? Kev. --BanjoKev (talk) 18:51, 24 January 2023 (EST)

Since found two conversations from 2012 ARCs and e-ARCs redux. What is the current policy? Kev. --BanjoKev (talk) 10:28, 25 January 2023 (EST)
As far as can recall, nothing ever changed, and they are still "out". I found even more:
They all boil down to a desire to record ARCs running up against general policy (which I cannot find) that ARCs are not something the ISFDB records. --MartyD (talk) 11:39, 25 January 2023 (EST)
Thanks for your search Marty...interesting reading. I'll just say that I don't have an opinion on whether ARCs are in the db or not.
The point remains that there is no ARC guidance in the Help.
As far back as 2008, MHHutchins refers to ISFDB Policy and no-one calls him on it, so there must have been one - but where is it? Also, do we know whether consensus opinion has moved on in the intervening years? Kev. --BanjoKev (talk) 14:21, 25 January 2023 (EST)
I don't know that it has. If you have the desire and energy, you could open a new topic on Rules and standards discussions and see if anything definitive comes of it. Maybe we'd at least get an agreement on something specific to put into the acquisition policy. --MartyD (talk) 08:59, 26 January 2023 (EST)
Done :) Kev. --BanjoKev (talk) 09:23, 26 January 2023 (EST)

Unused cover image to be deleted

I mistakenly entered this as the cover image for a 2012 Project Gutenberg of Australia edition and then realized it's actually the cover for the 2018 "most recent update." (It's taken from the cover for the new 2018 Roy Glashan's Library edition.) I deleted the image from the 2012 entry and created a new image file for the 2018 PGA publication I'd just added. So this image should be deleted lest someone seeing "There are no usages of this file" adds it back to the 2012 publication, which probably had no cover at all. MOHearn (talk) 10:11, 25 January 2023 (EST)

Deleted. -- JLaTondre (talk) 16:58, 26 January 2023 (EST)
Thanks! MOHearn (talk) 23:09, 26 January 2023 (EST)

Incorrect information


I'm James Bennett, a British Fantasy and Horror writer. I have a page on the SF database, but there is wrongly listed information. Please can you advise me how to change and update this.

Thanks in advance, James Bennett —The preceding unsigned comment added by James Bennett (talkcontribs) 06:30, February 2, 2023‎

Hello, and welcome to our little database!
With your problem we have to know what is wrong with your summary page: is there a title spelled wrongly, is there something missing, or are tiles listed that don't belong there? Upon this the possible solution depends. Stonecreek (talk) 14:11, 2 February 2023 (EST)
Upon looking at it more closely I do suspect that the artwork may not be kosher, is that right? (The software doesn't know how to tell apart two different persons with the same name, we have to differentiate them by hand). Stonecreek (talk) 14:14, 2 February 2023 (EST)
That's right. The following works have not been created by me:
  • Novels - The Tithe of Esra'Nell (2017)
Author attribution corrected to James S. Bennett.
  • Cover Art: Quest for Faith (2003), Viking Pride (2003), Land of the Dead (2003), Hammer of the Gods (2003), The House That George Built (2011)
Disambiguated as James Bennett (artist)
  • Interior Art: Dream: A Tale of Wonder, Wisdom & Wishes (2004), The House That George Built (2009), Star Wars Visions: The Cantina (2010)
Disambiguated as James Bennett (artist)
And I would like to ADD the following if I may:
  • Short stories:
    • End Times in Paris - The Fox Spirit Book of Love (2021)
    • Morta - The Book of Queer Saints (2022)
    • Husk - There's More of Us Than You Know anthology (2022)
    • The Cicatrix - Tales From Between (2023)
    • Facts Concerning the First Annual Arkham Parade - Occult Detective Magazine (2023)
    • A Devilment - Raunch anthology (2023)
    • Essays: A Rainbow at Night: Reappraising the ‘Bury Your Gays’ trope - The Ginger Nuts of Horror (2022)
    • Novellas: The Dust of the Red Rose Knight - BOTH Press (2023)
    Thanks so much for your help! —The preceding unsigned comment added by James Bennett (talkcontribs) 10:46, February 3, 2023
    I've corrected the author attribution for the titles which should not have been attributed to you. (see inline above). The database is publication driven. To add titles to your author summary page, you enter the publications in which they appear. Give it a try, the reviewing moderator will help you with any problems. Please sign all your posts using four tildes (~~~~). John Scifibones 12:31, 3 February 2023 (EST)
    I added cover artist (Kyle de Silva) to Tithe... using Amazon, they have no other credits on ISFDB, seems odd to me for such a professional cover, probably more out there. --Username (talk) 12:34, 3 February 2023 (EST)

    Dante's Inferno

    Hi. I have purchased an ebook version of Mark Musa's translation of Dante's Inferno (ISBN 9780253012401) which I wanted to add. The translation sections, the main body of the book, are clearly very similar to 444379, but are ordered in a different way. The paperback has Canto I prose, verse, notes, Canto II prose, verse, notes, etc. The ebook has Canto I..XXXIV prose, Canto I verse, notes, Canto II verse, notes, ….

    At first glance, the various bits appear to be the same, just in a different order. Should I include title 1717942 in the ebook or should I create a new variant of 1640580?

    If the pieces are just ordered differently you just can clone the existing publication and order the pieces by piping the pages ('|1', '|2', '|3', and so on). Stonecreek (talk) 14:17, 2 February 2023 (EST)
    Sorry, I should have been more clear. The title 1717942 includes 34x3 pieces. There are not 34x3 existing titles. While creating 34x3 titles, one for each of the 34 Cantos prose, verse and notes pieces would be a solution, I'm not sure it's optimal. Actually, we could get away with 34x2 pieces (one for each of the 34 Cantos prose and one for each of the 34 Cantos verse+notes), but it's not much better.--AliHarlow (talk) 15:54, 2 February 2023 (EST)
    If both use Musa's translation then use the same title record. Do not create fictitious titles. If you wish to elaborate on the layout, do so in the publication notes. Use clone or add pub depending on how many titles from the tp appear in the ebook. John Scifibones 16:19, 2 February 2023 (EST)

    Glukhovsky - The World of Metro 2034

    This translated shortfiction title only exists in the pub under the title page Metro 2034.

    Looking at the translation help page / step 2 / option 2, my problem is that the title doesn't exist on the db in Russian (it would have been in the 2009 original edition. Can someone give me the Russian title? Thanks, Kev. --BanjoKev (talk) 18:06, 4 February 2023 (EST)

    I have found the first pages of the Russian original and of the Gollancz translation on the net. "The World of Metro 2034" is a translation of "Пролог" ("Prologue") in the Russian edition. Note that the Russian edition also contains a one-page "Annotation", which is basically an abridged and slightly modified version of the prologue. Ahasuerus (talk) 18:46, 4 February 2023 (EST)
    Thanks for looking that up. Just to be clear... should I make the canonical title just "Пролог"? Kev. --BanjoKev (talk) 19:05, 4 February 2023 (EST)
    I would suggest disambiguating it by appending "(Метро 2034)" to the end of the title. Ahasuerus (talk) 19:24, 4 February 2023 (EST)
    Perfect! Thanks, Kev. --BanjoKev (talk) 19:35, 4 February 2023 (EST)

    Asimov - The Gods Themselves

    Quandry. I have the Panther/Granada 1978 print. All the details there are correct - except the cover image (mine has no flash over the ship) and the OCLC/WorldCat: 614700011 (it should be 715472480). IanPercival cloned Don Erikson's 1976 print, including the link to his cover image. What would be the best way to treat this? Thanks, Kev. --BanjoKev (talk) 21:54, 7 February 2023 (EST)

    In general, you should fix the bits of the record that are wrong. (1) There is no OCLC/WorldCat verifier, so delete the incorrect OCLC reference, add the correct one, and make yourself OCLC/WorldCat verifier. (2) If you can scan your cover, do that and replace the image. You could also try to find an appropriate image on the web somewhere and link it or download/upload it, in place of doing your own scan. If you can't do either of those, then since the difference is relatively minor and the existing image is still helpful in identifying the book, I recommend keeping the cover and adding a note about the discrepancies between the image on the record and the image on your book. Whichever path you take here, make yourself a primary verifier. --MartyD (talk) 12:59, 9 February 2023 (EST)
    Thanks for that fulsome answer Marty. Perfect. Kev. --BanjoKev (talk) 13:26, 9 February 2023 (EST)

    variant cover image

    Hello, I have tried to variant this cover. Is it correct or the other way around? Many thanks Henna (talk) 16:54, 20 February 2023 (EST)

    I think it should be the other way around. Since Der Drache came first, and we have decided "Enric" is the artist's canonical name, this (3146453) should be the parent, and the other three should be made variants of that. --MartyD (talk) 11:11, 21 February 2023 (EST)
    Hello Marty, please take a look. Is it OK? Thanks again Henna (talk) 06:52, 22 February 2023 (EST)
    Yes, that looks right to me. --MartyD (talk) 09:18, 22 February 2023 (EST)

    Uploaded cover image - what next?

    I uploaded a cover image for a book edition that exists, but doesn't have a cover image. I can't find any information anywhere about what do do next to have it moved to the database. I've been trawling through the wiki a couple of times looking for beginners instructions but can't find anything. I have uploaded the file and it's sitting in the uploaded files area. It's been there 2 weeks. Is it a time thing? Do new images only get updated monthly or something? A general Faq about the end to end process of getting an image into the database would be useful. —The preceding unsigned comment added by JRBleckly (talkcontribs) 06:32, February 21, 2023‎

    You needed to edit the publication record entering the image link in the 'Image URL:' field. Here is the applicable help section. The link is also in the welcome message I just posted on your talk page. John Scifibones 08:31, 21 February 2023 (EST)
    Unrelated post moved to User talk:JRBleckly Author attribution. John Scifibones 09:23, 21 February 2023 (EST)


    Would a story where alive is not dead bur is living under assumed identity be considered SF? Thanks. gzuckier (talk) 11:19, 21 February 2023 (EST)

    Nope. Nothing speculative or supernatural in this. It won't be ours even if the main character "dies" in front of other characters by being injected by something that allows a doctor to pronounce them dead and then "revives". If you share a specific book, there may be something that makes it ours but just being considered dead while living elsewhere/as someone else is a thriller trope, not one of ours. Annie (talk) 11:41, 21 February 2023 (EST)
    Yeah, that's what I was thinking. thanks gzuckier (talk) 22:46, 21 February 2023 (EST)

    Asimov - Foundation & Empire variant

    Since submitting this 26th printing I've been changing the publication (approved) and prologue (pending) titles of two other pubs with Gambino's artwork; 1994-03-00 and 1996-00-00. Now all that's needed is a merge for the three, but I've hit the buffers.

    Gambino's titles are here and at the moment the date is 1994-03-00.

    If I merge the other two with my copy, the variant option is there but which date to chose? I can find no reference to a 1994-03-00 date. Locus1 gives "Foundation and Empire (HarperCollins UK 0-586-01355-5, May ’94 [Jun ’94], £4.99, 240pp, pb" and Locus has no title entry for Gambino under cover artists.

    My copy states it's a 1996 edition and so does the 1996-00-00 entry. The 1994-03-00 pub shows quite a chequered edit history. Suggestions please. Kev. --BanjoKev (talk) 06:49, 1 March 2023 (EST)

    As long as the 1994-03-00 publication is in there, the coverart title will carry its date. So the question really is - is that 1994 book really carrying this cover and is there a 1994 book?
    The cover angle may be the easier to tackle: The credit is based on this book which happens to have a lot of PVs, 2 of them very active. So hit them with the task to go and check in the book what exactly the credit in there is - is it for the art only or is that edition called specifically. Then we will be down to either our DB error (which we can talk about), an error in this book (which happens and we can document) or a confirmation of a 1994 cover). It is possible that because it is UK, the US dates are a bit muddled but... my guess is that we are in either door 1 or 2. But let's start with what that book actually credited.
    Meanwhile, start looking at OCLC, Goodreads, auctions and other online venues for that UK edition and see if the date is confirmable somewhere and if the cover for it can be verified to be this one. Annie (talk) 11:42, 1 March 2023 (EST)
    Thanks Annie for your time looking at this. I did spend a long while searching online but couldn't find a 1994-03-00 reference anywhere, but I'll try again. Meanwhile, yes, I'll find out what's in that book. One step at a time :) Kev. --BanjoKev (talk) 12:48, 1 March 2023 (EST)
    As Mavmaramis [1] noted, Fred Gambino did a single painting for the six Foundation books (on two panels). The full painting can be seen here. The reproduction in Ground Zero has the following note: 'Foundation series over (left panel)/(right panel) over Isaac Asimov over HarperCollins UK over Acrylic'. I.m.o. that means the illustrations were first used on the HarperCollins UK editions. We have five of these dated in 1994 (see here). I think this is the sixth, and should be dated 1994-03-00. Unfortunately the edits were done by user BarDenis, who hasn't been active since september 2013. Just my 2c. --Willem (talk) 15:52, 1 March 2023 (EST)
    The Locus entry goes on to state ...[Foundation] Reissue (Gnome 1953) SF novel; 28th printing. The Third Volume in the "Foundation" saga., which happens to match the printing cited in that undated record. So maybe that one should be dated 1994-05-00. --MartyD (talk) 16:14, 2 March 2023 (EST)
    Nice find Marty. I agree, and it's redated. There's still no sign of a source for the F & E 1994-03-00 date so I'll revert to the artist for clarification.
    Thanks to Willem and Mavmaramis for trying! Kev. --BanjoKev (talk) 21:01, 3 March 2023 (EST)

    Introrse: The King's Whisper

    I ran across a copy of this book and have two problems. The first is that the book seems to be quite obscure. ISFDB has no record of it or the author R. H. Martin. Anything I can find about him leads to a cult-ish, clique-ish pages and a member sign-in. Goodreads covers a paperback edition and a Kindle edition with ISBNs and Abebooks UK and Amazon seem to have copies for sale. It is the second in a series and the first exists in the OCLC, but not the second. I figure that I could use these to create entries, but that's the easy part. The copy I have is hard-bound. It has no publication information whatsoever. Page 1 is blank, page 3 is the start of the 'story' and it ends on the last page. I've not read the book, but it is sprinkled with diary excerpts dated 3050 and talks about the world of Schwa and the planet Hytrae, so is probably eligible. No copyright, no printing info, no page numbers. The first blank page has the inscription "Thanks for everything R. H. Martin". 8 1/2" by 11" pages. The title and author in gold leaf on cover and spine. Spine also has the word Sharp. Is this even a 'published' book? ../Doug H (talk) 23:31, 3 March 2023 (EST)

    You probable already found these, but he has a Facebook page and a website. Both list the same email address. You could try to ask him about it. --MartyD (talk) 11:07, 4 March 2023 (EST)
    I will try, but my question(s) remain - makes it a 'published' book under the revised criteria? What questions do I need to ask? ../Doug H (talk) 11:19, 4 March 2023 (EST)
    Well, you would explain what you have and ask what he can tell you about it. Given a hard cover, it seems unlikely to be an ARC. Given the existence of Kindle and paperback editions, it seems likely to be part of some sort of publication run. Assuming he knows what it is, he should be able to tell you when it was issued, its nature, who produced it, how many copies, etc. That should help you figure out if it's "published" in the sense that the ISFDB cares about. --MartyD (talk) 12:46, 6 March 2023 (EST) --Username (talk) 13:01, 6 March 2023 (EST)

    Hyde & Wintz - Précieuses reliques: Precious Artifacts 3

    I've submitted this and I think there are problems with it. I've entered the titles as they they appear in the book.

    • What are the titling issues here?
    • How do I treat the (back and forth) translations (if at all) - they're published simultaneously?
    Btw, I'm aware of the titles transliteration and author name varianting needing to be done.

    Advice please. Kev. --BanjoKev (talk) 14:10, 7 March 2023 (EST)

    Some suggestions (others may disagree, so don't rush off to implement):
    1. I would be inclined to make the main title be the French, then the English:
      Précieuses reliques: Une bibliographie de Philip K. Dick / Precious Artifacts 3: A Philip K. Dick Bibliography
      and document the presentation on the title page in the notes, as you have done.
    2. You should be able to keep the contents you have, and then for the ones where there's a full essay and its translation, I am pretty sure once accepted you can make the translation a variant of the original, even with both appearing in the same publication. If which is the original is unclear, going with the French one seems best to me -- it sounds like 60% (or more) French, 40% (or less) English.
    3. You should add disambiguation to "Préface", "Forward", and "Index des Noms".
    Nothing else leapt out at me. Very comprehensive notes! --MartyD (talk) 19:19, 7 March 2023 (EST)
    Elegant solutions to all the questions I had about this. Thanks Marty! Kev. --BanjoKev (talk) 10:31, 9 March 2023 (EST)

    Interior art variants

    I've entered an omnibus where the author's name has dropped an initial, generating variant titles. This has reproduced the interior illustrations of the original. In the original, the illustrations were added individually to the contents using the [n] index. Given that the order of the illustrations doesn't match, I prefer to enter them as a single entry for each novel. I believe I should date both to the omnibus publication date, but would like to variant them to the original entries. However, I could date them to the original and variant the individual interior art titles mine. Aside from this date clean-up, the whole shebang starts here. N.B. If you follow links, you can see there are only about 6 or 7 illustrations, and I do have access to the original and could match illustrations up and re-use/import the titles. Let's assume there were dozens, or I didn't have access, as opposed to, say, not liking the idea of delineating illustrations in the first place without including the actual artwork. ../Doug H (talk) 16:53, 11 March 2023 (EST)

    We do not variant records for individual artwork to records for combined artworks (or vice versa). You should only variant if they are records for the same artwork (individual to individual or combined to combined). If you choose to use a combined record where the original used individual, then you should add a title note explaining that and you can link to the original records in the title note, but not create variants. -- JLaTondre (talk) 10:42, 12 March 2023 (EDT)
    Hi! I've one remark: if there's reason to believe the illustrations were published with the original novel publications they should be dated to that appearance (and have notes added why they don't show up with them). Christian Stonecreek (talk) 06:57, 12 March 2023 (EDT)
    Variants are dated at the first publication of the variant. -- JLaTondre (talk) 10:42, 12 March 2023 (EDT)

    UK price in Guineas

    I've encountered a 1901 publication with the price listed in BLIC as "3 gns" i.e. 3 Guineas. I entered it as it appears the the catalog, which caused a yellow warning. Should we enter as "gns 30", or should it be recalculated into shillings as "63/-"? Thoughts. --Ron ~ RtraceTalk 07:40, 13 March 2023 (EDT)

    Considering that it is always a set rate, I'd add it as 63/- and add a note that BLIC credited in guineas. It is unclear what the book used but considering that most of our books are considerably under a Guinea, that may be just a convention of recording - either in BLIC or on the books when the value is so high (kinda like books used 50c or 50p until they came closer to the dollar but in reverse... Annie (talk) 12:20, 13 March 2023 (EDT)
    The edition priced at 3 Guineas, was printed on vellum and limited to 15 copies, as opposed to the edition printed on paper for 15/- and limited to 300. The Wikiepdia article on the currency states that in the 20th century, "The guinea had an aristocratic overtone, so professional fees, and prices of land, horses, art, bespoke tailoring, furniture, white goods and other "luxury" items were often quoted in guineas until a couple of years after decimalisation in 1971". Both prices are from BLIC and given that the prices are quoted differently, I'm guessing that the vellum edition was sold as a luxury item. Regardless, I can convert the price to shillings. I already had added a note explaining the abbreviation and its source and value in shillings. I'll adjust accordingly. --Ron ~ RtraceTalk 13:27, 13 March 2023 (EDT)
    I suspect that you are right and the guineas price was a convention in high-end goods. If we expect to have a lot of books like that, we can always add the currency but... the UK prices are already complicated as it is, adding a new wrinkle for a book or 3 will be an overkill. I don't really have a strong opinion though so if everyone else disagrees, I won't oppose adding it. I just don't see it being helpful. Annie (talk) 13:58, 13 March 2023 (EDT)
    PS: If we decide to go with a note and conversion, I think we should add that to the help page so people know how to convert and record if they see a price in guineas - the same way we have notes on how to record prices in p for example. Annie (talk) 14:03, 13 March 2023 (EDT)

    John Howard

    Hi, This is John Howard (1961, ID 25485). Could a new author please be created so that the following entries can be attributed to him - they are not by me:

    In Anthologies: Strange Tales (1976);

    In Short Fiction: Grasshoppers (2010) / Spook (2010) / Mountain Man (2012) / The Judiciales (2012);

    In Essays: The Great Wild West Writing Challenge (2014).

    Thank you. All best, John —The preceding unsigned comment was added by JohnHoward (talkcontribs) . 07:18, 16 March 2023‎ (EDT)

    Welcome to ISFDB, John. I'll work on this for you. ···日本穣 · 投稿 · Talk to Nihonjoe 14:41, 16 March 2023 (EDT)
    Okay, this is all done. I split them into two additional authors/editors because I don't think the 1976 John Howard is the same as the 2010s John Howard. Please let us know if there are any others things that need fixing. ···日本穣 · 投稿 · Talk to Nihonjoe 14:54, 16 March 2023 (EDT)

    Duplicate Cover Scan

    Two pubs, Mission Critical and Insertion have the same artwork on the cover, but differ in the printing. When I uploaded the cover for Mission Critical early this year, I mistakenly uploaded the cover for Insertion. Trying to correct my error, I deleted the cover art for Mission Critical and tried to upload the correct art. But I can't; I get a message telling me that the new upload is the same as the old one and cannot get the new version to upload. How do I fix this? Bob (talk) 12:21, 19 March 2023 (EDT)

    If you look at File:MSSNCRTCLP2023.jpg, it did successfully upload. -- JLaTondre (talk) 14:01, 19 March 2023 (EDT)
    No. That is the cover scan that prevents the loading of the one for Mission Critical. As I said, the artwork is identical, but the title and authors differ. Bob (talk) 20:23, 20 March 2023 (EDT)
    You should be able to tell it to upload anyway despite the warnings. What is the exact error message you are seeing? The "This file is a duplicate of the following file" one or the "A file with this name exists already"? In either way, you should see the "Ignore warnings and save file anyway" button at the bottom. Annie (talk) 21:02, 20 March 2023 (EDT)
    It says the file is a duplicate. I hit ignore warnings in the original upload to no effect, and when it shows a duplicate (which is NOT a duplicate), it only allows to reload, not to load anyhow. The problem is more complex that I originally thought. The pub is also in the data base uploaded from Amazon, so it's duplicated. Is the easiest solution to delete the copy I loaded, go to the Amazon copy and try uploading the cover scan? Bob (talk) 16:35, 21 March 2023 (EDT)
    When I look at File:MSSNCRTCLP2023.jpg, the cover title is "Mission Critical" and the authors on the cover match this record 923797. Try clearing your browser cache and revisiting the page. It is likely that your browser is just confused and is showing you its cached version of the old cover when the new one is already there (which is why you are getting a duplicate image error). -- JLaTondre (talk) 17:34, 21 March 2023 (EDT)
    Bob, you also need to add it to the URL field -- the file seems to be in there - it is just not connected. Did you happen to miss that step by any chance? (just dotting i's and crossing t's here). Annie (talk) 17:42, 21 March 2023 (EDT)

    Avoiding variant of a variant

    I have a couple of questions leading on from this earlier thread Hyde & Wintz. There are five essays which are translations of the French and I'm stuck now on how to proceed in making them variants of the canonical French titles.

    Here's one example: This is the canonical French title and its variant French title. This is the canonical English translation and its variant English title.

    So, the questions are, how do I go about this and could I have gone about it a better way? Thanks, Kev. --BanjoKev (talk) 13:06, 19 March 2023 (EDT)

    As both authors are listed as English authors in ISFDB, for ISFDB purposes the English title is the canonical title and the French title is the translation. 3156720 would be the parent with both 3154168 and 3154169 varianted to it. 3156721 would be deleted. -- JLaTondre (talk) 13:56, 19 March 2023 (EDT)
    Just to clarify something in the general rules in case someone finds this later: how the author language is set is irrelevant for determining what is the canonical title. If the originals are created/written in French (aka the author wrote them in French originally), the French record becomes the parent no matter what language the author usually uses. If the translation is done via an intermediate language (Bulgarian translations of a Japanese novel done from the Russian translation for example), the middle language is only in the notes as we cannot have variant of variants. Same with revised translations, same translations under different title/author forms and so on. We have quite a few multi-lingual authors where that is important). Annie (talk) 11:59, 20 March 2023 (EDT)
    Thank you Annie for that clarification. That's what I was waiting for. I now have the solution to my original question. Kev. --BanjoKev (talk) 12:34, 20 March 2023 (EDT)
    Just make sure in such cases to check that it is "written in French" and not "written for the French editions and translated by an unknown (or known) hand including the author's" or "first published in French". The latter two will have the English as the original as that was the original text). Art is... more complicated. So let's not talk about it here. :) Annie (talk) 12:45, 20 March 2023 (EDT)