User talk:Frederick Patten

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This editor is no longer actively participating and is unlikely to respond to messages left here.

If this user is the sole verifier of a publication record, please:

  • post only notices on the user's talk page concerning the addition of images and notes
  • post inquiries regarding any other changes to the verified record at the Moderator noticeboard

Otherwise, please post notices and inquiries only on the talk pages of the other primary verifiers.


Hello, Frederick Patten, and welcome to the ISFDB Wiki! I hope you like the place and decide to stay. Here are some pages that you might find helpful:

Note: Image uploading isn't entirely automated. You're uploading the files to the wiki which will then have to be linked to the database by editing the publication record.

Please be careful in editing publications that have been primary verified by other editors. See Help:How to verify data#Making changes to verified pubs. But if you have a copy of an unverified publication, verifying it can be quite helpful. See Help:How to verify data for detailed information.

I hope you enjoy editing here! Please sign your name on talk pages using four tildes (~~~~); this will insert your name and the date. If you need help, check out the community portal, or ask me on my talk page. Again, welcome! Marc Kupper (talk) 18:15, 19 May 2007 (CDT)

Best in Show: Fifteen Years of Outstanding Furry Fiction

Thank you for your addition of Best in Show: Fifteen Years of Outstanding Furry Fiction 191665. Please be aware that Amazon and a couple other sites are the only practical options for images. As it is, the image shows as "no picture" for me as the site you use does not permit third-party sites such as ISFDB to display images directly from their site. I left the image link on the publication so that you can see what it looks like. Marc Kupper (talk) 18:18, 19 May 2007 (CDT)

I see that I already have a page here at I have a Wikipedia entry that I would like to add to this. How do I do this? Fred PattenFrederick Patten 18:26, 19 May 2007 (CDT)

Can you use this cover image? [1] Frederick Patten 18:53, 19 May 2007 (CDT)

From your page, Frederick_Patten, click on "Author Data" on the left and there is a Wikipedia entry. Make sure you include the full address with the http://. Actually, as long as I'm right there Ill add it. I assume you are Is Fred_Patten on ISFDB also you? If so, which would you prefer to be your "canonical" name? At the moment there are more titles publications filed under Frederick but that may well be a result of Amazon errors. If most of your work was published using "Fred" that's probably a better choice.
That cover image for Best in Show should work but again Amazon is the better choice such as this one [2]. It has to do with copyright/permissions etc. ISFDB is allowed to use Amazon images and I have not heard that we can use sfsite's images. Marc Kupper (talk) 23:30, 19 May 2007 (CDT)

Common and Precious

I accepted the addition of Common and Precious at 191793 but did the following edits.

  • I changed the pub-format from "Trade paperback" to "tp"
  • I changed cover artist 1 from "Heather Bruton, cover artist" to "Heather Bruton"
  • I deleted cover artist 2 and instead in the Contents section added an INTERIORART enrty for Sara Palmer.
  • I believe "boon" was a typo and updated the publication note to say "book."

Marc Kupper (talk) 23:36, 19 May 2007 (CDT)

Little Fuzzy

I approved the title update for Little Fuzzy at 3045 but then edited it to remove the note "1962 Avon Books cover art by Victor Kalin." Rather than doing that you should be adding the cover artist directly to the publication which seems to be LTFZ1962. If the publication itself does not credit Victor Kalin then please add a comment to the notes section explaining your source for the cover artist. Marc Kupper (talk) 23:41, 19 May 2007 (CDT)

Thanks for whatever help you can give me in editing. I am still trying to figure out all the instructions.

The cover painting for Little Fully has Victor Kalin's signature in the lower left, under the land-prawn's tail. I will try to add the note that you advise. Frederick Patten 02:08, 20 May 2007 (CDT)

That's fine - I think you have something confused because you sent in two updates for title record 3045 where you added the following notes to the comments.
  • The cover art is signed "Victor Kalin" at the lower left, under the land-prawn's tail.
  • Little Fuzzy, (1962-01 , H. Beam Piper, Avon, #F118, $0.40, 160pp, pb)
The second note overwrote the first and if you look now at 3045 you will see that the "note" field literally has the comment you added. You wanted to do the edit to the publication record which is at LTFZ1962.
In summary
  • ISFDB has authors such as H._Beam_Piper
  • Each author has one or more titles divided into sections such as Novels, Collections, series of titles, etc. If you look at H._Beam_Piper you will see Little Fuzzy (1962) (it's in the Fuzzy series which is part of the Terro-Human series. If you click on Little Fuzzy you are taken to the title record.
  • Each title has one or more publications. We generally have one publication per printing of a book and in the case of Little Fuzzy ISFDB has eight publications on file. In this case the Avon 1962 edition is the first one listed meaning you could edit it to add the extra detail you had added to the title record such as the cover artist, the note about where you found the artist's name, and the extra details from Locus such as the binding, Catalog #, price, etc. I looked at the Avon editions on Amazon and none have a cover image meaning either you can leave it blank or if you are set up to scan/upload images to Amazon you can then you can do it that way. Marc Kupper (talk) 04:00, 20 May 2007 (CDT)

Black Iron: A Ironclaw Novel

You submitted this three times though from what I can see all three copies are identical. I accepted the first and it's available at BLCKRNRNCL2005 and rejected the second two. For the Pub format please use "tp" for trade paperback books. Ideally the ISFDB code would recognize "trade paperback" and change it into the two-character code but for now you need to enter the codes pb (paperback), tp (trade paperback), and hc (hardcover).

Is [3] the correct cover image? That looks like a frontispiece or interior art. Amazon has [4]. Marc Kupper (talk) 03:38, 20 May 2007 (CDT)

I have been using mostly Fred Patten as my byline since the 1980s. Yes, I am the same person as the Frederick Patten that you have entered, but Fred Patten is probably the better choice to consolidate under.

I am still having trouble figuring out how to add information to old entries. If you can correct me, please do so.

You are correct about Black Iron. I linked to one of the interior illustrations; has the cover image.Frederick Patten 11:35, 20 May 2007 (CDT)

re: Fred Patten vs Frederick Patten - Fred_Patten now shows your works for both names.
Think of the ISFDB title record as being about the story and the publication record as being about one of the physical appearances of that story. The publication may be an audio-book, paperback, magazine, etc. Information about the story itself is in the title record and the publication records contain information about each of the physical appearances of that story.
From a title your options for working with publications are:
  1. If the publication you want to work on already exists (ISBN and price match) then click on the link for that publication and then click "Edit This Pub" on the left.
  2. If the publication you want to work on is not listed but there is already one that's very similar, let say the the ISBN is the same but at a new price, then click on the link for the similar publication and then click "Clone This Pub" on the left. This will bring up an edit screen with all of the fields from the original publication filled in and you make the changes.
  3. If there are no publications listed (this is rare) or none exist that are remotely similar to the one you want to work on then click "Add Publication to This Title" on the left. This will bring up a blank publication record with the title, author, and Pub Type filled in. You would add the remaining data.
  4. If the story title and/or author does not exist in ISFDB then from ISFDB's home page you would use "New Novel" or whatever is appropriate. This brings up a blank publication record. ISFDB will automatically create title and author records as needed based on the data you entered for the publication.
  5. Finally - once you get a publication edited to the point where it matches your physical copy exactly then you can mark it as "verified" using "Verify This Pub" on the left.
Please feel free to go ahead with exploring and making corrections, asking questions, etc. Marc Kupper (talk) 15:45, 20 May 2007 (CDT)

ANTHROlogy One

I thought your use of a URL for the Catalog # was pretty creative. It almost worked but the end of the URL got cut off as that field is not very long. I edited the publication, NTHRLGNLRM2006, and added the URL/link to the notes.

We will need to fix up the book reviews as unfortunately you entered them using just 2005 or 2006 and not 2005-00-00 and 2006-00-00. They all were 2006 except for Nip and Tuck, vol. 1 (reviewer name is blank), Tales of the Questor, vol. 1, and The Tale of the Swamp Rat which were dated 2005.

Another fix up that's needed is that you used type EDITOR several times when it should be ESSAY. The EDITOR type should not even be on the edit screens and is an internal thing for magazines. Marc Kupper (talk) 01:27, 23 May 2007 (CDT)

Ssan Fromberg Schaeffer

Is this your typo or in the magazine? I presume its 'Susan' usually. BLongley 05:25, 3 Jun 2007 (CDT)

This is in DFSFRFEB1976 Delap's F & SF Review, February 1976 page 17. Marc Kupper (talk) 03:23, 5 Jun 2007 (CDT)

In your submission updating Delap's F & SF Review, June 1975, you added the "1974 Nebula Awards" piece as NONFICTION. Any shorter work (e.g., articles, introductions, afterwords, essays) within a larger work is considered an ESSAY. A larger work (e.g., The Science Fiction Encylopedia, More Issues at Hand, The Language of the Night) would be NONFICTION. I accepted you submission and changed that one piece. Thanks. Mhhutchins 18:26, 8 Jun 2007 (CDT)

Yes, that should be Susan Fromberg Schaeffer. The typo is mine, not in the magazine. Frederick Patten 19:59, 10 Jun 2007 (CDT)

Delap's F & SF Review, June 1975

In your submission updating Delap's F & SF Review, June 1975, you added the "1974 Nebula Awards" piece as NONFICTION. Any shorter work (e.g., articles, introductions, afterwords, essays) within a larger work is considered an ESSAY. A larger work (e.g., The Science Fiction Encylopedia, More Issues at Hand, The Language of the Night) would be NONFICTION. I accepted you submission and changed that one piece. Thanks. Mhhutchins 18:27, 8 Jun 2007 (CDT)

Ancient Solitary Reign

Hi, i've approved your submission [5] and added the map and illustrations separately. After approval you can then add maps, illustrations, forewords, excerpts etc. into contents(use the "Add Title") as a new submission, by using the "Edit this Publication" :-)Kraang 19:45, 13 Jun 2007 (CDT)


I approved adding the introduction to Best in Show: Fifteen Years of Outstanding Furry Fiction (191665) but then edited that to change the title "introduction" to Introduction (Best in Show: Fifteen Years of Outstanding Furry Fiction). The reason for this is otherwise an author's bibliography could have dozens of essays, all titled just "Introduction." We do the same thing where someone may have a running column in a magazine where the title entered into ISFDB would be "Column title (issue title)." For example, Fred_Patten has multiple editorials in DF&SFR. Marc Kupper (talk) 13:27, 18 Jun 2007 (CDT)

A Judgment of Dragons

Fred in your note you seem to suggest that this title is a collection and not a novel. If this is the case than it should be changed and the stories added as content. Thanks :-)Kraang 06:47, 10 Aug 2007 (CDT)


The link you gave in the Image URL field was to the webpage for Amazon's listing of the book. You should link to their image. I've fixed it and the image now loads into the ISFDB record. Thanks. Mhhutchins 17:37, 21 October 2011 (UTC)

Fangs of K'aath II

Hi. I accepted your Fangs of K'aath II submission and made a couple of small fix-ups (but please review -- I made some assumptions). For the price, we list only one in the price field, relegating others to the notes. It looked to me like the primary price might be $17.99, so I went with that, but maybe it should be the other way, with £11.99 being the primary price. Even though United Publications is British, it isn't clear to me. For the cover image, you put in several links, none of which was directly an image (they were all web pages). I fixed that up to use the image from, and I moved all of those URLs you provided to the notes (making them into clickable links). I assumed these were your sources, so I annotated them as such. Sorry if that's wrong. Thanks. --MartyD 11:08, 22 October 2011 (UTC)

Some corrections

We only need one ISBN entered, the software will derive the other (an ISBN-10 from an ISBN-13 or vice versa). Please only enter one image URL, on a site we have permission to link to - we can't handle multiple links and they do need to be of the image rather than the page the image is on. (Or you can upload an image yourself to our server if you have one.) We only record one price in the price field, any others can be recorded in notes. And finally, the "Publication Series" is for groupings of various titles by one publisher, like "Gollancz SF Masterworks" - not for Title series, were the books remain in order despite whoever publishes it. Thanks for contributing! BLongley 16:41, 23 October 2011 (UTC)

All submissions placed on hold

We are having the same issues with all of your submissions, so I've placed those that are currently in the submission queue on hold, pending your finding your talk page and responding to the messages being left by several moderators. You currently do not have a valid email address on record here (as a ISFDB user), but I'm going to attempt to contact you through the email address on your author data page. Thanks. Mhhutchins 04:41, 24 October 2011 (UTC)

All of your submissions have cleared the queue. Some of them were rejected due the number of errors and it was easier just to create a new record for the book you were entering. Most of those errors have been pointed out in the previous posts here. Keep in mind that the Image URL field is just for the URL of the image file, not to a webpage. You can add those URLs in the note field, and if you're familiar with HTML, you can link those URLs to the webpages. Mhhutchins 05:15, 29 October 2011 (UTC)

Franky Furbo

Can you confirm the price for the Holt hc edition of this title? $50.00 is exceedingly high for a hardcover edition from a trade publisher. Thanks. Mhhutchins 05:17, 29 October 2011 (UTC)

I saw the note to moderator that was part of a pub record update submission. Just in case another moderator handles that submission, they wouldn't know that you're responding to a message left on your user talk page. It's better to respond directly here. Just click the [edit] link to the message you're responding to, a window will open in which you can type your response, and then click the "save page" button. Sign the message with four tildes (~~~~)which will give your user name and the time/date of the message automatically. The moderator who left the note will then know that you've responded to their message.
One other thing: if you have the book that you're either creating a record for, or are updating the current record, you should do a primary verification of the record. (See the link in the Welcome section at the top of this page.) If not, you should note in the record's note field the source of your data. Thanks for your cooperation, and for continuing to contribute to the ISFDB.
Now, back to the original message: If you don't have the actual book, I'm going to blank out the price until we can find some corroborating source for that high price. I'll also remove the Amazon image link, if you say it's not the same image. We can't link to librarything's image file because we don't have permission to deep link to their images. Thanks. Mhhutchins 17:14, 30 October 2011 (UTC)
I had the hc, which was published by Henry Holt & Company and not Owl Books, in 1989 and verified the dust jacket price of $50.00 for a review that I wrote at the time. I donated the book to the University of California, Riverside Library in 2005 and no longer have it to reverify. My review, with the correct cover image, is reprinted at The University of California, Riverside Library also has the magazine with my original review, Yarf! issue 3, March 1990. For what it's worth, I give you my permission to deep link to the image on my review at . Fred 18:43, 30 October 2011 (UTC)
I've linked to your review and gave it as the source for the price. Owl Books is an imprint of Henry Holt & Company, which we give in the publisher field as "Owl Books / Henry Holt". (The publisher's name has been regularized to "Henry Holt" for ISFDB purposes.) This reference was taken from the OCLC record, and is confirmed by the LCCN record. Mhhutchins 20:22, 30 October 2011 (UTC)

Image URL field

You are incorrectly using the image URL field to record the addresses of webpages, which will not link in this field. This field is programmed to pull only single image files from a webserver, not links to webpages. If you wish to add a link to a webpage, you have to use HTML and record it in the Note field. Here is a list of websites which have given us permission to link to their images. If a website is not on this list, you must first ask permission of the party that owns that website. If you have an image file of the publication's cover, you can upload it to the ISFDB server by clicking on the "Upload cover scan" link on the publication's ISFDB record page. (If you're adding a new pub, it's best to wait until that submission is accepted, then upload the image file to the ISFDB server, then update the pub record with the URL of the image that you uploaded.) Thanks. Mhhutchins 14:54, 1 November 2011 (UTC)

The Iron Star

The ISBN you gave for this publication links to another title on Amazon, OCLC and other websites. Please check the number again. Also, please stop using the image URL field to record webpage addresses. Thanks. Mhhutchins 14:59, 1 November 2011 (UTC) The ISBN that I gave was what I recorded at the time the book was published. I donated the book to the UCR Library in 2005, so I no longer have it to check. As for the image URL, I copied it from yesterday, which you have permission to use. It is also the cover that I remember on the book. I do not understand how this image URL has become a website address. Fred 06:10, 2 November 2011 (UTC)

Fuzzy Ergo Sum

You submitted an update to this record which added the month of publication. Is the date stated in the book itself, or is it from a secondary source. I ask because the record has been primary verified by another editor. Mhhutchins 18:42, 1 November 2011 (UTC)

The entry says March 23, 2011. The publisher's website, the H. Beam Piper Memorial Web Site says in its News dated March 5, 2011 that Diehr has jst finished the book and he will publish it. Fred 05:45, 2 November 2011 (UTC)
If you're not working from the actual book, please record your source in the note field. If you are working from the actual book, and the data is unstated in the book, please note the secondary source in the note field. It helps the moderator determine whether to accept the submission and keeps us from having to bug you with questions like this.
Before making changes to records that have been primary verified, it is ISFDB etiquette to notify the verifier. The level of notification is usually stated at the top of that editor's wiki talk page. I will accept your submission, notify the verifier about the change, and record the source of the month of publication in the record's note field. Thanks. (BTW, use a colon to separate your response from the previous one, adding a colon for each additional message.) Mhhutchins 06:05, 2 November 2011 (UTC)

Flood Waters Rising

Your submission adding a new record for this title gives the authors as "E. T. A. Hirst", while the Amazon listing and cover image credits "E. M. A. Hirst". Which one is correct? Mhhutchins 18:46, 1 November 2011 (UTC)

You are right. It is E. M. A. Hirst. Fred 05:36, 2 November 2011 (UTC)
I'll accept the submission, and then correct the author credit. (Submissions can't be changed once submitted: they can only be accepted or rejected by the moderator, or cancelled by the submitter.) Thanks. Mhhutchins 06:11, 2 November 2011 (UTC)
One further thing: your submission credited the cover artist as "Notorious (Robin McLean)". The Amazon Look-Inside shows that Robin McLean is credited as the book's cover designer. I see the "Notorious" logo on the bottom left of the cover. Is the artist usually referred to "Notorious (Robin McLean)"? Sorry, one more question: I see the publisher stated as "Pop Seagull Publishing" with no mention of CreateSpace. We usually only record the stated publisher in the ISFDB record (which, among other things, keeps another editor from adding another record for the same pub.) Thanks. Mhhutchins 06:23, 2 November 2011 (UTC)
I never heard of Notorious (Robin McLean) before, so I don't know how he/she is usually referred to. Sorry. Fred 07:45, 2 November 2011 (UTC)
The name, in that form, was given as the cover artist in your submission. If the copyright page credits Robin McLean where did you get the submission's cover art credit? Mhhutchins 15:19, 2 November 2011 (UTC)
By combining the cover artist signature "Notorious" with the copyright page credit of "Cover Design Copyright 2011 By Robin McLean". Fred 11:05, 4 November 2011 (UTC)
ISFDB records should reflect credits exactly as stated in the pub. Any unstated data must be sourced in the notes field. I'll adjust the cover art credit based on the copyright page statement. Thanks. Mhhutchins 18:34, 4 November 2011 (UTC)

Amazon's cover images

Hi. If you're interested in grabbing Amazon's cover images.... You need to get the URL for the image itself (versus the link to the page on which the image appears). It's a little tricky because Amazon always wraps the image with other adornments (a white block, sometimes a "Look Inside" arrow or a "Kindle" tab), but not too hard.

  1. Go to the page, e.g.,
  2. In Internet Explorer:
    • Right-click on the image and pick "Properties"
    • Triple-click on the text labeled "Address" ("http://...""). It should all highlight.
    • Right-click and pick Copy, or Ctrl-C to copy.
  3. In Firefox:
    • Right-click on the image and pick "Copy Image Location"
  4. Back in the ISDFB, paste (right-click + paste, or Ctrl-V) what you copied into the "Image URL" field. You should see something like (in this case, which has a Look Inside arrow):,204,203,200_PIsitb-sticker-arrow-click,TopRight,35,-76_AA300_SH20_OU01_.jpg
  5. Delete everything from the first to the final period, leaving one of them. E.g., delete what I've bolded here:,204,203,200_PIsitb-sticker-arrow-click,TopRight,35,-76_AA300_SH20_OU01_.jpg to get

And you now have a link directly to Amazon's underlying cover image. It's seems complicated but is easier than it sounds, especially after you have done it once or twice. I took care of the ones where you provided the Amazon page in the moderator notes, but I thought you might want to try it in the future if you're going to the trouble to hunt down the Amazon listings anyway. Thanks for contributing, --MartyD 10:45, 6 November 2011 (UTC)

Who Censored Roger Rabbit?

Hello, Fred! This is just to inform you that you can feel free to erase the link to the image (and add the necessary information for the moderators). But as we don't have allowance to link to (or use) the images from wikipedia, we can't show the proper image unless someone can (for example) upload a scan or provide a link to amazon or another source. But it's better to show no image than a misleading one, so thanks! Stonecreek 18:17, 6 November 2011 (UTC)

I saw Fred's submission and found the proper image (a larger one than was on wikipedia), downloaded it to my hard drive, cleaned it up a bit, then uploaded it to our server and linked it to the record. The submission can be cleared from the queue. Thanks. Mhhutchins 18:24, 6 November 2011 (UTC)
And to follow-up on Stonecreek's message, a submission which is only a note to the moderator doesn't change the record. You could have removed the link to the bad image at the same time as the submission, or could have taken the steps I took to add the proper image to our server and then changed the Image URL field to the correct image. Because you're relatively new here, I took those steps for you. If you need further information about uploading images to the ISFDB's server, there's a link in the welcome section at the top of this user talk page. Thanks. Mhhutchins 18:28, 6 November 2011 (UTC)

Adding a synopsis to a title...

...shouldn't be done in the Note to Moderator Field of a submission that updates the publication record. If the title is already in the database, go to the title record (here), click on "Edit Title Data", add the synopsis in the Synopsis Field, then submit. I'll do that for you in this case, because you'd already gone to the trouble of typing it out in a moderator's note, which I will copy and paste. Please use the method I outlined above to add a synopsis in the future. Thanks. Mhhutchins 18:37, 6 November 2011 (UTC)

Adding a new pub to an existing title

When a title is already in the database (such as Godhanger), you should use the "Add Publication to This Title" function instead of "Add New Novel". This will automatically merge the new publication with all of the other books published under the title. As it was submitted, there are now two title records for the same title on the summary page for Dick King-Smith. We will now have to merge the newly created title record with the one that's already in the database. Are you familiar with the merge title function? If not, I can step you through the process. Mhhutchins 20:25, 7 November 2011 (UTC)

We have the same problem with Firewing by Kenneth Opel. The title records will have to be merged. Mhhutchins 20:29, 7 November 2011 (UTC)
Where is the "Add Publication to This Title" function? I have a new edition of The Pig Who Saved the World, by Gryllus the Pig, by Paul Shipton, that I would like to add to the database for that novel, but I cannot find any "Add Publication to This Title" instead of "Add New Novel" to use. Fred 17:42, 8 November 2011 (UTC)
When you look at that title, "Add Publication to This Title" is the 7th option in "Editing Tools". BLongley 17:45, 8 November 2011 (UTC)
Accepted: I've moved the synopsis from the Note to Moderator to the title record (you should have used "Edit Title Data" for the synopsis) and taken the Amazon image from the web-page you suggested. BLongley 18:31, 8 November 2011 (UTC)

Beyond Time and Again

Your submission to update this record was rejected for a couple of reasons. You wanted to change the page count field from "[41]" to "41". Brackets around numbers in the page count field indicates a work which is unpaginated, but someone has counted the pages to come up with the actual number. Your note about it being the first work to be called a "graphic novel" is a title-related note, not a publication-specific note, and it already appears in the title record. (I entered it there from your previous submission.) Mhhutchins 05:23, 12 November 2011 (UTC)

Okay. I thought that there might be some protocol for differentiating between a paged and an unpaged but counted page count, which is why I described this in the note to the moderator. Thanks for clarifying it. Fred 06:04, 12 November 2011 (UTC)

Referencing sources...

...should be done in the Note field, not the Note to Moderator field. The Note to Moderator field is not publicly visible and is used by the editor to give the moderator additional information that would help him determine whether to accept the submission. The Note field is used 1) to record information about the publication itself for which there is no dedicated field, 2) to record the sources of information that is not stated in the book itself, or 3) to record the sources of information when the editor is not working from an actual copy of the book. In your update to this book, you note your source for the month of publication and the price in the Note to Moderator field. If accepted as submitted, no user of the db will know what is the source of the data. I will move the Note to Moderator to the Note field. Also, you give the price as "£0/3/6". The standard is to record shillings and pence only for pre-decimalization British prices. So I'll change it to "3/6". Please familiarize yourself with this help page which gives details on how to enter each field of a publication record. Thanks. Mhhutchins 15:02, 13 November 2011 (UTC)

Okay. I meant this information for the moderator and not the public because I did not think the public would be interested; but if you think otherwise, all right. Thank you for your correction about the price information format. Fred 15:13, 13 November 2011 (UTC)
Secondary sources should be visibly noted in the record. Users need to know where the data came from. Thanks. Mhhutchins 15:46, 13 November 2011 (UTC)
I was the book reviewer for the magazine "Yarf! The Journal of Applied Anthropomorphics" for all issues, from #1, January 1990 to #69, September 2003. This magazine is not indexed in ISFDB, but many of the books that I reviewed are listed in ISFDB. I donated my collection to the University of California, Riverside Library in 2005, but I still have a record of all my reviews. Do you want this information? Fred 11:58, 18 November 2011 (UTC)
If you're unable to do a primary verification of the records that you've created, sourcing the Yarf reviews is a good idea, citing the issue number and date. I sourced the Anthrozine reviews for several of the records that I created in order to link to the reviews when reprinted in the Anthrology collections. Thanks. Mhhutchins 15:55, 18 November 2011 (UTC)
Here are the data for my reviews in the first five issues of Yarf! Is this sufficient? If so, I will use this format to list the 64 remaining issues.

Yarf! #1, January 1990. Review of Howling Mad, by Peter David; Ace Books, Nov. 1989, 0-441-34663-4, 201 p., pb., $3.50. Yarf! #2, March 1990. Review of Cat House, by Michael Peak; Signet Books/New American Library, Sept. 1989, 0-451-16303-6, 255 p., pb., $3.95. Yarf! #3, March 1990. Review of Franky Furbo, by William Wharton; Henry Holt & Co., Oct. 1989, 0-8050-1120-X, 228 p., hc., $50.00. Other edition, Henry Holt & Co, Oct. 1989, 0-8050-1157-9, 228 p., tp., $12.95. Review of Catfantastic: Nine Lives and Fifteen Tales, ed. by Andre Norton and Martin H. Greenberg; DAW Books, July 1989, 0-88677-355-5, 320 p., pb., $3.95. Yarf! #4, May 1990. Review of The Eleventh Hour: A Curious Mystery, by Grahame Base; Harry N. Abrams, Inc., Oct. 1989, 0-8109-0851-4, 32 art pages & 7 text pages, hc., $14.95. Review of The Coachman Rat, by David Henry Wilson; Carroll & Graf Publishers, Oct. 1989, 0-88184-508-6, 171 p., hc., $13.95. Yarf! #5, July 1990. Review of Carmen Dog, by Carol Emshwiller; Mercury House, March 1990, 0-916505-70-2, 161 p., hc.. $15.95

	Other edition, Mercury House, March 1990, 0-916505-77-X, 161 p., tp., $9.95. 

This preview does not show the last review. Fred 18:11, 18 November 2011 (UTC)

Sorry, we've had a communication failure here. I thought you were referring to using the reviews as secondary sources in the records you created adding the books into the database. If you want to have records of the reviews in the database, you'll have to first create records for the pubs in which they appear. Choose the "Add New Fanzine" option under the "Add New Data" menu, and create a record for each of the issues, giving the reviews in the Review section of each submission. At a minimum you'll have to have the name of the publication, the editor, and the date of the publication. Having the publisher, binding, price, and cover artist would be nice. Even nicer, adding all of the contents of the publication. Thanks. Mhhutchins 21:12, 18 November 2011 (UTC)

Comic books, comic strip collections, graphic novels

Current ISFDB rules don't allow the entry of such into the database. There are a few exceptions, based on the status of the author in the SF field, but they are very few. Before making such submissions, it would be a good idea to post a message at the help desk. A discussion there might lead to an exception being made in any specific title. Thanks. Mhhutchins 18:55, 13 November 2011 (UTC)

Okay, I will remember this. This book is not worth an exception. Fred 16:24, 17 November 2011 (UTC)
I do think that "Ode to Kirihito", by Osamu Tezuka, which I reviewed in ANTHROlogy Three, is worth an exception. This is a graphic novel that was conceived of as a novel in cartoon-art form from the beginning, not a collection of a comic strip or book. Fred 16:37, 17 November 2011 (UTC)
These days almost all graphic novels are "conceived of as a novel in [graphic] form from the beginning". The exceptions in the ISFDB are less about intentions and results than they are about the author's standing in the sf field. Still feel free to bring it up for discussion and let the group decide. Mhhutchins 17:12, 17 November 2011 (UTC)
I am retroactively debating this decision. "Ode to Kirihito" was originally serialized in Japan in 1970, which was well before comic book creators regularly started conceiving of a story as a novel in graphic form from the beginning. I have been told that Tezuka was a regular member of the Japanese organization of professional s-f authors. He was accepted by them as a s-f writer who just wrote in the cartoon-art format rather than in prose.Fred 09:55, 27 November 2011 (UTC)

Renard's Menagerie

Submissions adding issues of this magazine were approved. Please remember not to add periods at the end of fields. (In these cases, in the title field.) Mhhutchins 17:22, 19 November 2011 (UTC)


If a review is of anything other than a book that is eligible for inclusion in the database, do not enter it as a review type. It should be entered as an ESSAY with a title in the format "Review of [name of work] by [name of creator]". This includes reviews of comic books, graphic novels, audio recordings, and films. Thanks. Mhhutchins 23:57, 20 November 2011 (UTC)

The Enchanted Cat

I'm assuming this anthology contains spec-fic stories. If so, please add the contents when you get a chance. Thanks. Mhhutchins 00:06, 21 November 2011 (UTC)

Yes, but it might be quite a while before I can get a chance. I donated the book to the UCR Library in 2005. Fred 00:11, 21 November 2011 (UTC)


You've brought a situation to my attention that I think we need to fix. The "pub format" field in the submission form is called "binding" when it's displayed in the pub record, so I'm think this may have caused some confusion. A couple of issues of Yarf! were entered as "thermal" which isn't a standard entry for this field. Most publications that don't have a traditional binding (hardcover, paperback, digest, etc.) is usually entered as "ph" for pamphlet. We also use "quarto" to refer to saddle-stapled magazines (or fanzines) that are 8 1/2 by 11 inches in dimension. Do any of these two formats apply to Yarf? Thanks. Mhhutchins 00:15, 21 November 2011 (UTC)

Yes, ph will do fine. Yarf! is 8 1/2 by 11 inches, but it is perfect bound with a thermally-affixed black tape binding, not saddle-stapled. Fred 00:24, 21 November 2011 (UTC)


A story that is published in more than one issue of a periodical should be entered as a SERIAL type, and use the following title format: "Title of Story (Part X of Y)", with X changing with each part and Y remaining a constant. I've updated the parts of Chris Grant's "Empire", but need to know how many parts it was published in. Thanks. Mhhutchins 00:30, 21 November 2011 (UTC)

Same situation with Susan Van Camp's "Varcel's Vixens". Mhhutchins 00:31, 21 November 2011 (UTC)
And "A Gift of Fire, A Gift of Blood" by Watts Martin. Mhhutchins 01:50, 21 November 2011 (UTC)
I don't know how many parts. I am being loaned the issues of Yarf! two or three at a time. Requiring me to say the number of parts in advance will prevent me from adding these titles. I can list the parts as (Part X of ?) and then correct the ? to the proper number when I reach the end of the serial.

Page count for Yarf! #1

The page count for Yarf! #1 was given as 6 pages, but the content entries go up to page 46. Thanks for checking. Mhhutchins 00:43, 21 November 2011 (UTC)

48 is correct. Fred 01:20, 21 November 2011 (UTC)
I meant 46. Fred 01:21, 21 November 2011 (UTC)
If you find that you've made a mistake, or someone brings one to your attention, feel free to make a submission to correct the error. I've corrected the page count for this issue. Thanks. Mhhutchins 01:41, 21 November 2011 (UTC)

Yarf! #5

Is the essay titled "Review of BRIXOI (fanzine)" reviewed by Tom Foster and Ken Fletcher or are they the authors of the fanzine? If the latter, you'll need to correct the record to read "Review of BRIXOI (fanzine) by Tom Foster and Ken Fletcher" and then change the author to the name of the reviewer. Mhhutchins 01:43, 21 November 2011 (UTC)

Research has shown that the latter is true, so please make the correction. Also, you'll need to change "Review of Normal u.s.a. (comic strip book) • essay by Mike Jantze". It should titled "Review of Normal u.s.a. (comic strip book) by Mike Jantze" and you'll need to change the author field to the name of the reviewer. Mhhutchins 01:47, 21 November 2011 (UTC)

Issues of Yarf!

Before adding more issues of this title, please review the changes I've made in the ones already in the database. Also, a response to the questions I've asked in previous posts would be really help. Thanks. Mhhutchins 01:45, 21 November 2011 (UTC)

Which questions have I not answered? I thought that I had answered them all. Fred 20:25, 21 November 2011 (UTC)

Common errors

I'm finding a few errors in your submissions:

  • Ellipses (. . .) should be entered [space] [period] [space] [period] [space] [period] if they occur at the end of a title. Or [period] [space] [period] [space] [period] [space] if they occur at the beginning of a title. Or [space] [period] [space] [period] [space] [period] [space] if they occur in the middle of a title.
  • There should be a comma after the name of authors who use "II", "III", "IV" as their given name, e.g. Roy D. Pounds, II and Waverly Pierre, III.
  • NONFICTION type should only be used for book-length works of nonfiction. Short pieces of nonfiction that are published in a larger work (collection, anthology, magazine) should be typed as ESSAY.
  • If a work is similarly titled and part of a column published in several issues, you should disambiguate it by adding the magazine title and date (or issue number). For example, the "Flaming Hairballs" column by Jeff Ferris. Look at the way I've disambiguated it in the issues in which it appears. The same applies to other series, such as the "Freefall" series by Mark Stanley, and the "Portraits" series by Tom Verré.

Thanks. Mhhutchins 05:35, 21 November 2011 (UTC)

I have to add two more of them:
  • There should be a . instead of a , in the prices of the European editions. I know they are given with a , on the publications, but we overcame to use the English standard with those prices for convenience and possible future statistics (it just makes it easier to do them when you have only one decimal sign).
  • We have the standard to drop 'Verlag' from the German publications, because it just means publishing house. So Goldmann Verlag would become just Goldmann.

I already made the necessary changes for the two novels by Leonie Swann. I rejected your submission for 'Die Abschaffung der Arten' by Dietmar Dath: this publication had been already entered.

Thanks for your input. Stonecreek 10:23, 21 November 2011 (UTC)

Okay. I will note these rules. Fred 20:19, 21 November 2011 (UTC)

Fuchsgeschichten, by Dag Frommhold.

This proposed submission appears to be a collection of stories about foxes, stories that treat them anthropomorphically, as if they had human intelligence, but that's not enough to qualify such stories for inclusion. From the reviews I could find there doesn't seem to be anything "speculative" about these stories. The author's purpose appears to be to get other folks to identify with the foxes, to encourage anti-hunting sentiment, not to describe "fantastic" stories which the reader wouldn't identify with. Can you describe why you thought this book belonged in the ISFDB? Thanks, Chavey 06:16, 26 November 2011 (UTC)

And another point: the publisher '' looks more like a webpage or e-mail adress to me. Is there no other publisher mentioned? Stonecreek 10:44, 26 November 2011 (UTC)
This comment from Fred via a database submission's moderator note: My User Talk page will not allow me to post a reply, so I am using this New Title form instead. I entered the German collection Fuchsgeschichten because it is a fantasy about anthropomorphized animals, notably but not exclusively foxes, living in a world with humans. Even if the stories do not contain any other s-f or fantasy element, the presence of bipedal, talking foxes and other animals makes this a fantasy. (—The preceding unsigned comment was added by Frederick Patten (talkcontribs) .) --MartyD 11:53, 26 November 2011 (UTC)
Another comment from a submission: Again, I am using the New Title page to post a reply because my User Page does not allow replies, despite being logged in. Yes, Fuchsgeschichten's "press" is the author's site; the book is self-published. Therefore there is no other publisher that I can cite. Nevertheless, I have the book; it is a very professionally printed tp, now in its 2nd printing. Mhhutchins 20:38, 26 November 2011 (UTC)
I had already verified that "" is the correct "name" for the publisher. IMO, it's crucial that the anthropomorphized foxes are living and interacting with humans. (Which I couldn't tell from the extracts that I found.) That moves it from the realm of "Three Little Pigs"-type stories (OUT) into the realm of "Watership Down" and "Catwings", which I view as IN. So I'll remove my Hold and approve the submission. Thanks much, Chavey 01:02, 27 November 2011 (UTC)
One small point: Is the price in DM or in Euro? I assume the later, but I'm reluctant to change that price without being certain. Chavey 01:05, 27 November 2011 (UTC)
It is in Euros. Also, it is the author/publisher's price including air shipment to American purchasers. I would have to ask to get a base price without extras. Fred 09:44, 27 November 2011 (UTC)

Inability to edit Wiki pages

Hi Fred, I saw your use of a change submission to advise of inability to edit your talk page. That most likely means you are not logged into the Wiki. If you're looking at this page and see "log in" at the top right, that's the cause. Just log in, and you should be good to go. --MartyD 11:50, 26 November 2011 (UTC)

Yes, you have to be logged into the Wiki, which works separately from the DB. Logging into one doesn't log you into both. Mhhutchins 20:39, 26 November 2011 (UTC)
Thanks. Yes, this works.

I just borrowed the 60+ issues of Yarf! The Journal of Applied Anthropomorphics that I did not have, so I will be able to resume adding them to the data base.Fred 08:09, 27 November 2011 (UTC)

Yarf! #3

Made the following changes to this record:

  • Changed "Empires (part 3 of X)" short story to "Empires (Part 3 of X)" serial.
  • Corrected the spelling of the author of Franky Furbo from "Wlliam Wharton" to "William Wharton" and then linked it to the novel's title record.
  • Changed "Flaming Hairballs (editorial)" to "Flaming Hairballs (Yarf! #3)".

Mhhutchins 18:32, 27 November 2011 (UTC)

Yarf! #7

Made the following changes in this record:

  • Changed "Flaming Hairballs (editorial)" to "Flaming Hairballs (Yarf! #7)".
  • Changed "Empires (part 6 of X)" short story to "Empires (Part 6 of X)" serial.
  • Changed "A Gift of Fire, A Gift of Blood (part 3 of X)" short story to "A Gift of Fire, A Gift of Blood (Part 3 of X)" serial. [Note the capitalization of "Part" in the last two changes.]

Mhhutchins 18:38, 27 November 2011 (UTC)

"A Gift of Wings" or "A Gift of Fire"

Can you confirm that the change in title for this record? Previous installments were titled "A Gift of Fire, A Gift of Blood". Thanks. Mhhutchins 18:40, 27 November 2011 (UTC)

You are right. It should be "A Gift of Fire, A Gift of Blood". Sorry. Fred 02:23, 28 November 2011 (UTC)


Please enter all multi-part stories as SERIAL type instead of SHORTFICTION. Leave the length field blank. Thanks. Mhhutchins 02:02, 29 November 2011 (UTC)

All right. Fred 07:26, 29 November 2011 (UTC)


A periodical's ISSN is neither an ISBN nor a catalog number, so it should not be recorded in the ISBN/Catalog # field. You can add it to the Note field if you wish. Thanks. Mhhutchins 16:40, 30 November 2011 (UTC)

All right. Fred 21:24, 30 November 2011 (UTC)

Yarf! editorials

Hi. I noticed that over the half dozen or so Yarf! entries, you've included "(editorial)" as part of the Flaming Hairballs titles. Is that your addition, or are they presented that way? If it's your addition, my comment was going to be that I don't think it's necessary. On a related but tangential note, one of the things we have been doing with regular magazine features -- including editorials -- is to place them in a title series. Where Flaming Hairballs is an editorial, you might use "Editorial (Yarf!)". For other things, like The Last Bits, you could use that as the series name (or "The Last Bits (Yarf!)" if you found The Last Bits to be too generic). You don't have to do this, I only mention it as a technique some folks have employed. If you use the ISFDB search box and change the combo menu to search by Series, look for "Editorial" or "Brass Tacks" or "The Quarterly Review" to get some ideas. --MartyD 11:26, 2 December 2011 (UTC)

Three Bags Full

How did you arrive at the page count for this record? The OCLC record gives it as 351. Thanks. Mhhutchins 05:06, 8 December 2011 (UTC)

I looked in the book and counted the pages myself. Fred 13:27, 8 December 2011 (UTC)
Doing a primary verification of the record will let us know that the data is from a book in hand. Otherwise you should note your sources in the note field. (This is true for all your submissions, so please keep that in mind.)
One more thing: we ordinarily do not use the plus method of page counting (e.g. [3]+341) unless there is significant text on the unnumbered pages, or we want to create content records for essays, interior art, etc that are on unnumbered pages. Are either of these true in this case? If so, please note that in the record. Thanks. Mhhutchins 13:44, 8 December 2011 (UTC)

Foudini M. Cat

Hi. I have your submission of a new entry for Autobiography of Foudini M. Cat on hold. It looks like it is duplicating this entry. What do you think? --MartyD 11:34, 27 December 2011 (UTC)

Yes, this is the same, except that I list the month of publication as well as the year. Fred 14:32, 27 December 2011 (UTC)
In a case such as this, you should augment the existing entry instead of creating a duplicate one. I will leave your submission on hold so you can copy + paste the info. You can cancel it when you no longer need it. Thanks. --MartyD 12:13, 28 December 2011 (UTC)

Hogarth / de Alarcon

Thanks for the note. I set up M. C. A. Hogarth as canonical, and made Maggie de Alarcon and M. C. A. 'Micah' Hogarth -- note: spaces after the periods -- pseudoynms (and set up all of the variants). --MartyD 12:22, 27 December 2011 (UTC)

I have to emphasize Marty's last point. All of the subsequent entries are being given as "M.C.A." and I have to change them to "M. C. A." Thanks for keeping this in mind. Mhhutchins 16:37, 28 December 2011 (UTC)
Okay. I will add the spaces after the periods. Fred 20:56, 28 December 2011 (UTC)

Christina Hanson

Is Christina 'Smudge' Hanson the same person as Christina Hanson? Shall we make the former a pseudonym for the latter? --MartyD 17:54, 29 December 2011 (UTC)

Yes, Christina Hanson and Christina "Smudge" Hanson are the same person. There are several other inconsistent names between different issues, such as Dan Canaan and Dan "Flinthoof" Canaan, and Michael Payne and Michael H. Payne. There are also variant spellings, such as Matt McAndrew and Matt McAndrews -- I think the latter is correct. I have listed the names as they are given in each issue. Fred 03:14, 30 December 2011 (UTC)
Where you are aware of these, I encourage you to set up pseudonyms. To do that, figure out which name is "canonical" -- that typically means the name the author/artist is best known by, although sometimes that means the most current name -- and make the others pseudonyms of that (on the Author page for the would-be pseudonym, you'll find a "Make/Remove a Pseudonym" at the left). Then make variants of all of the titles attributed to the pseudonym, with a revised credit of the canonical name. If you don't do the variants, someone will be able to figure out they're needed, but if you don't do the pseudonym, that relationship is likely to go unnoticed. Thanks. --MartyD 11:24, 30 December 2011 (UTC)
Here are relevant help sections for pseudonyms and works under a pseudonym. --MartyD 11:28, 30 December 2011 (UTC)

Ralph the Wonder Hamster

I corrected "Wpnder" -> "Wonder" and added the issue number for disambiguation in Ralph the Wonder Hamster (Yarf #58). In doing that, I noticed these have not been entered consistently. See here. You may want to fix up the other ones, and that one that's Short Fiction instead of Interior Art sticks out.... --MartyD 11:31, 30 December 2011 (UTC)

Thanks for the spelling correction. As I said, these 69 issues of "Yarf!" (I am still inputting them) are spread from 1990 to 2003 and their tables of contents are not consistent on how they spell authors' and artists' names, or how they title individual installments of serials or continuing series. I am also unsure, and may have been inconsistent, of how cartoon art serials should be listed; the humorous cartoons are clearly Interior Art, but the dramatic cartoon serials that tell a continuing story, I am less sure about. In general, I list each title as it is given on the table of contents and do not concern myself with overall inconsistencies. Fred 14:48, 30 December 2011 (UTC)

Links to pages about authors and titles

Hi. I've taken the wikifur link you proposed adding to the The First Book of Lapism's Anthro Press edition and put it on Phil Geusz's record instead, as one of the web page references. The linked page seemed to be about him, rather than about that work. If you have a link about a particular work, most often it is best to put that on the title (there, that would be on this record) if it applies to the general work. Use the publication's notes to record references specific to that one book -- that specific publication of a work. Thanks. --MartyD 11:31, 1 January 2012 (UTC)

Thanks. Yes, this s better. Fred 14:46, 1 January 2012 (UTC)

Am Ende des Regenbogens

Your update to this record was accepted, but I had to make a few changes. The canonical name of the publisher is Bastei Lübbe (without the dash), and a price in euros should be preceded with the symbol €. Thanks. Mhhutchins 21:21, 1 January 2012 (UTC)

You can type in the euro symbol on most US keyboards by holding down the "ALT" key and typing "0128" using the number keypad. Mhhutchins 21:24, 1 January 2012 (UTC)
Thanks. Unfortunately, I have only one hand and it takes two to hold down the ALT key and type 0128 at the same time.Fred 22:42, 1 January 2012 (UTC)
On my keyboard, I can type it via option-shift-2. Chavey 14:19, 2 January 2012 (UTC)
On Windows, you can use the Character Map application (on XP, it's in Start -> Programs -> Accessories -> System Tools). Select the symbol you want. You can use the Copy button in that application to copy it to the clipboard, from which you can then paste (right-click -> Paste) when editing. --MartyD 14:25, 2 January 2012 (UTC)

Cover images

I added the cover photo that you linked to in your submission for "Thomas" you submitted. To add the cover to your submission, I option-clicked the cover (or right-click, depending on the computer/browser), selected the "View Image" option, to get just the cover image. Then, to get a better version to use, I deleted all of the text between the ".jpg" and the preceding period, to get (in this case) "", which was what I entered in the cover image field. With "Earth Light", by Tracy Pierce, the first step gave me "", so the second step gave me "", which is larger (and omits white borders). This also removes the "Look Inside" graphic for books like Thomas. Chavey 14:12, 2 January 2012 (UTC)

"The Power of the Bear"

You submitted this book for inclusion. From the description on Amazon, though, it seems like this is primarily an art book. Books focusing on speculative fiction in art are not normally included, and as best as I can tell, there isn't enough fiction text in this collection to justify its inclusion. Is there more to the book than is apparent from the description you included and the one on Amazon? Thanks, Chavey 14:38, 2 January 2012 (UTC)

Probably not. The artist does feature the bear in its aspect of legends and its mythic shamanistic role, so the book qualifies as fantasy art; but if you do not accept speculative fiction art books, then this should not be included.
I've raised the question of speculative fiction art books on the "Rules and Standards" discussion page, at least to see what the current attitudes are. Originally, the ISFDB limited itself to fiction and cover artists. The addition of interior art artists implies that we may have more interest in the art directions, but my suspicion is that the prohibition on graphic novels is deep enough that the group will probably keep the current precedents on speculative fiction art books. But keep this book around in case they change! Chavey 18:39, 2 January 2012 (UTC)
The opinion is that we should include "The Power of the Bear". Unfortunately, I can't pull the previous submission back, so I'm hoping you'll be willing to re-submit it. Thanks, Chavey 09:28, 3 January 2012 (UTC)
Done. Fred 16:54, 3 January 2012 (UTC)

By the way, to bring up a separate matter, I have noticed that when my Yarf! reviews of 1990-2003 speculative fiction books are entered into the data base, some of my reviews are then noted on the entries of the books reviewed; but others are not. For example, your entry for Guardians of the Three, Book Two, Keeper of the City, by Peter Morwood and Diane Duane does not cite my review of it in Yarf! Why are some reviews noted but others are not? Fred 17:25, 2 January 2012 (UTC)

I haven't moderated any of your Yarf! submissions, and I'm a newbie when it comes to reviews, so I'm the wrong person to ask about this. If you look at your "My Recent Edits" link at the top of the navigation page, you should be able to tell who's been moderating your Yarf!'s, and you might ask them. Chavey 18:39, 2 January 2012 (UTC)
If I may interject, since I've handled most of Fred's submissions: the linking of a review record to the ISFDB record of the title under review happens in one of three ways.
  1. If the title is already in the database and the review's book title field matches the book's title field EXACTLY, then the system will automatically link the two records upon submission of the review record.
  2. If it doesn't match EXACTLY, but there is a record of the title in the database, you (or in most cases, I, as the moderator who handled the original submission) will have to make a manual submission linking the two records.
  3. If the title doesn't exist in the database, someone (usually again, I) will have to create a record for the publication, then make another submission to link this new title record with the already existing review record.
That being said, I will go back to the Yarf! issues to see which reviews have not been linked and do that for you, if the title exists in another form somewhere in the database. You can even do that yourself: find the title that's being reviewed; once found, record the numbers at the end of the URL (address) of that record (look at your browser's address window and find the numbers that follow Then go to the review record and click on "Link Review to Title" under the editing tools menu, and enter the number of that title record into the field labeled Parent #, then submit. Mhhutchins 19:59, 2 January 2012 (UTC)

Linking Yarf! reviews

I have linked all of the reviews for titles which were already in the database. In all cases, the links didn't happen automatically because the titles as given in the review did not exactly match the title of the work. For example: the review gave the title of the Christopher Rowley novel as The Ancient Enemy: The First Book of Arna when the database record gives the title as The Ancient Enemy (we usually don't include a series subtitle in the title field.) In linking the reviews to the title records, I did not change the titles as given in the reviews, using the method I described above about linking reviews with the title record number. So I kept the review's title to Guardians of the Three. Volume II, Keeper of the City when I linked it to the ISFDB title record for Keeper of the City. In the future, it might help to look for the title that's given in the database before creating the review record, making sure it matches exactly in both the title and author(s) field. This isn't mandatory, but it will save you from making another submission to manually link the two.

This leaves three reviews which are not linked:

  • Rover's Tales by Michael Z. Lewin (reviewed in Yarf! #54). Most descriptions of this make it appear to be non spec-fic.
  • Reading the Rabbit: Explorations in Warner Bros. Animation by Kevin S. Sandler (reviewed in Yarf! #55). This one is in the submission queue so I'll accept it and then link it to the review.
  • The Power of the Bear: Paintings by Susan Seddon Boulet (reviewed in Yarf! #56). This title was rejected by another moderator as being non-spec fic. I probably would have accepted it based on the artist's other spec-fic work, but that's one of the borderline cases for which each moderator must make a personal judgement.

Mhhutchins 20:41, 2 January 2012 (UTC)

I agree that, given the criteria for speculative fiction with an emphasis on FICTION, the books on Warner Bros. animated cartoons and bear fantasy paintings are borderline cases. "Rover's Tales", however, features anthropomorphized dogs who "talk" to each other and act with human intelligence, like the rabbits in "Watership Down" and numerous other anthropomorphized-animal fantasies, so it should definitely qualify for inclusion. Fred 03:49, 3 January 2012 (UTC)
Create a record for it and I'll approve it. Mhhutchins 04:22, 3 January 2012 (UTC)
Sounds reasonable to me, but maybe The Plague Dogs would have been a better comparison. BLongley 04:35, 3 January 2012 (UTC)

The Saviors by Evelyn Raynor Slim

Concerning the review in this issue, I can find no mention anywhere on the internet of this title. Was this a true review or a spoof? Mhhutchins 17:52, 28 February 2012 (UTC)

It will take me a few weeks to find out. Fred 00:55, 29 February 2012 (UTC)
I have doublechecked this review in Science Fiction Review #38. It appears to be a serious review, not a spoof. Ted Pauls was a serious reviewer. The review contains this additional information: Meredith, $5.95. Pauls says in his review that the book's dust jacket (implying that it is a hardcover) contains no author information, leading him to suspect that it is a pseudonym. Nevertheless, I can find no listings for Evelyn Raynor Slim in the Library of Congress catalogue, the catalogues for the Los Angeles city and county public libraries, or the catalogue of the University of California Libraries. Meredith Press has a catalogue of its books going back to the 1960s, but there is nothing by Evelyn Slim.Fred 03:04, 20 March 2012 (UTC)
There's no record on OCLC and Robert Reginald has no listing for the title or the author in his reference. And the only mention of "Evelyn Raynor Slim" on several billion pages of the internet is this single record on the ISFDB. I find it hard to believe the book actually exists. Mhhutchins 04:35, 20 March 2012 (UTC)
I cannot really argue with you.

By the way, to change the subject completely, I used to review s-f for Library Journal from 1971 to 1976. I kept records of my thirty LJ reviews, such as:

Christopher Anvil. Pandora’s Planet. Library Journal, June 1, 1972, p. 2120

Isaac Asimov, ed. Before the Golden Age. Library Journal, May 15, 1974, p. 1411

Isaac Asimov. Buy Jupiter and Other Stories. Library Journal, August 1975, p. 1444-1445

J. G. Ballard. Chronopolis. Library Journal, September 1, 1971, p. 2672

The ISFDB does not have any records for reviews in Library Journal. Is there any way to get these reviews recorded?Fred 05:36, 21 March 2012 (UTC)

You would have to create records for each of the periodicals, which aree considered non-genre magazines. There are specific rules about entering such periodicals detailed here. After you've read the instructions, feel free to make submissions adding the issues. Only add the spec-fic related contents. There are other specific rules that apply to such magazines, so please don't start without going over the standards. If you have any questions ask them at the Help Desk. Mhhutchins 07:38, 21 March 2012 (UTC)

SF Review #43

The submission adding this record was accepted, but I had to change the record type of the piece on page from NONFICTION to ESSAY. (As I may not have explained before, NONFICTION is used for book-length works of nonfiction.) I'm also going to disambiguate the columns by adding the issue name to the title field. A question: what is "pf" in the binding field? Mhhutchins 01:27, 24 March 2012 (UTC)

Sorry. "pf" should have been "ph".Fred 02:13, 24 March 2012 (UTC)
Got it. Also changed the price to "$0.50" to conform to standards. I have added this issue to a new series entitled Science Fiction Review (1st Series) because we already had a series for Science Fiction Review. Because the numbering restarted with the latter series, I've chosen to keep them separate. Thanks. Mhhutchins 02:18, 24 March 2012 (UTC)
Okay. I have just added Science Fiction Review (1st Series) #28. It has a review on page 29 of one of Richard E. Geis' pornographic s-f novels (Brandon House #2061, $1.25) that I suspect might not be in the data base.Fred 05:19, 24 March 2012 (UTC)
Surprise! It is! Mhhutchins 05:30, 24 March 2012 (UTC)

Uncredited authorship

Please enter "uncredited" in the author field, not "none". Also, NONFICTION is for book-length work; a nonfiction piece contained in a larger work should be entered as ESSAY. Thanks. Mhhutchins 05:33, 3 May 2012 (UTC)

Also, if the cover art is not credited, or if there is no cover art, just leave the field blank. Do not enter either "none" or "uncredited". Mhhutchins 05:34, 3 May 2012 (UTC)
One more time, if a piece is not credited you should enter "uncredited" into the author field. Do not use "Anonymous" unless the work is actually credited to Anonymous. Mhhutchins
Okay.Fred 03:05, 23 May 2012 (UTC)

Other Trails Taken

Hi. I accepted your Other Trails Taken submission but made a few changes to it to make it conform to ISFDB standards:

  • I changed the subtitle separation from using parentheses to using a colon. As an aside, where a subtitle is a series name and index number, I would be inclined to omit it and simply to put the title in a series of that name instead. From the Subtitles section of Help:Screen:EditPub#Title: Note that the title page may show the series name, and sometimes the publication's position in the series. It is left to the editor's discretion as to whether this should be part of the "title" that you enter for the publication. If you don't enter the series name as part of the ISFDB title then editors are encouraged to include a note explaining how the title is stated on the title page. For example, you could enter the title for a publication as "Song of the Dragon" and the note would have "The title page states 'Song of the' over 'Dragon' over 'The annals of Drakis: Book One'." It's up to you; I'm just pointing out that you can do it.
  • I changed the names of the contained works from "Forest Tales n. XYZ" to "Episode n: XYZ" to match the title pages as shown in Amazon's Look Inside for the pub. For the most part, we use titles as presented in the publication (and we definitely don't use anything NOT in the publication). If they were published elsewhere as "Forest Tales n", we'd make a variant. I was thinking that, in the subtitle spirit above, you could omit the "Episode n:" and put the titles into a "Forest Tales" series, but the software doesn't allow the "F1", "F2", and "F3" indices, so that's not a good idea. :-)
  • I added "(Other Trails Taken)" to the Foreword and to the Illustration Credits, as they are generic titles.

I did also get the cover image. Thanks. --MartyD 10:27, 26 May 2012 (UTC)

Okay. Thanks for bringing this up to standards.Fred 11:59, 26 May 2012 (UTC)

The Ursa Major Awards Anthology

I accepted your submission for The Ursa Major Awards Anthology and I linked to the Amazon artwork from the listing you mentioned in the notes. I notice that the description includes a statement about 'original artwork' for each story. You might want to add those as 'interior artwork' records. Just fyi. - Thanks - Kevin 16:53, 24 June 2012 (UTC)

Added.Fred 19:48, 24 June 2012 (UTC)

Title series vs. Publication series

Even though this has been brought up before, I'll do so again. Here's a link to the help page which explains the difference between the two major types of series. "Alasso" is a title series, not a publication series (such as "Ballantine Adult Fantasy" and "Ace Specials"). I've removed it from the publication records and added it to the title records for the two volumes. Remember in the future: The Publication Series field in Add Record submissions should not be used to add the Title Series. You can not enter a title series when adding or editing publication records. They can only be added to the title record once the submission to add the publication has been accepted into the database. If you're not sure if a series is a Publication Series or a Title Series, ask on the Help Desk page. Thanks. Mhhutchins 18:17, 25 June 2012 (UTC)

Okay.Fred 20:02, 25 June 2012 (UTC)

Issues of Science Fiction Review

I've removed the "Table of Contents" records you've added to the latest submissions for issues of Science Fiction Review. It is an ISFDB standard not to include such records as contents of a publication. A question: what are the pieces you've been entering as titled "P. O. Box 3116"? Are they really essays? Are each one unique? Thanks. Mhhutchins 20:56, 12 April 2013 (UTC) Fred 03:23, 15 June 2013 (UTC)Yes. The editor titled his editorial column "P. O. Box 3116" and wrote his editorials under that title.Fred 03:23, 15 June 2013 (UTC)

The Incredible Tide

I accepted your submission of The Incredible Tide and made some changes, one possibly needing your attention:

  • I added a leading 0 to the ISBN you provided (originally 664-32470-3). If the book omitted the leading 0, it is ISFDB practice to add it to get a valid ISBN (see Help:Screen:EditPub#ISBN), but then the discrepancy should be recorded in the publication notes. So if your book has that 9-digit SBN with no leading 0, please update the notes.
  • I changed "The Westminster Press" to "Westminster Press", as we already had that publisher without a leading "The".
  • I also got and added the Amazon image link you mentioned.

Thanks. --MartyD 11:45, 15 June 2013 (UTC)

What Happens Next

I accepted your addition of What Happens Next, but had to make some changes:

  • I deleted the various "(introduction to the story)" entries and replaced with a note stating introductions precede each story. We don't normally list individual story introductions in anthologies unless there is something significant about them. If listed, they would be titled under the story name, not made-up titles such as these.
  • I deleted the "About the Authors". We don't normally list these unless significant.
  • I renamed "Introduction" to "Introduction (What Happens Next)". As there are so many generic titles such as this, we disambiguate them with the name of the publication.
  • I separated out the interior art into separate records. We don't combine stories and art in the same record.
  • I deleted the story listing from the synopsis as they are contained in the publication.

Thanks. -- JLaTondre (talk) 23:43, 29 April 2014 (UTC)

Publication series

I have been removing the data you've been entereing into the publication series and publication series number fields. Please read this help page which gives the ISFDB definition of a publication series and how to enter them into a publication record. Thanks. Mhhutchins 03:31, 1 May 2014 (UTC)

Red Devil

As I previously stated, author and artist credits are not combined. You should be adding a separate INTERIORART record to the pub for the artwork, not combing it with the author's name. I have fixed Red Devil for you. In addition, I made the following changes:

  • Corrected the spelling of the publisher
  • Added the image from Amazon
  • I removed the pub series you entered and moved it to the title records. The ISFDB differentiates publisher series (publisher level series like Ballantine Adult Fantasy) from title series (universe or groupings of books independent of publisher like Dune Universe) Unfortunately, you cannot enter Title Series information when you submit a new publication. You have to wait until the submission is accepted, then go back and edit the newly-created title record to add the series information. See Help:How to work with series for more details.

Thanks. -- JLaTondre (talk) 12:06, 4 May 2014 (UTC)

Dancing in the Moonlight comment and question (also Summerhill)

Hi Fred. I have a comment and a question about Dancing in the Moonlight.

  • The comment: Titles and subtitles should be entered with a colon separating them, not as two sentences. I changed "Dancing in the Moonlight. RainFurrest 2013 Charity Anthology." to "Dancing in the Moonlight: RainFurrest 2013 Charity Anthology".
  • The question: I don't follow the publisher series "rainfurrest03" and #681 in that series. Where did you get that? It looks to me like FurPlanet considers "rainfurrest03" to be the item number, and that book is the only one that comes up when searching for "rainfurrest03".

Thanks. --MartyD 11:24, 11 May 2014 (UTC)

I have a similar question about the "frane01HC" series and #615 on Summerhill. The Argyll Productions site uses frane01HC as the item number, and I can't find anything else tagged with it. Thanks. --MartyD 11:32, 11 May 2014 (UTC)
Having not heard anything, I removed the series information from these two publications. Thanks. --MartyD 12:20, 31 May 2014 (UTC)

Dragonbreath series

Hi. The Dragonbreath series is a title series, not a publisher series. It looks like this type of situation has been brought to your attention before. You have to wait on the submission's being accepted, then put the title into the appropriate series. Don't include title series information in the Pub Series field(s) when you add a new publication. I fixed the two Dragonbreath installments. Thanks. --MartyD 10:43, 12 May 2014 (UTC)


Please confirm the price and page count of this publication. According to Amazon, the price is $12.00 and the page count is 470. Thanks for checking. Mhhutchins|talk 19:18, 28 September 2015 (UTC)

Publication series, again

You continue to enter the title series data into the publication series after the difference has been explained to you several times. In fact, you're putting the same data in the title series field as the publication series. They are not the same and can never be both. In the future, please do not enter anything into the publication series field.

You also need to answer some of the questions that have been asked of you on this talk page. Mhhutchins|talk 05:23, 30 September 2015 (UTC)

Again, please do not enter any data into the Publication Series field as it is clear that you fail to understand its purpose. If you wish to learn the purpose of the field, please read this help page. Mhhutchins|talk 16:12, 2 October 2015 (UTC)

The Book of Lapism

Hello, I changed the date to January 2015 (as Amazon's look inside states that month of publication) and the name of the cover artist to Michael Day (assuming a typo). Thanks, Stonecreek 18:38, 1 October 2015 (UTC)

Submissions placed on hold

I've placed your submissions on hold until you can confirm that you've read the messages on this talk page. This is my only option since you haven't provided us with an email address. It is important to read the messages because you continue to make the same errors after they've been brought to your attention on this talk page. Your cooperation would be much appreciated. 19:43, 2 October 2015 (UTC)

Cats and More Cats

Hi Fred. Congratulations on a new anthology. I approved Cats and More Cats but:

  • Please double-check the ISBN. The one you provided has a bad checksum.
  • Can we credit you as the source for the Donovan Howard artist credit? For example, we could add a publication note with "The cover artist is credited as "Donovan". The source for the Donovan Howard credit used on this publication record is Fred Patten."
  • I added the cover image from Amazon.
  • You entered publication series of "FurPlanet 836". Is this stated in the book? The puzzle is this while we have a number of FurPlanet books listed in ISFDB your is the first one in a publication series. If your book is numbered 836 then where is the number? We can add a note about that so that others can track down the series number. Note if the number is the publisher's web site item number, such as for your book, then we don't enter that on ISFDB unless the book itself says "FurPlanet #836".

--Marc Kupper|talk 04:58, 27 March 2016 (UTC)

I realized I could get the ISBN from Amazon and so fixed the record. You had 1-978-61450-297-5 but it should have been 978-1-61450-297-5. --Marc Kupper|talk 05:05, 27 March 2016 (UTC)

Gods with Fur; And Feathers, Scales, ...

Hello, I've approved your submission but made a few changes: 1) slightly "deblurbed" synopsis, 2) uploaded scan, 3) deleted "Pub Series #" (there was no Pub series given), 4) deleted two of the About the ..." that seemed not really significant (see the Help pages, note that this point is already explained above, 5) dismabiguated the introduction and the (significant in term of length) About the Authors, 6) varianted Jefferson Swycaffer's text. Result is here. Hauck 09:25, 14 July 2016 (UTC)

Linking reviews

Hello, please note that the unlinked reviews in your recent addition will either have to: 1) be linked to existing titles in the db (like this one, 2) be linked to titles that you'll purposely create, 3) transformed into ESSAYs (like this one). Hauck 07:28, 27 December 2016 (UTC)

As these unliked reviews clutter the db and shows on our cleanup reports, I'm going to delete them without action from you. Hauck 10:02, 29 December 2016 (UTC)
Done. Hauck 12:11, 30 December 2016 (UTC)
I see that you've recreated the REVIEWS records that I've deleted as they were unlinked and unattended (despite the advice given to you). If they're not corrected soon, I'm going to delete them again. Hauck 08:03, 18 June 2017 (UTC)
Deleted again. Not responding and trying to bypass moderator's actions is not IMHO the proper way to contribute to the ISFDB. Hauck 08:18, 19 June 2017 (UTC)

Symbol of a Nation

Hello, I've approved your submission but had to make some changes to conform to our standards (note that most of these were already explained to you before, so please take our remarks into account for your next submissions):

  • deleted the About the XXX essays.
  • disambiguated introduction.
  • simplified number of pages.
  • uploaded and resized a scan.

The result is here Note also that, on a more general topic, I'm not convinced that stories of anthropomorphic animals are systematically to be included in the db. Hauck 09:39, 17 June 2017 (UTC)


In your verified publication Allasso, Volume 3: Storge, you have the publisher listed as "Pink Fox Publications & CreateSpace." However, CreateSpace isn't a publisher, but rather a printing and production service (a subsidiary of Amazon, which is probably why they insist on naming it in the "publisher" space on their pages). So we don't list it as a publisher here. That's been discussed on the boards here and here. Therefore, I'd like to change the publisher of Storge to just Pink Fox Publications. And if there is no publisher listed (as in Thousand Tales: How We Won the Game) I will leave a blank space. --Vasha 17:54, 23 June 2017 (EDT)

Dogs of War II

Hi. I accepted your Dogs of War II submission. I added the image URL as you requested. I also fixed the ISBN (was missing a "1") and modified the generic/standard titles like "Introduction" to include the book's title for disambiguation. Please review when you get a chance. Thanks. --MartyD 07:30, 6 March 2018 (EST)

The Dorset Squirrels

Hello, in your submission, you gave the author as "Micael Tod ", I suppose that it's "Michael Tod". Also note that, when entering an omnibus, you should also enter the contents. I've done this for you. Hauck 04:01, 16 March 2018 (EDT)

What the Fox?! typo

I believe there is a typo in one of the titles, Oh! What s Night! If it is actually printed that way in the book, it should be kept in the database but you should make a note of that fact in the publication record. --Vasha 02:11, 18 March 2018 (EDT)

Kevin Tweedell vs Kevin Tweddell

Hi, your verified copy of The Dorset Squirrels contains a cover by a certain Kevin Tweedell. I think however that it should be Kevin Tweddell, who also did an edition of the cover The Second Wave of this trilogy, which you can see here.--Dirk P Broer 20:24, 5 April 2018 (EDT)

What the Fox?!

Hi, I've imported content for your verified copy of What the Fox?!. Please check paging and interior art you mentioned in your notes.--Dirk P Broer 16:16, 24 May 2018 (EDT)

ROAR, Volume 6

Hello, without you being around right now, I removed the 'Scoundrel' from the title of this, as neither publication per amazon has that shown anywhere. Hope that was right. Thanks, Stonecreek 14:18, 1 November 2018 (EDT)

Allasso, Volume 3: Storge


The publisher of your verified Allasso, Volume 3: Storge was changed from "Pink Fox Publications & CreateSpace" to "Pink Fox Publications" based on the way we handle CreateSpace :) Annie 18:06, 20 June 2019 (EDT)