ISFDB:Research Assistance/Archive 10

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This is an archive page for the Research Assistance page. Please do not edit the contents. To start a new discussion, please click here.
This archive includes discussions from January 2019 - December 2020.
Unlike earlier archives, this page will contain requests/issues which have not been resolved. Please do not respond to requests on this page or add new requests to this page. If you're able to respond to any of these requests/issues, please post it on the talk page of the editor who made the original request. If the editor is no longer active, you can post a response on the ISFDB:Community Portal.

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Twenty and Three Stories, Thornton Butterworth edition

I have verified the Appleton edition (US) of Twenty and Three Stories by Twenty and Three Authors. The Thornton Butterworth edition (UK) was entered by somebody else (Bluesman, on the basis of Tuck? anyway, probably not from a primary source). I notice that there are some differences between the records -- not just the different order of stories, but also differences in credits, for example "Lemuel De Bra" versus "L. De Bra," "Robert S. Hichens" versus "Robert Hichens," "Arthur Conan Doyle" versus "A. Conan Doyle." Furthermore, although Doyle's story appears as "Captain Sharkey" in the table of contents, it is "How the Governor of Saint Kitt's Came Home" at the head of the story. I hope someone can get hold of a copy of the Thornton Butterworth edition and carefully check the titles and authors. --Vasha (cazadora de tildes) 22:29, 4 January 2019 (EST)

Frankenstein and Foreign Devils - Walter Jon WIlliams (1st Edition, Trade)

I just finished reading my copy of this work (#449, signed) and noticed that the table of contents order does not match the actual content order:

Erogenoscape [listed as starting on page 225, actual start page 263]
Foreign Devils [listed as starting on page 263, actual start page 289]
Bag Lady [listed as starting on page 289, actual start page 225]

The remaining content/start pages are correct as is the total number of pages.

Since this is a verified edition, I'm at a bit of a loss as to how to proceed. Request a reverification and a note added? or what?

regards - d —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Dsorgen (talkcontribs) 21:32, 21 January 2019.

This is a pretty late response, but just noticed this. I assume you are talking about this pub? If so, both verifiers are not active. If you are confident you have the same version, go ahead and correct the page numbers and verify it. -- JLaTondre (talk) 20:40, 24 April 2019 (EDT)

The Science Fiction Book

Re this book - a recent post on Twitter brought my attention to this image:


As "Satellite of Extraterrestrial Civilization by Andrey Sokolov"

It's been modified (redrawn perhaps) and had additions but defuinatly the same base image.

It is viable to put Sokolov as covert artist or merely make a note about it ? --Mavmaramis 14:46, 24 April 2019 (EDT)

I would just make a note of it. It's quite possible for another artist to have redrawn it as that's not unknown for publishers to have done. -- JLaTondre (talk) 20:34, 24 April 2019 (EDT)
Also, the cover of Franz Rottensteiner's book has a number of additional elements: note the monster at the bottom of the picture, a spaceship up top and the nebulae in the two right corners. Ahasuerus 11:03, 25 April 2019 (EDT)

The Embedding

This publication references an ilustration on page 63 of this book.

However the illustration in the latter is this image [2]

Patently different from the cover art on Watson's book, albeit by the same artist.

Would someone mind editing that please ? --Mavmaramis 14:13, 28 April 2019 (EDT)

Variant removed. Thanks for finding this one! Bob 12:54, 29 April 2019 (EDT)

Guide to Extraterrestrials

this edition note states "Stated 2nd Edition, 5th printing"

this edition note states "Fifth Printing per the number line of the 1987 Second Edition"

Which seems like they are the same edition.

Any danger of someone concatinating them ?

--Mavmaramis 15:40, 5 July 2019 (EDT)

I'm not sure what you are asking. One is a tp and one is a hc. They have different ISBNs. -- JLaTondre (talk) 17:31, 5 July 2019 (EDT)
Also, there's no need to ask the same question in two different spots. Just pick one and someone will answer. ···日本穣 · 投稿 · Talk to Nihonjoe 13:44, 9 July 2019 (EDT)
Didn't spot they were 'tp' and 'hc' as for asking the same question in two places it looked to me like it was deleted from that message thread. --Mavmaramis 12:30, 10 July 2019 (EDT)

Infinite Worlds magazine cover

I am the editor of Infinite Worlds Science Fiction Magazine and I am attempting to verify that the cover art I uploaded is indeed mine, I am the owner of the copyright (2019) and I give permission to display it on the Infinite Worlds entry. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by InfiniteWorlds (talkcontribs) . 20:12, 20 July 2019 (EDT)

The Moons of Jupiter

I have a copy of this book which looks for all the world to be identical to this right down to the copyright page prtining history ceasing at "Reprinted March 1975" merely rebound with the Peter Elson cover and 90p price. The PV1 for tge former is no longer active there isn't anyone to check a physical copy to see if it does indeed state "Reprinted June 1980". My copy seems to be an anomoly. Over to you experts --Mavmaramis 13:28, 17 September 2019 (EDT)

See this record verified by Bluesman. It seems to match your edition (no 1980 reprint statement, same cover, same price). -- JLaTondre (talk) 09:20, 29 September 2019 (EDT)
Thank you. --Mavmaramis 12:38, 29 September 2019 (EDT)

Wrong Nebula Award year

Noobie here. Not sure if I'm in the right place.

Information on ISFDB: Nebula Award 1974

on Nebula site: Nebula Best Novelette 1973

Unsure of how to proceed. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Darkstar1951 (talkcontribs) .

Welcome to ISFDB. It comes down to presentation - our years show the year the awards are given in (see the full list, the official site is now using the year the works are written in). Changing them wholesale is doable but we do need to have a lot bigger discussion if we want to. Plus other online lists also use the old way (year the award is given in). Annie 14:35, 26 September 2019 (EDT)
Maybe we'll need to add form fields to capture "Award issued in YEAR1 for works published between YYYYMMDD and YYYYMMDD". That would work for any award, and give useful information, too (especially for awards like the Dragon Award where the dates are halfway through the calendar year). ···日本穣 · 投稿 · Talk to Nihonjoe 13:27, 28 September 2019 (EDT)
Annie is correct as to how the year field is noted in the help file. That being said, there are a few awards that we have entered by eligibility year (e.g. the Tiptree. I'd rather we didn't add eligibility dates fields to each individual award record. Instead I'd propose that we have an Award Year/Eligibility year switch at the Award Type record, as we do with Poll and Covers More Than SF switches. Oddballs like the Dragon, or the early Imaginaire can probably be handled in the notes. --Ron ~ RtraceTalk 09:11, 29 September 2019 (EDT)

Southern Exploration

For Southern Exploration, we have the true author as Brian Holloway. However, SFE has the author as A. L. Woolf. Our record has no source. Anybody know anything about this before I switch it to match SFE3? -- JLaTondre (talk) 18:43, 6 November 2019 (EST)

The SF doesn't really have any sources, either. I wonder if someone like David Langford (very knowledgeable guy in the UK) would know. I'll ask him to look at this. ···日本穣 · 投稿 · Talk to Nihonjoe 20:05, 6 November 2019 (EST)
I also asked another UK fannish person I know. Hopefully, one of them can point us in the right direction. ···日本穣 · 投稿 · Talk to Nihonjoe 20:10, 6 November 2019 (EST)
David Langford is one of the SFE's editors. He and Stephen Holland are credited (the "[SH/DRL]" initials) as the authors of that entry. ;-) Thanks for asking. Always good to get confirmation. -- JLaTondre (talk) 20:32, 6 November 2019 (EST)
David verified the information, citing a correction sent in by someone who was "in the know". We should change our listing to match SFE. ···日本穣 · 投稿 · Talk to Nihonjoe 13:10, 7 November 2019 (EST)
Change made. Thanks! -- JLaTondre (talk) 20:55, 7 November 2019 (EST)

cover artist error

Council of Fire by Eric Flint & Walter H. Hunt - 2019 Baen Books : Data base shows Tom Kidd as artist.

This cover picture is found on the David Seeley website at [3] —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Aardvark7 (talkcontribs) .

The book in question. According to the notes, the credit is printed in the book. I will ask the verifier to stop by and check again. Thanks for reporting this. Annie 14:09, 12 November 2019 (EST)
I don't have the book, but that is definitely Seeley's style. I don't think I've seen any photo manipulation work by Kidd. ···日本穣 · 投稿 · Talk to Nihonjoe 19:28, 12 November 2019 (EST)
Cover art credit changed. Nice catch, thank you. Bob 19:32, 12 November 2019 (EST)
Nihonjoe, I agree, this is not Kidd. But it is a verified book from an active PV with a note implying credit from the book itself? We can wait a few hours/days for them to check and correct the note and find out who copied a name wrong and where. Because of the credit WAS Kidd in both places in the book, we are in the "in error" conditions and we need to record that way and do some varianting to adjust. :) Record by the book, right? :)
Thanks for updating that, Bob! One less error in the DB. :) Annie 19:44, 12 November 2019 (EST)
I wasn't saying it should be changed based on my observation. Just sharing my observation. :) ···日本穣 · 投稿 · Talk to Nihonjoe 20:05, 12 November 2019 (EST)
With all the "I am not notifying PVs in any way or form when I change something in their books" going on lately, I may have reacted a bit too sharply on principle. Sorry - I was not implying that you did but it can be read that way - it was certainly not intentional. Annie 20:09, 12 November 2019 (EST)
:) ···日本穣 · 投稿 · Talk to Nihonjoe 20:29, 12 November 2019 (EST)

Degler! Fanzine: Editor with access to Libraries Australia?

I am working on moving our NLA links to their new home in the external IDs and stumbled on a set of links that seems to be sending me into the "logged in" section of the library and I cannot figure out if this record exists at all these days (the ID does not work on the public interface and no search string had managed to find anything related) or if it is just dead or it got migrated somewhere.

One of the records is this one - they all point to the same NLA ID so I suspect it is just a generic record for the whole run.

Do we have anyone with access in the system who can check the link and see if it leads somewhere after you login? Thanks in advance! Annie 12:00, 6 December 2019 (EST)

An Alien Land: Kirinyaga series?

Hi, it seems strange that the collection An Alien Land is attached to the Kirinyaga series ( or, but the included short stories are not (not even one). If not linked (I cannot check, I have the Kirinyaga book but not the An Alien Land one), the collection itself should be unattached too, right? Anybody knows or can check? --- Gilr 08:15, 11 January 2020 (EST)

I removed the series from the collection. SFE3 states "Some of the Kirinyaga material also appears in An Alien Land (coll 1997), where other stories based on the African model, like Bully! (1990 chap), are also assembled." So seems some of the individual stories are part of the series (which is we don't have marked currently, but need to know which ones) but the collection as a whole is not. -- JLaTondre (talk) 10:37, 12 January 2020 (EST)

Julian Jay Savarin Lemmus triology

Re this series

Various internet sources and sites (twitter, pinterest, 70sscifiart tumblr) all point to the artist for this trilogy being Joe Petagno. These are stylistically like other images he has done for speculative fiction books - BUT - I can't pin down where the sites derived that credit from.

Any thoughts ? --Mavmaramis 14:48, 10 February 2020 (EST)

The illustration for #1 and #2 is on page 35 of Holdstock's Encyclopedia of Science Fiction. Looks like you own a copy. --Willem 16:21, 10 February 2020 (EST)
Thanks Willem. Couldn't recall where this image was featured so I will check. --Mavmaramis 16:09, 11 February 2020 (EST)

Doug Chiang Robotoa

I picked up a copy of this this book, however mine is this version.

Differences are: 1. Text is entirely in French 2. ISBN is 0-8118-4347-5 3. Has an "Introduction" on page 4 as oposed to a Foreward by Doug Chiang 4. Divided into 11 chapters 4. Nas no number line 5. Cover has "Seuil Chronicle"

According to World CatSeuil Chronicle is the publisher but ISBN search (linked above) gives publisher as "Chronicle Books Llc"

Anyone advise please ?--Mavmaramis 10:43, 14 February 2020 (EST)

What is the publisher in the book besides the cover? From what I see in Noosfere, it looks like a double publisher to me (they have Seuil / Chronicle). BNF confirms the double publisher "[Paris] : Seuil ; [San Francisco] : Chronicle, DL 2003". So either pick one as the publisher and add the other in the notes or make a publisher from the two together (I really do not like this practice...) and when we get the multiple publishers per record, we will fix that and have both... Annie 13:27, 14 February 2020 (EST)
Thank you Annie. I'll "add new chapbook" in that case. --Mavmaramis 21:20, 14 February 2020 (EST)

Worlds of If, A Retrospective Anthology: ISBNs for hardcover & trade paper versions

I've PV'd both versions of this book: The copyright pages are identical, so both have "ISBN: 0-312-94471-3 (paperback), 0-312-94472-1 (hardcover)". I believe that copyright notice is a typo, the ISBNs are switched. Evidence: - the trade paper version has the 94472-1 ISBN on its back cover - the hardcover version has the 94471-3 ISBN on its jacket back AND on jacket front flap - In the HomeBase 3 utility that's used to add books to ABE, the "ISBN Lookup" function finds the hardcover for 94471-3, and the softcover for 94472-1

Worldcat doesn't note the binding for either ISBN. Is there any other source to check? If we agree the copyright pages have it backwards, I'll edit both listings. Thanks. Markwood 06:14, 18 February 2020 (EST)

I would note what you have observed and treat what you see on the covers (note that's two different "sources") as correct and what's on the copyright page as a typo. One other minor clue: the first issued would probably have the lower ISBN, and hc tends to have priority over pb.... FWIW, this site notes the copyright page has the numbers switched. --MartyD 20:19, 19 February 2020 (EST)
I don't know how reliable it is, but this site gives hardcover for the 1-3 ISBN. --MartyD 20:22, 19 February 2020 (EST)
OK. I'll submit the edit today. Thanks for the info & guidance, Marty. Markwood 10:08, 20 February 2020 (EST)

Anthropolgy Through Science Fiction

I discovered the art for the coverer of this book to be the work of M.C. Escher referenced (amongst other wesite sources) ere As I am not cpmpetant with HTML codeing for adding links into the notes I'm merely going to add the cover artist and a note regarding the title of the piece but would be most appreciative if someone better clued-in to the nuances of HTML to add a note to the entry linking to the site above. --Mavmaramis 13:58, 13 April 2020 (EDT)

Done. Tweaked the wording a bit in order to add the link. Feel free to change or let me know what you want it to be if you have a different preference. -- JLaTondre (talk) 14:22, 13 April 2020 (EDT)
It's fine. Thank you JLaTondre. --Mavmaramis 16:48, 13 April 2020 (EDT)

William Causett's "Pirates in Space"

We have William Causett as an alternate name for Erroll Collins. However, SFE3 states "Causett has sometimes been identified as a pseudonym of the woman who wrote as Erroll Collins, but stylistic evidence suggests otherwise." Anybody have information to shed on this? Or should we break the alternate name and add that note Causett's summary page. Thanks. -- JLaTondre (talk) 11:03, 16 April 2020 (EDT)

I have broken the alternate name & added the SFE3 information to the author's summary page. -- JLaTondre (talk) 10:48, 19 April 2020 (EDT)

The Bowman Test

Discovered via messages on Twitter that the cover art for this is Dean Ellis. Identical to this. I've notified the PVs and made the edit. Is linking to the Candy Man version automatic ? --Mavmaramis 10:41, 18 April 2020 (EDT)

Those two image are similar, but not the same. The figure & backgrounds are different. As such, we would not variant them to each other. Is the ID based on other information than they look the same? -- JLaTondre (talk) 11:09, 18 April 2020 (EDT)
I'll make further enquiries on this matter with the chap on Twitter and let you know. --Mavmaramis 04:28, 19 April 2020 (EDT)
Response fron the chap on Twitter thus "The figure is very similar in style. The same form, the same style of leg details, etc. i.e. the same artist. It's clearly Ellis even if they want additional proof." Perhaps a note to state the art is "possibly by Ellis" or something --Mavmaramis 09:22, 19 April 2020 (EDT)
That's a pretty standard human form & there are differences between the two (including in the legs). Doesn't seem definitive enough to credit Ellis based on comparison alone. I have added a note to the pub stating that it could be Ellis based on the similarity. -- JLaTondre (talk) 10:43, 19 April 2020 (EDT)
Thank you. All of this was in response to a request from somone on Twitter who isn't a member of ISFDB. I told him that a note might probably be the best outcome to hope for so I appreciate you doing so. --Mavmaramis 22:17, 19 April 2020 (EDT)

Creatures of Light and Darkness

Hi, I always thought that the novel Creatures of Light and Darkness was also released as three parts: Creatures of Light, The Steel General (which contains a note "Note: Separately published section of 'Creatures of Light and Darkness'") and Creatures of Darkness (in If then Galaxy). But the serialization parts are not listed in the novel page. Or is it a fix-up? If so, it may be a note in the novel page. Or I'm totally wrong? Thanks! --Gilr 10:17, 19 April 2020 (EDT)

Analog March 1978

This issue includes a short story "To Keep and Bear Arms". Content page credits Larry Matthews; Story title page credits Jeff Matthews.I'm wondering how Larry Matthews was determined to be the actual name of the author? Shouldn't there be a reference to the discrepancy in notes?

If so, you're right! It seems that this content was entered using just the table of contents. Unfortunately, there's only one of the PVs active right now. Would you like to ask Rkihara about the matter (or shall I do this for you)? And do you have any idea what '(1970s)' might mean? Stonecreek 14:05, 29 April 2020 (EDT)
Not much experience here so not sure of the process. I have scans of the two pages if they're required. So I'm OK with some help from you. No mention of "1970s" in the story or on the content page.
Since Rkihara is only sporadically available, and you seem to own a copy of the issue in question, the easiest way seems to be that you also PV that issue, and I do the necessary changes: we do credit by the shortfiction's title page (or heading), not by the ToC, so the entry seems to have to be changed accordingly. If you'd like to try this on your own, I can give you advice on the way. Stonecreek 00:10, 30 April 2020 (EDT)

Yes, would like to attempt it (PV?). Be aware, I only have limited time today. I'll be off work tomorrow with more time available. Thank You. Looks like I figured out the signature.(Darkstar1951 14:03, 30 April 2020 (EDT))

Great! Sorry, for the cryptic PV: it means to primary verify a publication (using one copy of it that you own or have unlimited access to). This is done using the link displayed on the left side. The next step is to change the entry: delete '(1970s)' and change the author's name.
Then there's a crucial decision to be made: is 'Jeff Matthews' a new author, or is it a pseudonym / alternate name for Larry Matthews? Depending on the decision we have to decide if there's a pseudonym to be established or not. Stonecreek 00:56, 1 May 2020 (EDT)

Jeff Matthews and Larry Matthews are such common names, I imagine trying to determine the correct one to use must be a challenge. I've tried to determine the author with no success. If it helps determine the author, the story makes a clever case for gun control. On another note, the web site for Larry Matthews (US) links to a "Looks Like This Domain Isn't Connected To A Website Yet!" message. Darkstar1951 11:08, 1 May 2020 (EDT)

Sorry, what I meant is if there's some note on the author within the magazine which might help to clarify the identity - if there's nothing it might be better to keep the two apart.
One remark: please add a 'note to the moderator' into the corresponding field on submitting: it helps the person dealing with it to decide, and it is mandatory when updating publications that are primary verified by other persons than yourself. Thanks, Stonecreek 00:01, 2 May 2020 (EDT)

Done Darkstar1951 14:10, 4 May 2020 (EDT)

Analog March 2, 1981

Review by Spider Robinson of 'The Search for Life on Mars' lists its author as "Henry S. F. Cooper", not "Henry S. F. Cooper Jr." as listed in the dB. I'm not sure what, if any, changes should be made. I have a copy of the magazine. Darkstar1951 14:06, 6 May 2020 (EDT)

See this. A note should be added to note that but creating a brand new pseudonym for such cases is not something we usually do.
In addition, this is one of the books that should not have been added at all (it is not eligible) and this review needs to be converted to an essay. We have a discussion going on on the topic deciding what to do with these books but in the meanwhile, feel free to add a note. Annie 14:10, 6 May 2020 (EDT)

Pig World

Regarding this publication. A review on thr US Amazon site here states: cover illustration by Ron Walotsky. I can find nothing to substantiate such a claim. It isn't depicted in Inner Visions nor can I find it scrolling through many pages of RW art via Google search. Thoughts anyone ? --Mavmaramis 08:14, 4 June 2020 (EDT)

I couldn't find any independent corroboration (I did find a couple of additional references, but they all seem to have the same source). I'd be inclined to add that information to the pub notes but not give an official credit. --MartyD 08:41, 6 June 2020 (EDT)

Jennifer Colgan

Jennifer Colgan is currently listed as an alternate name for Jenny T. Colgan. However, SFE3 states[4] that Jennifer Colgan should not be confused with Jenny Colgan. I'm not seeing any of the Jennifer Colgan books listed on Jenny T. Colgan's website. The Amazon author page for Jennifer Colgan is different than that of Jenny T. Colgan's. There is a separate website[5] for Jennifer Colgan. It would seem these are different authors. Does anybody have information to indicate these two should not be split apart? -- JLaTondre (talk) 22:34, 22 June 2020 (EDT)

Definitely different authors. I remember looking at them a few years ago and realizing that they were indeed different and leaving them alone. Not sure when we managed to merge them. Annie 23:15, 22 June 2020 (EDT)
I split them apart. Thanks. -- JLaTondre (talk) 16:57, 23 June 2020 (EDT)
I just added notes to both authors - maybe this will stop someone from pseudonyming them again based on the name only. Annie 17:01, 23 June 2020 (EDT)
Sounds good. I was hoping that both having SFE3 & author website links (plus adding the Bernadette Gardner alternate name) would be sufficient, but doesn't hurt to be careful. -- JLaTondre (talk) 17:39, 23 June 2020 (EDT)

Pirates of Venus

Anyone know ehere the cover art credit for this publication came from. It isn't stated anywhere and the PV for that edition was a transient copy. --Mavmaramis 14:21, 19 July 2020 (EDT)

There's an attribution (and thanks) on this page under non-USA covers. ../Doug H 17:15, 19 July 2020 (EDT)
Thanks. --Mavmaramis 03:56, 20 July 2020 (EDT)

Fritz Leiber - The Wanderer

I have something of a mystery which I'm hoping someomne may be able to shed some light on.

Someone pointed me to this TOR edition of The Wanderer - cover artist Ron Walotsky.

Adveritised for sale here wherein the ISBN is listed as 1585860492. A search for that ISBN brings up this ebook version.

The TOR edition shown isn't listed on ISFDB either and the the only TOR edition listed is a SFBC version here with a different Ron Walotsky cover. --Mavmaramis 01:57, 24 July 2020 (EDT)

Could it be the 1986 Tor edition (the second Tor printing)? We only have data from Locus1 and no cover image. --Willem 16:38, 24 July 2020 (EDT)
That was my guess at a later point. --Mavmaramis 15:15, 25 July 2020 (EDT)

The Turning Place

The spaceship on the cover of this book is the same spaceship that graces the cover of this book and is, thus, by Angus Mckie. Although the rest of the image isn't by him. I've notified the PV (Don Erikson) --Mavmaramis 13:34, 29 July 2020 (EDT)

Logan's Run

A posting on the LOGAN'S RUN FAN CLUB Facebook page makes reference to "the movie tie in is missing the last “0” chapter" This excision isn't mentioned on any publication record for the book although I can confirm that this edition does have it. --Mavmaramis 09:17, 30 July 2020 (EDT)

My copy of the movie tie-in edition does not have the 0th chapter. TAWeiss 08:30, 19 August 2020 (EDT)

Author: Philip Robinson

I was gonna add my edition of Masque of a Savage Mandarin [6] when I noticed that the author Philip Bedford Robinson possibly have been combined with another Philip Robinson. Its pretty hard to find much information about them, the best I've found is from SFE [7], which states that the two is not to be mixed up. Masque of a Savage Mandarin seems to be a comedy, while the listed short fiction seems to be pure horror and also published 10 years after Bedfords, according to SFE, supposed death. --Spacecow 17:27, 22 September 2020 (EDT)

Fixed. Thanks for reporting it :) We record authors by name (and not by ID) so when two of them share a name, we need to separate manually by changing the name in each title when the main one is not used. Annie 19:15, 22 September 2020 (EDT)
Very cool. I'll go ahead and add the paperback edition then. --Spacecow 04:29, 23 September 2020 (EDT)

Darkness at Noon by Arthur Koestler

I was about to add my edition of Darkness at Noon when I was greeted with "DO NOT ADD PUBLICATIONS" in the synopsis. Huh, I thought, why is that? Then I realised the book itself is classified as non-genre here at isfdb (and not having read it myself I don't feel I am in a position to argue with that), even though you for example list it for having been nominated for the Prometheus Hall Of Fame. Anyway, I took a quick look in the documentation over non-genre and got the feeling that was the reason publications were not allowed. Is that the case for all non-genre works? No. After looking at 5-10 other, random, non-genre works and all of them having listed publications, I don't think that is the reason. So, what is the reason? I am sure there have been a heated discussion over this book leading to the "DO NOT ADD PUBLICATIONS" treatment and would like to read it. Is possible to provide a link to the underlying discussion when works get special treatment like this? --Spacecow 04:13, 25 September 2020 (EDT)

It's just that we don't index stand-alone nongenre works by authors that aren't 'above the threshold' (to be considered as genre authors), and that Koestler seems to be out of scope for this reason, see our project scope, especially the passage on works that are excluded. Hope that helps. Stonecreek 06:15, 25 September 2020 (EDT)
Sounds fair. I'm ok with someone else taking all these decisions about genre for me. Now, is there anything on the author page that tells me the author is not considered a genre author? --Spacecow 15:24, 25 September 2020 (EDT)
Not really but a low number of works overall is a good indication in most cases. If you are not familiar with the author, glance at Wikipedia - the genre authors will have the genres mentioned in the first paragraph more often than not. The "threshold" is very subjective so think of "Will I consider this author a genre one?" and if the answer is no, just skip any non-genre books. The rule is meant for authors like Asimov (and making sure we do not index everything by Twain) for example and the less we use it, the better we are IMO. Annie 15:49, 25 September 2020 (EDT)
So, if I try to add a publication to one of Mark Twain's non-genre work, you will decline it? --Spacecow 03:02, 26 September 2020 (EDT)
Yes. Or if it gets approved (it happens), it may be deleted at any time in the future. We are a speculative fiction DB :) Annie 03:13, 26 September 2020 (EDT)
It just seems so random. Couldn't you flag an author as non-genre once a moderator has made the decision and display that decision and motivation (with place for discussion?) to your users? And once an author is made non-genre, it would be an easy step to disable uploads of publications to non-genre works altogether. I'm sitting with this book in my hand [8] and can't find an entry for it on Capek's page, which seems weird. I am just going to assume it has been rejected at some point, cause I hate to spend 30 min digging up information on it just to have it rejected. Additional idea: a section with rejected works (with motivation) for these on-the-border genre-authors I think would be really interesting. --Spacecow 05:32, 26 September 2020 (EDT)
It is the other way around really - we add non-genre books from above threshold authors as opposed to just ignoring them for non-genre authors. So if you are a genre author with 3 books that does not mean that your first non-genre book will be eligible - unless whoever adds and moderates interprets the rule that way. So it is usually a safe bet not to add any non-genre books. The problem with adding a marker is that everyone has their own interpretation of the threshold. If you are not sure, post on the Moderator board before posting the book and you will get some opinions... Annie 17:53, 27 September 2020 (EDT)
We have repeatedly tried to come up with an exact definition of the "certain threshold" mentioned by ISFDB:Policy and we have repeatedly failed :-( A number of different criteria have been proposed, but each one led to exceptions and exceptions to exceptions. For example, if we use e.g. "ratio of genre to non-genre works" as the decisive criterion, should we assign equal weight to novels, short stories and poems?
That being said, we do have a feature request to "Add a 'non-genre' field to Author records" (FR 860, which, once implemented, should help with standardization. Ahasuerus 18:18, 27 September 2020 (EDT)

W. Scott Peacock & Wilbur S. Peacock

We have W. Scott Peacock who is an editor and Wilbur S. Peacock who is an author. Both records have the same legal name (Peacock, Wilbur Scott) and year of death, but different years of birth. However, in SFE3's entry on Planet Stories, they list the author's birth year as 1915 (vs. the 1911 we have) which would match the editor's record. These would seem to be the same person. The only wrinkle is the PS's Feature Flash article in the Planet Stories, Fall 1942 issue states "Wilbur S. Peacock came into the office the other day, to discuss a new novelette he has slated for the Planet. Since it was the first time we had met him personally...". W. Scott Peacock is credited as the editor of this issue. The implication being they are different people. But this is also the first issue edited by Peacock so the uncredited article writer could actually have been the managing editor or the prior editor and this conversation was from before Peacock took over. Does anyone have more information this? Like what the source was for the editor's biographical information? Thanks. -- JLaTondre (talk) 12:19, 3 October 2020 (EDT)

Gene Wolf - Peace

I spotted that this edition has cover art credited to Gahan Wilson however this edition with the same cover art has it credited to Tony Roberts. Surely the 2nd credit can't be right. --Mavmaramis 01:57, 10 October 2020 (EDT)

Thanks for bringing this to our attention; I merged the two titles - but if you state something about the problem in the note to the moderator, you are allowed to submit a merger on your own :-). Stonecreek 07:15, 5 November 2020 (EST)

The Dancer from Atlantis

I made an inquiry to Bluesman about this one, but no response there, so I'll try here instead.

My edition looks like it could be this one already listed by Bluesman, with this cover[9], however, price is $3.50 - not $2.95 as stated by Locus.
Additional info:

  • Copyright @ 1972 by Poul Anderson
  • First printing, January, 1972
  • 6th printing as by number line, no date of publication
  • It lists The Dark Side (earliest publishing 1987-12 by isfdb) by Zach Hughes for purchase by order, on page just before title page
  • Catalog no: AE5354
  • 10 digit ISBN on spline and back cover
  • Prices: U.S. $3.50, Canada $4.50

--Spacecow 06:48, 5 November 2020 (EST)

The top of Bluesman's page states that he is no longer actively participating and is unlikely to respond to messages left here.
Anyhow, it really seems that yours is the publication in question: Bluesman only verified from secondary sources, and it happens from time to time that those do err, even if Locus is generally more dependable than many others. Stonecreek 07:12, 5 November 2020 (EST)
Agree - if yours says 6th printing, just update it. As it is Locus verified and Locus definitely says $2.95 (link will stop working soonish but should work today), I would add a note to the notes about that. But other from that go and fix it. Annie 12:33, 5 November 2020 (EST)

Harlan Ellison's Watching

Does anyone know if this publication comes in a slipcase (as pictured) or not. Book dealer listings don't mention one. The PV for this version was transient. Notes don't emntion one either. --Mavmaramis 02:58, 5 December 2020 (EST)

It's listed in Chalker/Owings. They list 3 states: 26 copies, lettered A-Z, signed by Ellison and handbound in calfskin with matching slipcase, $125.00 (second state, limited & trade are first); 350 copies, numbered and signed by the author in slipcase, $60.00; 3500 copies trade, $29.95. There is a further point that 33 copies of the limitation sheet for the leatherbound edition were accidentally bound into regular copies of the book. All those copies were caught and sent to Ellison, who scratched out the letters and wrote in "Author's Variant" by hand. Most of these were given and a few sold, by Ellison. They also note that there was a reprint edition in 1989 of an additional 3500 copies which is so marked. That photo appears to appropriate only for the numbered edition which we have listed as 600 copies disagreeing with C/O. We only mention the lettered edition in the notes of the numbered. We don't have the reprint, or the "Author's Variant", though I'm not sure it the latter deserves a separate publication record. --Ron ~ RtraceTalk 07:18, 5 December 2020 (EST)
Alright thanks so liiks like the trade edition at $29.95 did not come with a slipcase. --Mavmaramis 12:44, 5 December 2020 (EST)

Princeps' Fury / Butcher

I'm cloning [10] for a later printing, and noticed the format given doesn't match my copy. Taweis and Holmesd PVed as 'pb', but my copy of later printing, but same price, is a premium/tall rack format. --GlennMcG 17:57, 26 December 2020 (EST)

As both Taweis and Holmesd area active, please post the question to their talk pages. Thanks. -- JLaTondre (talk) 19:23, 26 December 2020 (EST)

Was hoping to kill two birds... --GlennMcG 21:16, 26 December 2020 (EST)

It's best to leave direct messages in such cases as there is no guarantee they will be watching this or other community pages. I will typically post at one person's talk page and then on the other's, leave a link a link to the first with a note asking them to check out that conversation. -- JLaTondre (talk) 08:18, 27 December 2020 (EST)