User talk:Ofearna/Archive01

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March 2012

Author update for E. J. Copperman

I'm rejecting your submission to update the author data for E. J. Copperman. You give two names in the legal name field. There should only be one name in the format: LASTNAME, FIRSTNAME MIDDLENAME. So please make another submission. Also what is source of your information of the author's real name? Thanks. Mhhutchins 20:49, 8 March 2012 (UTC)

I found this author's website confirming the pseudonym. So the legal name should be entered as "Cohen, Jeffrey". Mhhutchins 20:52, 8 March 2012 (UTC)
There's no place for add new author. I think a MODERATOR has to create the Jeffrey Cohen author, then they/I can add the pseudonym information?Ofearna 21:53, 8 March 2012 (UTC)

Asking questions in the Note to Moderator field... not a very good idea. If it's an important question, it should be asked on the Moderator Noticeboard before you make the submission, where all the moderators will get a chance to see it and respond. Any questions placed in the "Note to Moderator" field of a submission is only seen by one person, who may or may not be able to answer it. And if the answer to the question means the submission has to be rejected your efforts were in vain. The purpose of the "Note to Moderator" field is to provide additional data that will help the moderator in his decision to accept or reject the submission. It is only temporary and disappears when the submission is accepted or rejected. But a note on the Moderator's Noticeboard is there forever, allowing many people the opportunity to answer your question. Mhhutchins 05:08, 9 March 2012 (UTC)

Now to the questions or statements you made in the "Note to Moderator" field in recent submissions:

  • In the submission to update this title record you add "also appeared in A Handful of Twist-Ties I from Common Threads. In the story Tom Renfield (from The Thread That Binds The Bones) is a teenager living with his aunt and cousin. -" I can only ask: did you intend this to be part of the record? If so you can add it to the title record's note field. It has nothing to do with the moderator's acceptance of the submission.
There is no place in the Common Threads or Handful of Twist-ties where I can add this story to the contents, so basically I was asking for help. I'll use the MODboard from now on. Ofearna 21:09, 9 March 2012 (UTC)
  • In the submission to update this title record you say "since this is basically the first chapter of A Red Heart of Memories and it involves both Matt Black and Edmund, where would it fall?" I would ask you as one who has read the story to make a decision about which series it would best fit. Unfortunately the ISFDB doesn't allow a title to be part of two series, even though it happens with some frequency. I also think it is important to add to the title's note field that it's the chapter of another work, as this is pretty important information that should be a permanent part of the record.
The Matt Black and Edmund AND Spores Ferry are basically one big series... but from this story/novel they area all one, then they separate again for the Magic Next Door trilogy. Ofearna 21:09, 9 March 2012 (UTC)
  • In the submission to update this title record you say: "only truly stand-alone novel by NKH to date" which is not relevant to the acceptance of the submission, but might be useful in the record's visible note field. But you should date it in case the situation should change in the future.
it's basically a long novella, but it was published as a book. I'll add a quickie synopsis that indicates this info. Ofearna 21:09, 9 March 2012 (UTC)
  • You asked about whether "Sweet Apple Jr. High" is a title series or a publication series, in order to determine whether Third Wheel. It's a non-genre work, so it's not that important to place it into any series. Just looking at it, without any information about it's contents, I would guess it was a publication series, but if the setting for each novel is the same high school and with recurring characters it would be a title series, even if it's written by different authors. I'll ask you to make that determination. Mhhutchins 05:08, 9 March 2012 (UTC)
Sweet *Valley* Jr. High. I'd say the Pub Series was Sweet Valley High, since Jr Hi as a spin-off? See why I'm confused ^_^ Ofearna 21:09, 9 March 2012 (UTC)

Merging titles

Now that you've created a record for Hoffman's upcoming story collection, you'll have to merge the title records that were created with those that are already in the database. If you look at the summary page for Nina Kiriki Hoffman, under the shortfiction category, you'll see that there are now duplicate title records for several stories, e. g. "Sourheart", "Trees Perpetual for Sleep" "Home for Christmas", etc. These can be easily merged into one record.

  • Click the link "Check for Duplicate Titles" under the Editing Tools menu.
  • On the next page, you'll find more than a dozen matched identical pairs. Each set is merged with a separate submission. Check the box on both of the matching titles and click "Merge Selected Records".
  • On the next page you may be asked to reconcile the differences between the two records. Sometimes the date is different, sometimes the length differs, sometimes one has notes while the other doesn't. The first rule is don't destroy data. If one has data and the other doesn't choose the option that has data. For dates, as a rule, choose the earliest one, or if one is non-month dated and the other is, choose the one with the month. Also, choose the one that has a language, because recent software changes have given English as the default language.
  • Once you've reconciled the two records, click the "Complete Merge" button. A moderator will look over the submission and then either accept it or reject it.

If you need assistance, just ask. Mhhutchins 04:35, 10 March 2012 (UTC)

Had to wait for the title to be created then (now) I could merge titles. I've done so. Now waiting. Ofearna 16:58, 12 March 2012 (UTC)
I think you missed part of point 3 - many of your submissions kept the xxxx-00-00 date rather than one with a specified month. Can you please re-check? BLongley 17:37, 12 March 2012 (UTC)
I've accepted the submissions and then went back to correct the dates, returning the month of publication to the merged record. As I instructed, and as Bill points out, you should choose the record that is month-dated over the one that isn't. Thanks. Mhhutchins 18:42, 12 March 2012 (UTC)

Working with primary verified records

I've accepted submissions updating the cover artist credit for several records, but am holding the one changing the credit for a primary-verified record. Looking under the content section of the record, you'll see a list titled "Verification Status". The first one checked (and the only one on this record) is for a Primary Verification, which means that this record has been checked against the actual book. You should never change information in a record that has been primary verified without first contacting the editor who verified it and let him know that there may be an error in the record. Some editors don't mind if you add a cover image or notes to a primary verified record and they'll say so in messages at the top of their talk page. Some have different levels of notification so you have to read the message to determine how to handle changes. The first rule about changing verified records then is to contact the editor before you make a submission. If you're only adding data, you can make the submission first, but still leave a message on the editor's talk page. I'll hold the submission changing the cover artist credit for this primary-verified record until you've left him a message. I'm positive your change is a correct one, because the same cover art was used on a US edition of a different book in my collection and it is credited to Maitz, not White. Still, it's ISFDB etiquette to notify the primary verifier. The book itself may have incorrectly stated the artist credit and that should be noted in the record. Mhhutchins 05:08, 10 March 2012 (UTC)

Intermittently, following Michaels notification, I have approved the change of cover artist to Maitz and added a note to the pub. record. Tim White was in fact credited on the copyright page, so thanks for correcting a misleading entry! Stonecreek 08:54, 12 March 2012 (UTC)
Thanks, Christian. Mhhutchins 18:44, 12 March 2012 (UTC)

Verified pubs, sourcing data, and other ISFDB tasks

Now that you've learned the basic tasks of adding and updating pub records, the next step in the process is learning how to verify records and source data. If you're working from a book-in-hand, either creating a new record or updating one that's already in the database, you should do a primary verification of the record. Instructions for verifying records are here.

Sourcing data seems to be a stumbling block for many new editors. I think the fact that we'll rather lax on them at the beginning may lead to some bad habits. The biggest one, in my opinion, is updating records for books that they don't have, but are using secondary sources which they fail to note in the record. This isn't a big problem at first because most new editors want to first add and update records for books in their own collection. When they start branching out, the sticky part starts. All we ask is that when you update records for books that are not in-hand, that you give the source of your data in the record's note field.

Here's a list of other pages in the Help Section of the wiki that tell you How to do the most common tasks. Some are more complicated and you'll eventually be able to accomplish most of them with ease. Some are rather simple, like merging and varianting, which eventually every editor should learn. I hope this doesn't scare you away, because I can see you becoming a valuable member of the ISFDB team. Thanks and your contributions are appreciated. Mhhutchins 05:10, 10 March 2012 (UTC)

Rat Tales

The submission adding this record was accepted. There's a problem with the ISBN, which you entered as "0-940841-07x". The system only recognizes the capital "X" as a final digit. That will have to be corrected. Also a question: The OCLC record gives the page count as v+114, and has a note about the limitation: "Edition of 144 copies; 33 bound in albino (26 lettered A to Z and distributed to authors, editors, and artists), 111 bound in gray (100 numbered I to C and offered for sale)." Does your copy have the roman-numeraled pages, and is this limitation stated in the book? Mhhutchins 20:49, 12 March 2012 (UTC)

Forgot to say: the OCLC record also gives three different ISBNs (perhaps one for each state of the edition): 0940841061, 094084107X, 0940841088. We should create an record for each ISBN if we determine which ISBN goes to which state. Also can you check the spelling of the name of the first author? I believe it should be "Jon" instead of "John". We go by the credit given on the first page of the story, not the table of contents. Thanks. Mhhutchins 20:53, 12 March 2012 (UTC)
The stories on pages 18 and 26 are by similarly named authors. Can you recheck the spelling of each credit? And author of "The Captain" was entered as "V.E. Mitchell". We always add a space after the period in initials. Mhhutchins 21:02, 12 March 2012 (UTC)
Dangit, one was credited to wrong author. Fixed it (Grasshopper Mousse) Ofearna 18:02, 13 March 2012 (UTC)
Still waiting for the above corrections. Also, I accepted the submissions adding two more states to this title, but all three are given as hardcover and all have the same note field. You should adapt the note field so that it pertains to the particular state which the record represents. Mhhutchins 04:44, 13 March 2012 (UTC)
I *think* I've done all you asked for. Now I'm gonna scan my copy and call my cousin for my other copy back. They should be in Flag in the next couple weeks... Ofearna 18:28, 13 March 2012 (UTC)

Removing messages from a talk page

May I suggest that instead of deleting messages from your talk page, it would be better to archive them. There was a lot of good information that was given with each of the messages that was left here. By archiving them on a new page, you always have access to them if the need arises. If you like, I could set up a new section for you to archive older messages. Mhhutchins 19:39, 13 March 2012 (UTC)

Ooh, how do I do that? I saved them on my harddrive under the author/artist we were talking about but this sounds better. Ofearna 19:57, 13 March 2012 (UTC)
Except it would be very difficult for any other editor to search for a message on your hard drive. :) I'll set up an archive page for you, and then you can move any messages over. It's easier to just archive all messages based on a time period. For instance, all messages for January 2012 (if you get alot), or those for the period July-December 2011. It's up to you. Mhhutchins 21:18, 13 March 2012 (UTC)
It's been set up. There's a link at the top of this page to go to the Archives. On that page you'll find a link for "Archive 01", which is the first page on which to copy the messages. Once that page is full (at around 100kb), you can start another page and title it "Archive 02". Mhhutchins 21:27, 13 March 2012 (UTC)

Capitalization in titles

As per instructions on this page:

Regularized case means that the first word is capitalized, and all later words are also capitalized except for "and", "the", "a", "an", "for", "of", "in", "on", "by", "at", "from", "with", and "to".

I might add that if any of these are the last word they would be capitalized. I reverted the title of the de Lint story back to "Death Leaves an Echo". Mhhutchins 19:52, 13 March 2012 (UTC)

Hardcover "paper" edition

Can you check the binding of this record? Thanks. Mhhutchins 19:55, 13 March 2012 (UTC)

I don't have that edition, but on the copyright page of my book, it has the isbn next to "paper" as the version. Ofearna 19:56, 13 March 2012 (UTC)
Then I don't think you should have "hc" in the binding/format field. More likely it would be "tp". Mhhutchins 21:15, 13 March 2012 (UTC)
I don't have the book (I think this is the version of the book I loaned to my cousin when her daughter was in the hospital after getting mauled by a PittBull), but I'll change it and wait to verify until Cindy or Lilly returns my book. Ofearna 21:19, 13 March 2012 (UTC)

User page vs. talk page

I moved the message you left concerning Valor's Choice on Marc Kupper's user page to his talk page. I also linked the pub record and added a note that the message was from you. To get from a user's page to that user's talk page, click on the "Discussion" tab, or the "Discuss This Page" link (depending upon what skin you've chosen to use). Mhhutchins 20:08, 13 March 2012 (UTC)

Cover art for A Confederation of Valor

I've rejected the submission adding a note about the use of the cover art in this pub record. This note was more suited for the artwork's the title record, so I moved it there and then made it into a variant record of the one for the earlier book. Mhhutchins 20:19, 13 March 2012 (UTC)

BTW, you say that he says he wasn't credited. but the record states he is credited on the copyright page. If this is true, please correct the cover art record with the note. Thanks. Mhhutchins 20:27, 13 March 2012 (UTC)

The Newford Stories

You can also enter the individual story contents of the collections in this omnibus. Or even better: import the contents from the records of the three publications that are contained in this publication. This will save you from having to merge all of the title records of the individual stories. Ask if you need assistance in importing. Tip: uncheck the "Include page number" box, because you have to enter the new page numbers. Mhhutchins 22:05, 13 March 2012 (UTC)

I was waiting for you to add the three collections to the omnibus first. Ofearna 22:41, 13 March 2012 (UTC)

Message in the Note to Moderator field

You submitted an update for this record, but there was no change, only a message in the Note to Moderator field ("No price *anywhere* on my book.") which probably should have gone in the Note field. Was that your intention? Mhhutchins 01:54, 14 March 2012 (UTC)

was trying to solve issue of the "no price for___" popping up. Ofearna 05:03, 14 March 2012 (UTC)
That's a system warning message and the only way to get around it is to add a price to the field. If the book's not priced, you can record that to the Note field (not the Note to Moderator field), but the message will remain until someone finds a secondary source for the price. Mhhutchins 06:27, 14 March 2012 (UTC)

"Held Safe By Moonlight and Vines"

You want to add a source to the note field of this record which contradicts the note that's already there. The source you want to add was in error. Because there's a record for the original publication of the title, I don't see the need to have a source actually noted in the title record. What do you think? Mhhutchins 01:56, 14 March 2012 (UTC)

Not sure. both books exist? All I know is the copyright notes in the Newford differ and Charles de Lint's webpage says Castle Perilous and my copy of Castle Fantastic does NOT have this story. Ofearna 05:04, 14 March 2012 (UTC)
Strange. Most sources give it as the last story in this edition of Castle Fantastic. Maybe you have a different edition that omits the story. Castle Perilous is a novel by DeChancie so de Lint's story would not have been published in it. The listing on de Lint's website is in error. The ISBN is for Castle Fantastic, not Castle Perilous as stated. Mhhutchins 06:32, 14 March 2012 (UTC)

Publication series vs. title series

In one of the messages you deleted (posted on March 8) I stated:

I've removed the data you added in the publication series field, because this appears to be a title series, not a publication series. Please read this help page to learn the difference between a publication series and a title series. You can not add a title series at the time of creating a new publication. It can only be done after the submission has been accepted and a title record has been automatically created by the system.

I've rejected the submission to place this pub into a publication series titled "Saga of the Skolian Empire". There's no such publication series. It's a title series and is properly added to the title record for this novel. Mhhutchins 06:23, 14 March 2012 (UTC)

Under My Skin

I'm going to accept the submission adding a new record for de Lint's novel, but will have to make the following changes:

  • Change the price from "CDN$ 15.16" to "C$21.00". We record the list price, and if it's Canadian dollars it's entered as "C$XX.XX". Also don't leave a space after the currency symbol.
  • Changed the ISBN from "0670065331" to "978-0670065332". All books published after 2007 should have the ISBN-13. If you're getting data from a secondary source, you should use the ISBN-13 for any post-2007 books.
  • Remove the note "not avail in US yet... all info from (I've ordered book to verify/read)" and change it to "Info from Not available in the US as of 2012-03-14" Notes should be as impersonal as possible.
  • Changed the URL of the link to the cover image on Amazon. See the instructions here about how to enter URLs from Amazon to remove any Amazon-implemented features which alter the image file.

Here's a link to the new record. Thanks. Mhhutchins 01:44, 15 March 2012 (UTC)

Went to make these changes and you've already done so. I did add the series (not pub series ^_^ )

Replacing an image vs. replacing a link

When there's already an image on the ISFDB server, and you have a better image, it's better to replace it, rather than change the link to an off-site server. That's why I rejected the submission to replace the image linked to this record. If you believe yours is a better image, then use the "Upload new cover scan" link and follow the directions. Keep in mind: we ask that you not upload images larger than 150kb and with the longest length of 600 pixels. This protects us against charges of violating copyright laws. Mhhutchins 21:59, 15 March 2012 (UTC)

Every time I've tried uploading an image to the isfdb server I get a broken image link. So, I threw the two I wanted to add to my website and linked 'em. Ofearna 18:34, 16 March 2012 (UTC)
You may be uploading files which are above the limits that we request. That doesn't mean you can't upload them, you just have to adjust your preferences so that you can view them. Do you know how to get to your wiki preferences page? If so, click on the "Files" tab and change you limits to the greatest choice. (We still prefer that you stay within the limits.) If this isn't the problem, I can step you through the instructions. They're pretty simple. Mhhutchins 19:17, 16 March 2012 (UTC)
OK, so I'll try resizing and reuploading those 2 images. You'll see them by tonight hopefully. Ofearna 20:40, 16 March 2012 (UTC)


Does your copy of this book not have the Alice Hoffman blurb on the front cover? Mhhutchins 02:01, 17 March 2012 (UTC)

No, but mine is the ARC, so...Ofearna 16:13, 19 March 2012 (UTC)
I'll reject the submission. This will avoid another editor creating a whole new record because the covers don't match. Thanks. Mhhutchins 17:48, 19 March 2012 (UTC)

Medicine Road Cover Image

I have placed your edit to this publication on hold. The proposed new cover image [1] is producing a "404 - Not Found" error. If you entered the wrong link, please cancel the edit and create a new one with the correct link. If there is an error on your server that needs to be fixed, please resolve & respond here and I will then approved the edit. Thanks. -- JLaTondre (talk) 15:47, 17 March 2012 (UTC)

I tested the image then and just now works Ofearna 16:13, 19 March 2012 (UTC)
The URL of the submission was malformed. Instead of a slash between "delint" and "MedicineRoad" there's a period. Mhhutchins 17:52, 19 March 2012 (UTC)
so, do I re-add it or will you? 'Cause I can't change it once it's submitted. Ofearna 18:41, 19 March 2012 (UTC)
I've rejected it. Go ahead and resubmit with the correct link. For future reference, you can self-reject by going to the "My Pending Edits" screen in the first section of links on the left hand side of the ISFDB site. -- JLaTondre (talk) 20:38, 19 March 2012 (UTC)

Die vergesene Musik?

Hello, you submitted an English variant title for 'The Little Country' by Charles de Lint as stated above. That suspiciously looks more German (and a little weird to my German receptors). Do you have any source for it (I have placed your submission on hold). Stonecreek 09:38, 20 March 2012 (UTC)

I selected language:German! I see it on Charles de Lint's website and the
Someone was kind enough to accept the Title: Das Verborgene Volk as a variant of The Little Country, but I need to split ? it b/c it's a split-into-two as German release (my brother's from Germany and checked for me that Das Verborgene Volk is Part 1 and Die Vergesene Musik is part 2 with covers by ? and Michael Whelan. Ofearna 16:36, 20 March 2012 (UTC)
Yes, I approved of the first part and will release and approve your held submission. Thanks for entering the two. According to the help pages it'd be sufficient to give information about the two parts in the title or publication notes. Which would you prefer and would you add them? Also, there are slight corrections in the titles to be made. It'd be Das verborgene Volk and Die vergessene Musik (strangely, adjectives are small in German, even when they are part of a headline), see here. Stonecreek 17:49, 20 March 2012 (UTC)
I approved your submissions but I'll have to change some of your input:
1) The titles and the publications must have the same name, and that's not the case, for example, with 'Die Vergesene Musik -- The Little Country part 2' and 'Die vergessene Musik -- Das Kleine Land Zweiter Roman'.
2) The title is 'Die vergessene Musik' only, the splitting will be put into the notes, as I wrote.
3) The publisher is denominated only as 'Heyne' - a la convention of ISFDB, so we wouldn't have to search different publishers for a given publication.
Also, I will add the publications to the pub. series 'Heyne Science Fiction & Fantasy'. Thanks, Stonecreek 09:41, 21 March 2012 (UTC)

Image size limits

According to the help page for uploading images to the ISFDB server: "Please be sure that the image is no larger than required, and in any case is less than 600 pixels along its largest dimension, if at all possible. You may wish to crop or rescale the image." We make few exceptions, and most of those are for wraparound cover art. Thanks. Mhhutchins 22:22, 20 March 2012 (UTC)

Magazine page counts

I accepted the submission updating this record, but the page count must be wrong. Because we include covers when counting pages in magazines, the page count of a saddle-stapled publication like Realms of Fantasy must be a multiple of 4. Also, you'll notice that sytem was unable to link the review for Never Knew Another by J. M. McDermott to its title record because the author's name was incorrectly entered (no space between the initials). You'll have to correct the record and then manually link it to this title record. The same thing happened when you added the reviews in this issue of Realms of Fantasy. N. K. Jemisin's name was incorrectly entered. The review of Lips Touched wasn't matched because you gave two spaces after the colon. It will have to be manually linked. Mhhutchins 06:55, 21 March 2012 (UTC)

Dadgumit. I swear you said NO space, but I just chedked... space. OOps.Ofearna 07:12, 21 March 2012 (UTC)

Sourcing data

Is the data for the submission adding a record for The Prisoner of Nimm by Tessa E. Colby from the primary source (the actual book)? If not, you should note the source for your data in the note field. I'll accept the submission and you can either add the source or do a primary verification. Thank you. Mhhutchins 06:58, 21 March 2012 (UTC)

Still waiting for you to source or primary verify this record. I removed the link you added to the title record for the Amazon listing. The webpage field in a title record is to link to a webpage that is specifically related to this title, not to a retailer who is selling a copy of the book. Mhhutchins 16:40, 21 March 2012 (UTC)

Modifying verified records

Hi. When you edit a record that has a primary verifier, ISFDB practice is to notify the verifier of any changes made by leaving a note on the verifier's talk page (or following any instructions posted there). If you are adding information (cover image, filling in a field, adding more notes), it is ok to submit the changes and notify the verifier after the fact. If you are changing information, you should ask the verifier first and not make any changes until the verifier agrees (if a verifier is inactive, then we fall back on making the change and leaving a notification). Even something as innocuous as a cover image has led us to discover different printings. I left a note for Cayer1886 about the cover addition to The Riddle of the Wren, so this is just something for you to keep in mind for future edits. Thanks. --MartyD 10:27, 21 March 2012 (UTC)

And I pointed this out to you several weeks ago here. Mhhutchins 16:43, 21 March 2012 (UTC)
I was waiting for the image to be approved before letting the verify-er know I'd added a cover. Ofearna 19:18, 21 March 2012 (UTC)

Changes to Pulphouse: A Weekly Magazine, July 6, 1991

I'm going to reject the submission to update this record, and not because you didn't notify the editor who was the primary verifier of the record (me). Almost every change you've made to the record is wrong.

  • You want to change the name of the Williamson piece from "Brainpulp (Pulphouse, July 6, 1991)" to just "Brainpulp". Because this is the name of a column, we have to disambiguate the title so that no one comes along and merges all of them together into one record. Each essay is different, even though they have the same name, so we have to make their title records unique. (Look under the Essay category on the summary page for J. N. Williamson, and you'll see there are several records for this title, each unique.)
  • You want to change the author credit of every piece in the magazine that has an author that uses initials: J. N. Williamson, A. R. Morlan, S. P. Somtow. Again, we always leave a space between initials. Changing J. N. Williamson to "J.N. Williamson" creates a new author and the record would appear on this new author's database page and not with all of the records by the author.
  • You want to add two new review records for mystery novels. Look again: they're already in the pub record as essays. I chose to enter them as ESSAY type records instead of REVIEW type records, to avoid having unlinked titles in the pub record. Otherwise, I would have had to create title records for non-genre works, which pollutes the database (and is against the rules for inclusion).

Even if these changes were correct, you should have notified the verifier before making a submission to make the corrections. Thank you for finding the error in the issue number, which I will correct in the record. I'll reject the submission. Mhhutchins 17:00, 21 March 2012 (UTC)


We don't create records using the REVIEW type for non-book and selected non-genre items. Reviews of films, recordings, graphic novels, comic books & strips, television, etc. are entered using the ESSAY type. Please see how I handled the review of the Zippy comic strip collection on page 30 in this record. Mhhutchins 20:25, 21 March 2012 (UTC)

Recording sources

If Amazon is your source, enter "Data from" in the Note field, not in the Note to Moderator field. Do not add a link to Amazon's webpage listing of the publication. Any entry into the Note field is a visible part of the record. Notes to the moderator are not part of the record. Mhhutchins 20:50, 21 March 2012 (UTC)

I saw the ad, checked Amazon and Worldcat THEN added it. Note upcoming. Ofearna 20:53, 21 March 2012 (UTC)
Recording your sources into the note field before you submit really helps the moderator. Thanks. Mhhutchins 21:41, 21 March 2012 (UTC)

Interior art record for "The Wild Wood"

I'm holding a submission to create a variant record for this one, but there's no difference between the two. What was your intention? And nowhere in my copy of this issue is Charles de Lint credited as a co-artist of any of the work credited to Froud. Mhhutchins 21:59, 21 March 2012 (UTC)

Goody, you answered. The cover art to The Wild Wood was interior art in RoF 1.1 -- do I link them? I've seem some that do and some that don't. Ofearna 22:01, 21 March 2012 (UTC)
Find the parent record. Copy it's record number (all the numbers after "cgi?" in the URL). Go back to the record that reprints it and choose "Make This Title a Variant Title or Pseudonymous Work". Paste the number you just copied into the Parent # field on the next page. But first remove the credit for de Lint. (And it's best that you not make fake submissions just to get the attention of the moderator. If you have questions please ask on one of the pages of the Community portal.) Mhhutchins 22:12, 21 March 2012 (UTC)
I waited for you to OK the rest of the changes I saw from my copy... I was hoping I'd done it right, not making a fake submission to get your attention.Ofearna 05:33, 22 March 2012 (UTC)
Sorry for calling it a "fake submission", but I could find no better choice of words to describe a submission which makes no change to a record. Maybe an "unnecessary submission"? Mhhutchins 06:12, 22 March 2012 (UTC)

Realms of Fantasy #1

I see you've made a primary verification of this record. Before you continue with updating other issues of this title, please wait until I've verified the record against my copy. From a cursory glance through the issue in comparing it with the record, I see a couple of things that need to be corrected and some missing items. Once I've made my update, I'll let you know so that you can use it as a template to update other issues. Thanks. Mhhutchins 22:16, 21 March 2012 (UTC)

I've made the following changes to your verified record:

  • Added the volume numbering in the note field.
  • Changed the title of the editorial and then placed it into the series "Editorial (Realms of Fantasy)".
  • Changed the author of the letter column to "various".
  • Added a record for the books column. (breaking the pattern of using the headline as the title).
  • Added a record for "Books to Look For".
  • Changed the name of the movie column and then placed it into the series "Movies (Realms of Fantasy)".
  • Changed the name of the folkroots column and then placed it into the series "Folkroots".
  • Changed the page number of the artwork of "Pest Control" to 37.
  • Changed the page number of the artwork of "The Redemption of Silky Bill" to 53.
  • Changed the title of Neil Gaiman's story from "Troll-Bridge" to "Troll Bridge". This entailed adding a new record, removing the old one, and then creating a variant title record.
  • Changed the title of Lippincott's artwork to "Troll Bridge" and page number to 61.
  • Added a single interiorart record for Brian Froud (some editors may create records for each work, you have the option if the pieces are titled.) Then I placed it into the series "Gallery (Realms of Fantasy)".
  • Removed the credit for Charles de Lint
  • Added a record for the Games column and placed it into the series "Games (Realms of Fantasy)".
  • Added a record for the Contributors column, but did not create a series for it.

Mhhutchins 20:59, 22 March 2012 (UTC)

Thunder's Shadow Collector's

Thanks for your submission. There seem to be a few misspellings, woud you be so kind as to take a second look?

And it's essential to change the pub. date from 0000-00-00 to 1995-08-00: we take the cover date of magazines as pub. date, regardless of an eventual slip in the publishing schedule; please read the help pages. Stonecreek 19:48, 22 March 2012 (UTC)

Cool. And I'll add a cover soon (I have to leave town for a funeral). Ofearna 20:26, 22 March 2012 (UTC)
Hmmm, the only misspelling I saw was Fisherman JOe (Joe) oop and illustraion (no t)x2Ofearna 20:32, 22 March 2012 (UTC)
Please remove any description (such as "illustration" or "strip") from the titles of the interior art records in this publication. Thanks. Mhhutchins 21:08, 22 March 2012 (UTC)
You can do this by updating the pub record in one submission, not each title record. Mhhutchins 21:10, 22 March 2012 (UTC)
I included the "illustration"/"strip" b/c they were in the credit/copyright notice. Ofearna 22:04, 22 March 2012 (UTC)
We never use copyright notice to determine how to title any record, including a interiorart record. We title it to match the work which it illustrates. Mhhutchins 22:55, 22 March 2012 (UTC)
Cleaned them up. I guess when you've approved these last changes I can verify it.Ofearna 23:01, 22 March 2012 (UTC)

[unindent] Another question: is the Lansdale piece a serialization of the novel (is it published in its entirety in several issues of this magazine)? According to Locus, this is an excerpt from the novel. Thanks for checking. Mhhutchins 02:23, 23 March 2012 (UTC)

What to include when adding contents to a pub record

Please look over this list when you get a chance. Copyright notices should not be included in the record (as in this pub), if it's simply a list of first appearances without any further substantial data. Mhhutchins 21:15, 22 March 2012 (UTC)

How to enter an SFBC printing

The help page is here. I'm going to move the ISBN of the trade edition into the note field of this record. Is there a number on the back cover, usually at the bottom in a white box? Mhhutchins 02:26, 23 March 2012 (UTC)

Also, please add the roman-numeraled pages to the page count field in the format "xx+560". Thanks. Mhhutchins 02:27, 23 March 2012 (UTC)

I also returned the source for the price in the note field. Mhhutchins 02:28, 23 March 2012 (UTC)

According to the OCLC record, the page count of the trade edition is "xiii+539". Does your SFBC printing have the same page count? Mhhutchins 02:31, 23 March 2012 (UTC)


Shouldn't Rodney Matthews be considered the "author" of the book instead of Julie Davis? You've not credited him except for the cover art. Usually, a collection of an artist's work is credited solely to the author. If an editor writes substantial text to accompany the art, he/she is also credited. I'm assuming that Julie Davis is the editor/compiler of the book. Is there text accompanying the artwork? The ISFDB editor who created the record for the companion book by Tim White credited him only. Mhhutchins 05:03, 25 March 2012 (UTC)

Sorry, I just saw that you verified the Tim White book. I'll accept the submission for RM and ask that you make the necessary changes to give Matthews credit. Thanks. Mhhutchins 05:05, 25 March 2012 (UTC)
It's asking for editor, that's Julie Davis. Dunno why, but when I "updated" TW, it changed editor to author (I think), but I can easily change it -- and use the artist as editor/author for JB/Jim Burns and BV/Boris Vallejo. Thanks!Ofearna 07:09, 25 March 2012 (UTC)
"Editor" and "Author" share the same slot in the database. It's quite possible some of the screens use "Author" as the label when they should be using "Editor". You likely are not imagining things. --MartyD 11:00, 25 March 2012 (UTC)

I made this change to the BP and PW submissions to try to save you some edit cycles. I do have question about these pubs: do they really have ISBN 13s? A couple came through with bad checksums, having 978 tacked onto an ISBN 10; for those I removed the 978. But I see several of them have been given legitimate ISBN 13s, yet all are from 1994. --MartyD 11:25, 25 March 2012 (UTC)

Yes, the really do have 13-digits (and 10...)Ofearna 17:05, 26 March 2012 (UTC)
There was no ISBN-13 in 1994. The numbers given in the record should be exactly what is recorded in the book itself. Let the system assign the corresponding ISBN. Mhhutchins 14:14, 25 March 2012 (UTC)
The book RM is showing up under the list of books Rodney Matthews did cover art for, but not under the list of non-fiction books by Rodney Matthews. HUH?Ofearna 17:18, 26 March 2012 (UTC)

Riding Shotgun

Hi. You've used a binding of "cb" on your proposed Riding Shotgun submission. That's not one of our standard bindings (see Help:Screen:EditPub#Pub_Format_.28Binding.29), and I can't quite guess if it should be "hc" or something else. Also, a couple of other notes about this submission: Don't use "none" for an ISBN/Catalog #, just leave the field blank if there is none. And on Amazon images, trim the "._SS500_" out of the name -- that part causes a white square background that usually protrudes from the image's borders. See this w/._SS500_ vs. this without. I will take care of these, so just something to keep in mind for future submissions. Let me know about the binding -- I have the submission on hold. Thanks. --MartyD 11:14, 25 March 2012 (UTC)

It's a chapbook. Ofearna 17:04, 26 March 2012 (UTC)
For those, we use a CHAPTERBOOK publication type (see Help:Screen:EditPub#PubType) and in the "Pub Format" field we record the binding (see Help:Screen:EditPub#Pub_Format_.28Binding.29). The only gotcha here is that we normally use CHAPTERBOOK for publications containing a single work (plus introductions, interiorart, etc.), while this one has two. The help recommends recording it as a COLLECTION with a binding of "pamphlet", but I think that depends on the actual binding -- what is yours? I've asked the other moderators for an opinion about having it be a CHAPTERBOOK with two works in it. --MartyD 01:08, 27 March 2012 (UTC)

In this message, I gave you a link to the instructions on how to manipulate the URL of images on Amazon. Mhhutchins 14:17, 25 March 2012 (UTC)

as soon as the record is created, I'll scan the cover, resize it and upload the image... when I try to get the P/image it doesn't bring up anything. Ofearna 22:03, 26 March 2012 (UTC)
If you're going to upload the cover image after the submission is accepted, then there's no need to link your original submission to Amazon's image. Mhhutchins 02:17, 27 March 2012 (UTC)
I believe the confusion here is that the ISFDB definition of CHAPTERBOOK, and the publishing industry's definition of chapbook are not the same, but they're also not entirely opposed either. The ISFDB CHAPTERBOOK type is all about the contents, and, unlike chapbooks, has nothing to do with the binding, manufacturing, or printing format. A chapbook can contain several works, either fiction or nonfiction. A CHAPTERBOOK can contain only one work of fiction, and can be hard- or softcover, or a pamphlet, whether sewn, glued or stapled. Binding is not a factor when selecting this type for a ISFDB record. You were correct to use the COLLECTION type for this publication, regardless of its binding. So, once the submission has been accepted, you should change the binding/format field to one of the standard entries. Mhhutchins 02:13, 27 March 2012 (UTC)
I accepted the submission and made the adjustments I noted above. I removed the "cb" format. You can fill it in with whatever is appropriate. I left the type COLLECTION, as you entered it. --MartyD 02:16, 27 March 2012 (UTC)
Another moderator suggested this example as a pattern to follow. --MartyD 10:13, 27 March 2012 (UTC)

Notifying primary verifiers of changes to records

Please notify the primary verifier of this record that you have added a cover image. I will hold any future submissions to update a primary-verified record until the editor has been notified. Thanks. Mhhutchins 21:13, 26 March 2012 (UTC)

DoneOfearna 21:20, 26 March 2012 (UTC)

Size limitations on uploaded images

This image exceeds the requested limit (600 pixels) for image file uploads. Mhhutchins 21:16, 26 March 2012 (UTC)

Resized it. Ofearna 21:23, 26 March 2012 (UTC)
Thanks. Mhhutchins 04:57, 27 March 2012 (UTC)

Varianting records

A record can be a variant of only one other record. You should choose which one is considered the "parent" record, and variant all other records to that one record. In the case of this record (1412793), you first varianted it to this record (1375574), and on a subsequent submission you varianted it to this one (400931), which negated the first submission. Since 400931 is the first known use of the image, we keep that as the parent record. You'll need to make 1375574 of it as well. Mhhutchins 04:57, 27 March 2012 (UTC)

So, I need to make 400931 a variant of 1375574 since they have the same cover? Ofearna 06:25, 27 March 2012 (UTC)
No, you need to make 1375574 a variant of 400931, as I stated above. Mhhutchins 06:56, 27 March 2012 (UTC)


According to the OCLC record, this book is unpaginated with an estimated 42 pages. If this is true, the page count field would be given as "[42]", where brackets indicate a physical count of an unpaginated book. Can you recheck to this which figure is correct? Thanks. Mhhutchins 05:00, 27 March 2012 (UTC)

I checked the OCLC records of a few of the other Paper Tiger Miniatures and they were also given as "[42]". Mhhutchins 05:02, 27 March 2012 (UTC)

All the minis are the same at 46 pages, no page numbers. Ofearna 06:29, 27 March 2012 (UTC)
You have the option of counting the pages in books with no page numbers (unpaginated), but do not count the covers nor the endpapers (if it's a hardcover book). And the number should be placed into squared brackets as [XX], and there should be a note that the book is "unpaginated". Mhhutchins 06:58, 27 March 2012 (UTC)

Art varianting

Sorry, but I had to reject some of your art varianting. As a rule of thumb it's not a good idea to have the variant title letting have an earlier date than that of the supposed original. Another case was the submission of an English titled art by Burns into a variant of a French cover. I suppose that there's a reason why the piece of art had the English title: maybe it was an earlier cover of an English language publication we don't have in the database. Are there any notes in the publication towards the origin of the interior art? Stonecreek 11:27, 27 March 2012 (UTC)

In addition, I have put your submission for this pub on hold. According to the above discussion I'd say that it is also unpaginated, so your submission should reflect this. Stonecreek 12:06, 27 March 2012 (UTC)
And for this also. Please place a note for the primary verifier first. Stonecreek 15:15, 27 March 2012 (UTC)
I already did. Ofearna 17:01, 27 March 2012 (UTC)
Well you did and you didn't. I have only found it because I searched for it after you told me that you notified him. Bluesman clearly states on his talk page that if you 'added a COVER IMAGE or NOTES' you may edit the special list designed for this purposes. But you added the cover artist, an essential part of the metadata. And because it is of special interest for every primary verifier it should have been put directly on his talk page. You'd surely also like to be informed on the artist of a cover you verified. Stonecreek 17:54, 27 March 2012 (UTC)
Would you also be so kind as to change the page counting to [] for this pub. Stonecreek 17:55, 27 March 2012 (UTC)

The Futurological Congress

I've put your submission for cloning this pub on hold. This looks to me as being possible the same as one we already have in the database, the one by Orbit. Could you please look for an ISBN inside or on the publication? (By 1977 there must be one). Thanks, Stonecreek 12:15, 27 March 2012 (UTC)

all I have is the cover, but it *definately* says Futura and the cover art is Jim Burns, where as the one that already exists is Orbit and there's no cover or cover art credit, although upon checking I can see that there's two Orbit/Future publishers? Ofearna 17:03, 27 March 2012 (UTC)
Sorry, but we don't add publications without a reliable source, and just a 'ghost' cover isn't enough - because we need the ISBN to assign it to a given publication. Otherwise we'd end up with multiple publications that are in fact one and the same. The existence of publisher Futura / Orbit is enough reason to suspect a possibility of being the same publication of Lem's novel. Stonecreek 17:37, 27 March 2012 (UTC)

Nomads of Gor

The ISBN you gave for this record is an invalid number. A 1976 publication would only have 10 numbers for an ISBN. In this case it's probably 0-345-25182-2. We have a record in the db for the same date and price of this record with ISBN 0-345-25184-9 given as the 7th printing. It's not likely these two would have the same month of publication. Mhhutchins 18:35, 27 March 2012 (UTC)

It appears that the second record I'm speaking of above is for a different title in the series (Raiders of Gor) and must have been entered incorrectly. I'll make the correction. Mhhutchins 18:37, 27 March 2012 (UTC)

I changed it to the 10-digit and added the cover... Ofearna 18:39, 27 March 2012 (UTC)
The page count is also incorrect, according to the source you give and the other Ballantine printings. I'll correct it to 344. Mhhutchins 18:42, 27 March 2012 (UTC)

When not to use "Add New Novel"

A good rule of thumb: don't use any of the "Add New..." functions before you do a search for the title. Here's the path I recommend:

  • Is there a title record for the exact title and is it by the same author?
    • Yes: Is there a similar pub?
      • Yes: Use the "Clone" function.
      • No: Use the "Add Publication to This Title" function.
    • No: Use the appropriate "Add New..." function.

You'll have to merge the three title records for Nomads of Gor. Mhhutchins 18:48, 27 March 2012 (UTC)

You created another title record. It will now have to be merged with the one you just merged. Mhhutchins 19:05, 27 March 2012 (UTC)


A 1974 publication can not have an ISBN-13. Please enter the ISBN as stated in the pub. If a secondary source gives you an ISBN-13 for a pre-2005 publication, it's wrong. Please make the necessary changes to the ISBN field of this record. Mhhutchins 19:45, 27 March 2012 (UTC)

And this record. Mhhutchins 19:46, 27 March 2012 (UTC)

The ISBN on this record is invalid. It should be 0426144880, according to your source. You can't make an ISBN-13 into an ISBN-10 by removing the first three numbers. Mhhutchins 19:52, 27 March 2012 (UTC)

Update to title record for RM

I'm not sure what is meant by "un-numbered" in the note you added to this record. If you mean "unpaginated", that should go in the publication record, not the title record. Any publication-specific data (such as the binding, the size, copy limitations, etc.) should be entered into the note field of the publication record, and any title-specific data (such as the editor, title series, etc) should be entered into the note field of the title record. Mhhutchins 05:07, 28 March 2012 (UTC)

Saraband of Lost Time

Please read the note that's at the top of my talk page and explain why you made a submission to change one of my verified records. That note states If you're writing to inform me that you've made changes in any other field of the verified record, whether it is a pub you've verified or not, please post a message on this page. The other page is just for notifying me of added images or notes only. You left a message on my talk page yesterday, but didn't respond to my request for a source attributing Jim Burns as the artist. Another editor left a link to an image that shows Burns' signature on the artwork, but the book as published cut off that part of the artwork. If you had simply updated the record and at least given the source for your data, I would have understood. So in the future, please do not use this page to tell me you wish to change the data in one of my verified records. That should be done by leaving a message on my talk page, before you make the submission, and you should not make the submission until after the discussion is over. I will accept the submission and make the necessary changes in the record to give a source for the cover credit and to note the absence of a credit or visible signature on the book itself. Mhhutchins 05:28, 28 March 2012 (UTC)

Sorry... that image has been in 2 of Jim's art books, so I knew it was by him. Ofearna 17:17, 28 March 2012 (UTC)
Then all you had to do was tell me the source of your data. That's all I asked. Communication is the most important tool when working on the ISFDB. Without it we may as well be building individual databases for our own use. Mhhutchins 17:34, 28 March 2012 (UTC)

Visit My Alien Worlds

I changed this record to a CHAPTERBOOK type, added a content record for the story and another for the interior artwork, and then linked the Amazon image to it. If there is no price printed on the book, record that fact in the note field. Mhhutchins 18:16, 28 March 2012 (UTC)

haha! I found the dustjacket so added the price. Can you tell me the logic in calling this a Chapterbook? Ofearna 02:42, 29 March 2012 (UTC)
Logic? On the ISFDB? You've got to be kidding! It's obviously not a NOVEL, not a 32-page book with more artwork than text. The ISFDB definition of a NOVEL is a work of fiction with more than 40,000 words. A CHAPTERBOOK is the publication of a single work of fiction with less than 40,000 words. Here's what the help page tells us. If the text is not fiction, as I suspected it was based on your original submission of it as a novel, you can change the type from CHAPTERBOOK to NONFICTION, and the SHORTFICTION content record to ESSAY. If you feel this needs further discussion, you can start a topic on the Rules and Standards page. Mhhutchins 03:08, 29 March 2012 (UTC)
I corrected the price you gave for the record. We only record the currency symbol and the price number in the price field. Mhhutchins 03:21, 29 March 2012 (UTC)
Still not entirely certain what FPT *means*, despite looking up what the letters stand for -- I hope it's $us ^_^. BTW "Have you ever wanted to travel to an alien world? Now you can, at least between the pages of this book--a "Travel Guide" to an imaginary alien destination. Visit floating cities, see dragons, or take the two-day guided tour of the Imperial Palace in Grandome! These attractions of the Tri-Star Republic--and more--are all here, accompanied by the ingratiating tones of the Ambassador's child. Noted science fiction illustrator Donato Giancola's images take you off the planet for slightly tongue-in-cheek ride through spectacular imaginary worlds. Buckle on your zero-gravity suit and get ready for liftoff." -- basically it's a children's storybook to showcase some of Donato's artwork most of which is bookcovers.Ofearna 03:30, 29 March 2012 (UTC)

Your Planet Story interior art varianting

Hello, I modified the first three of your submissions and then put the last two on hold, because I'm not sure which of Burns' books is the source for your submissions. Is it JB in all of the cases?

Another matter is that it would have been better to notify me before submitting, since I am the sole verifier of an edition of Planet Story (the German one) and had the opportunity to enter the titles of the interior art. Stonecreek 13:47, 29 March 2012 (UTC)
JB, Lightship and Transluminal all three had these images named -- his references to the other illustrations are "Planet Story:##", so...

Ofearna 16:51, 29 March 2012 (UTC)

Mistaken variant?

Hi. I have on hold your submission that would make Donato's How Do You Pay For Things interiorart a variant of Macfarlane's Biological Peacefare short story. I suspect that's not what you intended. :-) Please cancel and resubmit. Thanks. --MartyD 11:05, 30 March 2012 (UTC)

You're right, it should be This Side of Judgement. cancelled and redoneOfearna 17:08, 30 March 2012 (UTC)

Image for The Widowmaker Reborn

Your proposed addition of a cover image URL for The Widowmaker Reborn is using "[49961]" as the URL, not a link to the cover image. I have it on hold for your reference, but please cancel and resubmit with whatever you meant to use there. Thanks. --MartyD 11:11, 30 March 2012 (UTC)

Was supposed to be the amazon link to the cover image... cancelled and redone.Ofearna 17:09, 30 March 2012 (UTC)

Two dashes or a single emdash

Are the characters used in the titles of several content records in this publication actually two dashes (--) or a single emdash (—)? If the latter, the character can be entered using the alt code 0151. (Hold down the ALT key while entering 0151 on the numeric keypad of the keyboard.) Thanks. Mhhutchins 19:53, 30 March 2012 (UTC)

Fixed them! Thanks. Ofearna 19:56, 30 March 2012 (UTC)
You could have fixed them all in one submission updating the pub record. Mhhutchins 20:01, 30 March 2012 (UTC)
for JB mini? Ofearna 20:08, 30 March 2012 (UTC)

The Man in the Maze

I'm assuming you have this book, but I went ahead and researched it just in case. It helps to let the moderator know that you're working from a copy in hand. That saves us from searching for secondary sources for the data. BTW, no 1982 book had an ISBN-13, so please record the number as given in the book. Thanks. Mhhutchins 05:24, 31 March 2012 (UTC)

I have the book, just not at hand or I'd have more info to complete. Ofearna 05:25, 31 March 2012 (UTC)
Just say "book in hand" in the Note to Moderator field when you're adding or updating a record. Where did you get an ISBN-13 for a book not at hand? Mhhutchins 05:31, 31 March 2012 (UTC)

Cover art credit for two editions of The Sunset Warrior

I've accepted the two submissions. Please give the source for the cover art credit in the records' note fields. Mhhutchins 05:28, 31 March 2012 (UTC)