User talk:Kpulliam/Archives08

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Dropping in... I love some of the new additions

Just dropping in... I am enjoying some of the new features like diffing publications a lot. Kevin 02:16, 28 July 2011 (UTC)

Glad to hear it! Hopefully some of the new improvements will persuade people to stay a little longer. ;-) BLongley 05:05, 28 July 2011 (UTC)

Tunnel in the Sky

Hi, I expanded the notes for Tunnel in the Sky (DelRey 1978) and replaced the Amazon scan with my own. --Dirk P Broer 13:07, 29 July 2011 (UTC)

Subterranean Magazine - Issue 8 - Unpublished magazine?

I saw "unpublished" at the top of the Subterranean Press publisher page, clicked, and it's this magazine. Unfortunately, there's no explanation in the notes on what the source is for this record which includes a price and table of contents. On 14 May 2009 you were somehow able to scan/upload a cover for this unpublished magazine and included the note "Subterranean Magazine - Issue 8 - Subterranean Press."

I updated the cover image record to include a {{CID1}} block. --Marc Kupper|talk 17:02, 28 August 2011 (UTC)

Marc - I've updated the record with a link to the Subterranean Press Catalog. Basically this issue has been sitting in pre-order status forever... (shrug). I assume someday it might get published... I also think it's valuable to document in case / when those stories ever show up elsewhere. Kevin 23:43, 29 August 2011 (UTC)

Dan Girard vs. Dian Girard

A question has arisen regarding the correct attribution for the author of "No Home-Like Place" in your verified copy of The Endless Frontier, specifically whether the author is listed as "Dan Girard" or "Dian Girard". Could you check on this please? Thanks, Chavey 03:27, 30 August 2011 (UTC)

Mhhutchin, as one of the other verifiers, has concluded that only one entry (in the first appearance of the story) was a typo, leading to the others being handled as if they were by "Dan" instead of "Dian", and has corrected the entry to "Dian". Thus you should probably not have to re-verify this. Chavey 03:42, 30 August 2011 (UTC)

I accepted a submission changing the name of this series from "Allen Allenson" to "The Citizen" based on this corroboration. There's only one title/pub in the series, and it's your verified Into the Hinterlands. --MartyD 10:46, 22 September 2011 (UTC)

Grantville Gazettes

A couple days ago, I came across a thread at the Baen's Bar forum that talks about the differences between deadtree and e-book versions, and the plans going forward on naming conventions. This made me decide to start verifying all my Grantville Gazette e-books, but I noticed you had some recent edits to some of them. I currently have issues #1 - #22, although I plan on buying the remaining issues in the next few months. Anyway, today I edited the record for the one GG I have as a paperback, the first Grantville Gazette. You had posted a message to Dcarson, the primary verifier, several years ago, which he never answered. So I wanted to let you know about my edit.

Before I start editing/verifying the e-book versions, is there anything I should know about prior conventions?

BTW, a quick summary of the thread at Baen's Bar:

  1. The original e-book versions of GG #'s 1-4 are no longer available, as they have been replaced with the contents of the printed version, which added an original story by Eric Flint to the e-book versions. However, I still have .doc versions of the originals from when I bought them years ago, if we want to have both old and new versions listed.
  2. The deadtree version of GG Volume V is a "best-of" from the e-book versions #'s 5 - 11.
  3. All future deadtree versions, including Volume VI which comes out in January, will also be "best-of".
  4. The naming conventions now are for the deadtree versions to use Roman Numerals, and the e-book versions to use Arabic numerals. As can be seen on the Webscription site, this naming convention has been retro-fitted onto the old e-books.

AndonSage 20:05, 3 October 2011 (UTC)

Have fun... working on the pile of 1632 stuff is an excellent project... I did a bunch when I was newer too. I recall that one key thing to watch for was the changing covers, and in particular the red head cover variant in the RTF edition of the very first ebook. (That's why there are 3 ebook versions of the first volume). I put those records in but didn't verify them as final (Maybe I was waiting on a response from DCarson?). I was also aware of the change from similar contents to totally different contents and that's why there is a '(2005 e-version only)' title difference. With the VIth edition coming out in January we should 'pre-prepare' the data in the database before new editors try to help. Kevin 21:05, 3 October 2011 (UTC)
Feel free to drop me a note and I will cruise through them once you are done massaging the records. Also, I'm the person who set up the '1632 Fiction' and '1632 Fact' and other assorted 1632 Series subdivisions. If you feel a need to redecorate, I won't be offended, but with the hundreds of items.. I recommend smaller divisions.. not larger, hehe. Also lastly, I think the gazette has gotten 8-10 months behind so there are a few editions totally absent from the database the last time I checked. As above.. Have fun, I'll be happy to provide input on any particular question (or even just .. It looks better this way' type comments), just ask. Kevin 21:05, 3 October 2011 (UTC)
Hehe, I see you noticed that I'm not a new moderator :) I'm just a guy who's been entering my book collection off and on for about a year. Anyway, except for the .doc files I have from 2005 (which I made from the RTF format files), and in which I didn't include any covers, I have the MOBI format versions for my Kindle. So if there are various covers, I wouldn't know. I'll let someone else with the other formats deal with those :)
I'm glad to hear you're aware of the new GG naming conventions. I wanted to make sure the moderators knew about it. I was thinking that the title records for V through XI should be renamed to use 5 - 11, but whatever you guys decide is fine with me.
I have no intention of modifying the current 1632 Series subdivisions. What is currently set up looks fine to me :) If I have any questions, I'll be sure to ask :) Thanks! AndonSage 21:56, 3 October 2011 (UTC)
We don't generally rename. If Eric (with Toni's permission) wants to RetCon the titles on the electronic editions, that's no problem for them.. for us it means we will need to make variant titles... so there will be 'new' entries.. but the old entries need to stay. As for the different covers.. the original covers are pretty well documented (in text) as being based on one or another piece of 1600's artwork. And the red head variant is available at Buckley's Fifth Imperium...Download and open the RTF.. and you can see the 'interim' red head edition of the cover art for the 1st print gazette. Kevin 22:04, 3 October 2011 (UTC)
Did you know the GG e-books are available in Kindle versions now? Based on what I've seen so far, they'll need their own records, instead of being included as an available format in a general e-book record. According to the Amazon page for the ones I've looked at:

"This kindle edition of the Grantville Gazette is derived directly from the on-line edition at It is different than the editions provided by Baen and webscriptions, has somewhat different content and different formatting."

I noted the following differences just looking at GG Volume I:
  • The cover uses the picture from the original Webscription edition, but is formatted differently than that version, so it is a different cover than any others
  • "What is this? About the Grantville Gazette" by Grantville Gazette Staff is included after the "Editor's Preface."
  • An "Images" section is included at the end of the book.
Do you think a record should be set up for the Kindle versions now, even if they can't be verified, or should it wait for someone with the actual Kindle version to enter them?
In this instance since the Grantville Gazettes are being published through Amazon, Yes I believe they deserve their own new listing in the database. (Later if/when Baen gets their larger ebook catalog available through amazon that's a different story... for other titles.. but the gazettes are independently published these days, as compared to the print books). Kevin 04:21, 4 October 2011 (UTC)
I have a question about what should be included in the contents section. In the GG Volume 1 e-book, the "Baen's Bar" page (which you can see in the paperback book before the "Editor's Preface") has it's own ToC entry. So should it be included in the Contents section with its own line? And going forward, should anything listed in a ToC have its own Content line?
Also, I wanted to mention that the ToCs in the e-books don't have the authors listed along with the story names, so I didn't need to include any notes about the Robert Gottlief vs. Bob Gottlieb issue in #1.
In regards to renaming, above, please note that issues #12 through 21, which use Arabic Numerals on this site, originally used Roman Numerals (although #21 was a mixture, using XX1). So that means they weren't entered correctly here in the first place. That's why I didn't think it would hurt to rename the title records for the previous ones. The publication records could still have the Roman Numerals. AndonSage 06:44, 4 October 2011 (UTC)
It looks like we definitely need separate records for Kindle editions. Based on the "Look Inside" Table of Contents for #2 and #3, they still have "An Invisible War" split into two parts, instead of the entire story published in #2 in the deadtree and current Baen Webscription editions. AndonSage 07:28, 4 October 2011 (UTC)
I think DESiegel60 might have verified the wrong e-book edition for Grantville Gazette II, and I left a message on his talk page. But I don't think he's around anymore. If he's not around, do you think what I mentioned on his talk page is enough to remove him as primary verifier? I want to make changes, and I don't think they would normally be approved without the primary verifier's assent. AndonSage 08:15, 4 October 2011 (UTC)
You can probably get some help from Rick Boatright, our very own Rboatright. He has his email address on his author record in the database. I exchanged several emails with him in June. Among the information he sent me:
Third: Each issue of the Gazette is now being assigned an ISBN in addition to the ISSN so that we can list them on the Apple iBookstore. Is that someone you guys would like to have?
Fourth, Do you have a mechanism to distinguish Grantville Gazette V, which was Baen's hardcover "best of" anthology of the Electronic editions 5 through 11 and Grantville Gazette VI which is forthcoming hardcover anthology of best of 12 through 17... and so on going forward. We do it by distinguishing between the arabic and roman numerals.
I'm sure he could provide more information and more details. He never sent me the ISBNs or did anything with them that I recall. --MartyD 10:46, 4 October 2011 (UTC)

UNINDENT See User_talk:Kpulliam/Archives06#Grantville_Gazette_Prefaces_.28And_Afterwords.29 as I was making some changes after DES verified that.. and I might have messed up his verified copy and if he never caught it... I'm sure I expected him to move his verification.. but then (if you look at the next note) I got busy playing on the moderator side. Kevin 23:51, 4 October 2011 (UTC)

I'm pretty sure DESiegel60's verification for the republished edition was for the incorrect edition, because his verifications for subsequent e-books are for the original e-book editions. I plan to remove his primary verification and put myself there. Especially since he's not around any more, I should be the one to answer any questions for the title, with all my changes.
You didn't answer my question about what should be in the content sections. I guess I'll add a "Baen's Bar" content line, and describe what it is in the notes.
We've got another issue with the GG names, which I wanted you to be aware of... The print editions, and the republished I - IV e-books, do not use the word 'volume' in the title, but all of the other e-book version do include 'volume' in the title. "Grantville Gazette V" is the name of the deadtree edition, while "Grantville Gazette Volume V" is the name of the e-book edition. So all of the e-books currently in the database, except for I - IV, are incorrectly named. "Grantville Gazette V (2005 e-version only)" should actually be "Grantville Gazette Volume V" (Volume 5 in the new parlance at Baen's Webscription) and "Grantville Gazette V (2009 version)" should be simply "Grantville Gazette V." Since the official way of determining a title is to go by the title on the title page, which precedes the copyright page in a print book, I'm using the book title which immediately precedes the copyright information in an e-book as the official title. AndonSage 06:56, 5 October 2011 (UTC)
It's not that they are incorrectly named.... it's likely that they have the old name (I'm on my way out the door to work and can't look for my archives today). Which means you should generate 'new' editions without the 'Volume' and add that as a variant. Same for any contents differences (Such as the Baen's Bar which I'm pretty sure wasn't in the original gazette... since you had to virtually walk past the 'entrance' to the bar to get to the gazettes. Remember, the touchy thing about 'updating' anything based on an electronic record alone.... is that the electrons may have changed. Kevin 11:11, 5 October 2011 (UTC)
I have the original e-book files from 2006. Here are examples of four books, 5 through 8. The only thing I left out is appropriate '(over)s'.

after cover: Grantville Gazette Volume V by Eric Flint
before copyright: Grantville Gazette Volume 5 Edited by Eric Flint

after cover: Grantville Gazette Volume 6 by Eric Flint
before copyright: Grantville Gazette Volume Six

after cover: Grantville Gazette-Volume VII by Eric Flint
before copyright: Grantville Gazette: Volume VII Compiled by Eric Flint

after cover: Grantville Gazette-Volume VIII by Eric Flint
before copyright: Grantville Gazette: Volume Eight Eric Flint

As you can see, no matter which title you use, all of them use the world 'Volume'. I think DESiegel just didn't enter them here correctly. Also, notice how #6 doesn't ever use the Roman Numeral. AndonSage 01:07, 6 October 2011 (UTC)
In regards to the "Baen's Bar" entry in Grantville Gazette I, that's for the re-published e-book based on the paperback book, not the original e-book. The "Baen's Bar" page is in the e-book because it's in the paperback, but the difference is that in the paperback it's enclosed in a border, like a graphic. For the e-book, they had to use just the text, and hence it has its own entry in the ToC. AndonSage 01:37, 6 October 2011 (UTC)
I think I see now... I was flip flopping it around this morning.. (Pre Caffeine) and thought you wanted to change titles on I-IV. I've also since dug up my old *.prc versions from 2006 and I agree with you that the titles all deserve a 'volume' added. (FYI, I only have volumes up through VII.) Kevin 02:28, 6 October 2011 (UTC)
I'm thinking now that with the addition of the 'volume' title signifier, and with the print editions being a 'best of' selection... and having more than 1 example of that now... maybe we should divorce the "E-Editions" of the gazette (The Volumes) as true variants, or even totally separate titles. Thoughts? Kevin 02:28, 6 October 2011 (UTC)
Well, my preference would be to separate the books beginning with #5, like so: Grantville Gazette V is the "best of" (print and e-book) and Grantville Gazette Volume 5 is the original e-book version. I really think we should standardize the original e-books to use Arabic Numerals along with "Volume" since we're changing the titles anyway. Because the actual titles of the e-books did not previously have a standard before Baen decided on Arabic Numerals, they aren't consistent (e.g. Volume 5 uses "V" and "5", Volume 6 uses "6" and "Six", Volume 7 uses "VII" only and Volume 8 uses "VIII" and "Eight"). So if we don't standardize, they will all be different. And if we standardize, we might as well use what Baen picked :) Based on the titles in the first four e-books, I'd suggest we leave those the way they currently are. I'm good to edit up through #22 until I buy the later ones. I'll be getting 23 - 28 later this month, btw. The series is currently up to #37, and #38 comes out in November 2011.
BTW, I'll be leaving for a fishing trip on Lake Erie tomorrow (Thursday) evening, and coming back Friday evening. And then I was lucky enough to get into the "Star Wars: The Old Republic" beta test (woo hoo!) for this weekend, which lasts Friday evening through Monday night :) So I'll be working on here Thursday afternoon, but after that I won't be back here until Tuesday (Oct 11). Just wanted you to know why I won't be posting/editing for a few days. I've submitted up through #5 (best-of) so far, and will begin working on #5 (original e-book), on up through #22, for now. I wanted to wait on those versions until we'd hashed things out. Thanks for working on this with me :) AndonSage 06:08, 6 October 2011 (UTC)
As you might have noticed, I got side-tracked for several months. I still plan on getting all the Grantville Gazettes in order at some point, hopefully soon :) AndonSage 21:32, 16 March 2012 (UTC)

"To Hell with the Stars"

As one of the verifiers of this pub, could you please review this discussion? TIA! Ahasuerus 07:39, 24 October 2011 (UTC)


I've added the OCLC number for the hardcover edition of Bolo!. --Dirk P Broer 12:57, 15 December 2011 (UTC)

Berserker Fury

I'd like to add two items to the discussion of Berserker Fury: the LCCN and cover design by Carol Russo. Any objections or comments? Biomassbob 02:37, 10 February 2012 (UTC)

I went ahead with the changes. Go ahead and change back if you object; you don't need to let me know. I'd just like to save time for both of us. Biomassbob 18:46, 11 February 2012 (UTC)
Kevin seems to be on hiatus, so I accepted the changes. We usually hold submissions for "destructive" changes to verified pubs, i.e. those that remove or change data. If you're adding data, there's usually no problem with a moderator accepting it. We only ask that you notify the primary verifier, which you did in this case. Much appreciation. If you plan on making "destructive" changes, you should notify them before making a submission. If a verifier doesn't respond in a few days, you can bring it to the attention of the moderators on the Moderator Noticeboard. Thanks. Mhhutchins 19:45, 11 February 2012 (UTC)

"Better to Beg Forgiveness . . .", by Michael Z. Williamson

Editor AndonSage has proposed some updates to your verified publication, which I've gone ahead and approved (hopefully, these are "friendly amendments"). He's replaced a broken cover image link, changed the page count from "0" to "unpaginated" (the jury is still out on what standard we should use here; you can change it back if you feel strongly), and added several notes. You had a note that "The ISBN of this ebook is duplicated by Webscriptions from the original Baen hardcover edition", which I believe he has just augmented, along with his other note additions. Chavey 17:14, 20 March 2012 (UTC)

Science Fiction of the Thirties

Hello, Kevin. As one of the verifiers of this publication, can you see this discussion about a minor discrepency in the content field? (This might be resolved by the time you read this.) Thanks --John L.-- Syzygy 02:14, 29 March 2012 (UTC)

Aftermath - Charles Sheffield

I have substantially added notes to one of your earlier originating verifications of Aftermath by Sheffield. I didn't think it was a minor change, so I posted here. Your original notes are embedded, and I replaced the <P> new paragraph with <br> and bullet. --John L.-- Syzygy 23:08, 4 April 2012 (UTC)

"The Gateless Barrier", by Lucas Malet

In looking at books by Dodd, Mead and Company, there are a large number of ways to list the publisher's name. This book, verified by you, was the only book in which they were listed as "Dodd, Mead and Co.". The book includes a link to a full scan of the book at Google books, and there the title page lists the publisher as "Dodd, Mead & Company", one of the many other listings for this publisher. Assuming this is the way it's actually listed, I have corrected that publisher listing. (This reduces the number of different listings for this publisher from 5 to 4). Chavey 18:53, 7 April 2012 (UTC)

ISBN/Catalog # field for SFBC printings of trade editions

I've changed the ISBN/Catalog # field of this record back to the SFBC catalog number, even thought the ISBN of the trade edition is stated in the SFBC printing. This is ISFDB standard for entering SFBC editions. Thanks. Mhhutchins 16:22, 11 April 2012 (UTC)