Series talk:Perry Rhodan

Perry Rhodan

Hello, Willem! As avid reader of the German author Andreas Eschbach I have added his three PR novellas to the lot. But: I counted them as chapbooks, because at the time of entering this is what I thought they are. They started back in '61 as pure fiction booklets (with some illustrations, I think). All other additions (letter pages, reports etc.) came later and still are in my opinion not enough to qualify them as magazines. But if the standard in our little db is different, we could change the three. On the other hand, I have seen hints that a major discussion of PR has been avoided so far. Would this qualify as a challenge for us? Second point: I came on this while searching for Klaus N. Frick, which led to PR 2500. And there I found a typo: The cover (and my copy) says 'Projekt Saturn' instead of 'Project Saturn'. Could you correct this as moderator or shall I inform the verifier? And shouldn't the title 'Perry Rhodan #2500:' be transferred into the series title, i.e. deleted?Stonecreek 19:59, 10 December 2010 (UTC)

I have just found out that there was indeed a discussion on the topic and that right now there are not enough resources for the series as a whole. So, I leave it to you to decide what is to be done about Eschbach's writings. If it comes to entering the series, I could help with a moderate support: I buy about every sixth issue to keep track of the developments.

On the role of the editor: The late Robert Feldhoff has been responsible as 'exposé editor' for the chronological development of the series (he died in 2009), Klaus N. Frick on the other hand has the last say on the product as a whole. He coordinates for example the illustrations (also cover), reports etc. So maybe it would be better to include the two of them (or three, because there was a time when two people worked as 'exposé factory'). Stonecreek 19:09, 11 December 2010 (UTC)

Hi Christian. Good to have a German editor here! I could use some (a lot of) help with the original Perry Rhodan series. First, the main reason for me to add them to the database, is to be able to add the Dutch translations when foreign language support is implemented. Since I only own a few hundred of the originals, I use the data from Perrypedia (each issue I enter has a link to the Perrypedia page). I will add data and verify the issues I own sometime in the future, but for now I only enter the first printing, and only the illustrations and the novellas. I would rather not discuss the magazine/chapterbook/novel(la) issues again, as far as I'm concerned, the series is published as a magazine, and I'm happy about that. The Dutch editions have no letter pages, but they will be entered as magazines anyway. I work (copy/paste) from an excel-spreadsheet where I have the neccesary data.

For the other points: the typo is a good spot! I will change the title and notify user WeAreGray. The addition "Perry Rhodan, #2500:" is used because it is entered as a magazine. See this help page under Publication Information (Magazines and Missing or variant dates). The title record doesn't get the addition, only the publication. The editor is a good point. In most issues I own, no editor is mentioned, Perrypedia has a nice overview of the exposé-autoren (the exact issues they did), but for Klaus N. Frick (1992 - present) and his predecessors Günter M. Schelwokat (#11 - 1987 or 1992?) and Florian F. Marzin (1987 - 1995) things are not clear to me. If you can find the issue numbers they started/stopped with ... Anyway, thanks for the input. Let me know what you can (want to) do. --Willem H. 21:19, 17 December 2010 (UTC)

Well, it should be possible to determine the changing issues from Marzin onwards and, with some luck, from Schelwokat, but it will take some research time in the catacombs or 2nd hand stores. The man who started it all was to my knowledge Kurt Bernhardt. So he could be mentioned as well for the first issues. I can (and am willing to) enter the issues I have. From the first printing this would start around issue 600 - but still only every 5th or 6th issue, some of them are nevertheless from later printings. It's up to you to determine where I shall start. Stonecreek 11:10, 21 December 2010 (UTC)

That would be very welcome. I don't think Schelwokat or Marzin are mentioned in the issues (I looked at #816, only the exposé-redaction is credited, I think they dropped that again later on). If it's not too much trouble, please add a note on this page every now and then, which issues you entered, so I can incorporate them in the series when I reach those numbers. I state my progress on the project page. Thanks, --Willem H. 21:52, 21 December 2010 (UTC)

So, from the project page (maybe we put our communication regarding PR over there?) it would be right to begin with the next issue of the 1st printing after #370? Rainer Castor: I'm not sure if it'd be right to include him as editor. From the Perrypedia it seems he 'only' gives aid in getting the huge amount of data right when there's a connection to earlier issues. Eminent, but I'd give Feldhoff or Anton the main credit in the exposé work (at least, they work(ed) out the plots and decide(d) who writes which issue). What do you think? Stonecreek 14:51, 22 December 2010 (UTC)

Good suggestion. I had progressed to #390, but forgot to add this to the project page. It's always smart to check the series grid, as well as the author's bibliography to be certain an issue is not already entered. About Rainer Castor, I only followed the information on Perrypedia. The database makes no difference in first or second (or third) editors, so there will never be a ´main´ editor. I.m.o. it´s better to credit them all. --Willem H. 20:48, 22 December 2010 (UTC)

Hello, Willem. I just added the first of my first printings (#521 by Ernst Vlcek). Would you like to take a look at it, especially if it's okay to include Schelwokat? By the way, up to which issue is the Dutch edition of PR now? Maybe it will be 2011 for my next submissions. Until then, all the best to you. Stonecreek 14:43, 23 December 2010 (UTC)

Approved, I have no problem with Schelwokat, but I changed the publication date to 1971-08-27 (I calculated the dates from information on this page). When I reach that far, I can just check the editor records for issues already entered. The Dutch series is now up to #2064. The publisher switched to double issues every two weeks in 2009. I only have the first 1000, stopped collecting Dutch SF around 1990 (I stopped reading translations back in 1974, so continuing to collect them seemed like a waste of space and money). Have a good Christmas, and "see" you next year. --Willem H. 20:44, 23 December 2010 (UTC)

A happy new year to you! According to the interview with Frick in this pub, it would be a working hypothesis to mark #1400 as change issue from Schelwokat to Marzin. Citation: "Mit Band 1400 gab es diese große Zäsur. Damals ist Dr. Florian F. Marzin Chefredakteur geworden." The second change in question can be nailed in the future, I think: In #1782 it's Marzin in the copyrights, in #1792 it's Frick. I hope to find the exact issue in one or the other shop. Apart from that I started to enter the issues I have from #2400ff., also. (I read just today #2481, which was excellent, although not from a Dutchman - inspite of the name.) And there are four more issues from the 500s to follow. Stonecreek 19:59, 1 January 2011 (UTC)

Thanks! I had already left my wishes on your talk page. This is good news, it leaves only the credit for #1783 to #1791 uncertain. Unfortunately I have none of these issues. A added the information to my spreadsheet, if you want a copy of this (excel format), send me an e-mail (I can be reached from the tool box on my user page). Copy/paste beats entering data manually i.m.o.

Another thing, you entered a few issues without the novella's title in the publication's title. This takes two edits to correct (the pub record and the editor record). The right way to enter the publication's title is: 'Perry Rhodan, #no: title. The comma is cosmetic, it makes the issue grid look nice. --Willem H. 20:38, 1 January 2011 (UTC)

Missing novellas?

I wonder why, for example on this page, the author has only a handful of shortfictions mentioned when he should have 50 or so, i.e. all the novellas from his Perry Rhodan work. Do you have any explanation? Stonecreek 18:22, 14 January 2011 (UTC)

They are there, but in the "Short Fiction Series" section. BLongley 18:31, 14 January 2011 (UTC)

Oh yeah, it's time to sign off for today: I can't see the obvious anymore. Stonecreek 19:08, 14 January 2011 (UTC)

I just tried to fix PR, #285 by William Voltz (which started the confusion) into the title series "PR Zyklus 5: Die Meister der Insel" but either I'm in no good shape anymore or just to damn stupid. Good night, folks. Stonecreek 19:20, 14 January 2011 (UTC)

Series and sub-series

I should have said something about this before I think. I noticed your effort to place your additions in the Perry Rhodan series, but there are two kinds of series here, and you chose the wrong one. Let me explain:

There is the main series I called Perry Rhodan Universe. It contains a sub-series called "Perry Rhodan Weekly", where the various cycles go as sub-sub-series. The novella title records are added to these sub-sub-series (see for instance PR Zyklus 8: Der Schwarm.
The sub-sub-series must be created in the right order, to be shown correctly (at least I hope so). I'll take care of that.
Aside from the "heftromans" there are the paperbacks, the Atlan series and others. These will eventually have their own sub-series under "Perry Rhodan Universe", and the novels / novella's in these series will have their own sub-sub-series if that's neccesary.
This should not be confused with the editor series, where the editor records go (see here for the first printing. The US-editions are here, the first 8 british editions are here, and there will be others for the other printings.
The editor records are clustered per year, see this for the 1963 issues of the 1st edition. I will remove the reprints of #108, #109 and #110.

Don't be depressed by this, you're doing a wonderful job. Thanks, --Willem H. 20:56, 14 January 2011 (UTC)

Thank you very much, that explains a lot. I have just another item in the PR Universe upcoming: With issue #2402 started a short story series called 'Stellaris' within the universe. It has a pre-determined setting: the space freighter 'STELLARIS' and is written by various authors (as usual for PR). As lover of short stories I started to collect them (they are published usually every 8 weeks). I will enter the first issue and hope that you can put it also into the PR Universe. (Or can you give some advice how to enter it in the right order?) Stonecreek 09:24, 15 January 2011 (UTC)

I think I cleaned up most of the numbers below 1000, the rest will follow. The Stellaris series is a nice one for you to try. I assume the first story is "Ausgerutscht" by Michael Marcus Thurner. You go to the title record of the story, push "Edit Title Data", which leads you to this screen. There you fill out the series field (Stellaris) and the series number (1). This creates the Stellaris series. After this is accepted by a moderator, you go to the series record, edit this and add "Perry Rhodan Universe" as parent series. Want to try it? --Willem H. 12:59, 15 January 2011 (UTC)

Two more questions

Mhhutchins brought up a question about the notation of the pagination, see here. The problem is that the magazines are staplebounded in the center and the stories or journals are put right into the middle of the novella and have the pagination 1-12. What do you think?

Yeah, this would eventually come up. The help text (under pages) is pretty clear about this, "For magazines, the convention is to use the actual page count - including the cover." That's why I have entered them all with 68 pages (64 plus cover). For this pub, and others with the extra's stapled in the center, I would go for 68+12 (or 68+16 or whatever), and explain this in the notes. For the contents of the insert you could use Roman numerals (like we do with a lot of Ace-doubles). One issue that's on my desk (#816) even uses Roman numerals for the Perry Rhodan-Report section. Page count fot that issue would (IMO) be 68+XVI. --Willem H. 17:15, 18 January 2011 (UTC)

Record(s) changed (#2402 had the same problem, but with a story). Stonecreek 20:27, 20 January 2011 (UTC)

And another one: Maybe all 'round' magazines after #2000 (i.e. #2000, #2100 etc.) have an extraordinary length and in the case of #2400 (not yet entered) it rounds up to 88 pages of text. Considering that there is 1.5 to 2 times as many text on a page in PR than in a normal book that would qualify them as novels. Shall we enter them as those or stick with the novella? Stonecreek 15:06, 18 January 2011 (UTC)

I know some of these are novel length, and should be entered as such. Issue 2500 is already in the database. No problem there I think. --Willem H. 17:15, 18 January 2011 (UTC)

New editor's contribution to the Perry Rhodan series

A new editor as made a submission for Issue #1000 of the German series, and I've placed it on hold. I'm too unfamiliar with how these are to be handled to accept it. One thing, he uses the editor's initials, unlike how it's entered for the remaining volumes. Also, it's entered as an ANTHOLOGY type while the others are MAGAZINEs. Also he gives it a new publication series name, and the publisher configuration differs from the Willem, can you take over the submission? Thanks. Mhhutchins 20:46, 18 January 2011 (UTC)

If you release the hold, I'll take it over. This is one outside the main series. Anthology is correct, but there are other issues. Thanks, --Willem H. 20:48, 18 January 2011 (UTC)

Early Themistokles

I have three interior illustrations for early PRs which are doubtful. See this pub record for Themistokles Kanelakis from 1964. But according to perrypedia he was born only 1955 and began working for the series in 1980. I suspect that somehow these illustrations crept in from later printings. Stonecreek 19:41, 1 February 2011 (UTC)

Good catch I think. I copied the credit from Perrypedia, but they're probably wrong. I dropped them a note about this, and will change the credit when I have an answer. Thanks! --Willem H. 20:32, 1 February 2011 (UTC)

Thank you! Do you have an e-mail address of the perrypedia or are you a contributor there too? Because I have another mistake found. The perrypedia attributes some of the interior art falsely to Alfred Kelsner (for example for #1007), when it is in fact by somebody else (in this case Kanelakis, identifiable by the signature). Shall I inform them (in which case I'd need the address)? Stonecreek 18:45, 2 February 2011 (UTC)

Perrypedia is a wiki application, just like this part of the ISFDB. You can create an account and join the fun (I did yesterday). There is one response to my note, see here that sounds plausible. You can inform them (or maybe change the credits yourself, haven't found that out yet), I think your German is a lot better than mine. Thanks, --Willem H. 20:01, 2 February 2011 (UTC)

Just changed the Themistokles interior art into Johnny Bruck art for those early issues. Stonecreek 13:23, 3 February 2011 (UTC)

New Fiction Series

Hello, Willem (and who else is reading)! Look at this author page of Robert Feldhoff. It seems that entering #2400 as novel had an unwanted side-effect. This issue is now part of a new Fiction Series instead of the usual Short Fiction Series. What shall we do about it? Stonecreek 09:32, 3 February 2011 (UTC)

I got it

Just found today #1783 in a second hand shop, it gives Klaus N. Frick as editor, so we've got the change issue!

And one more thing: I've started to verify (and edit) the issues I don't have by looking at them in the second hand shops. Momentarily these are some issues from Zyklus 16: Die Kosmische Hanse. Stonecreek 17:20, 7 February 2011 (UTC)