User talk:Downwarden


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Hello, Downwarden, and welcome to the ISFDB Wiki! I hope you like the place and decide to stay. Here are some pages that you might find helpful:

Note: Image uploading isn't entirely automated. You're uploading the files to the wiki which will then have to be linked to the database by editing the publication record.

Please be careful in editing publications that have been primary verified by other editors. See Help:How to verify data#Making changes to verified pubs. But if you have a copy of an unverified publication, verifying it can be quite helpful. See Help:How to verify data for detailed information.

I hope you enjoy editing here! Please sign your name on talk pages using four tildes (~~~~); this will insert your name and the date. If you need help, check out the community portal, or ask me on my talk page. Again, welcome! --MartyD 10:41, 29 October 2013 (UTC)

Diverse Tales

Hi, and welcome. I accepted your submission of Diverse Tales and made a few minor changes so that the entry would conform to ISFDB standards (notably: I swapped around the publisher credits, and switched the cover image link to one from Amazon, to which we have permission to make links). While researching, I found the contents listed in Amazon's Look Inside, so I added them. Please review and make any changes you deem appropriate. Thanks, and thanks for contributing. --MartyD 10:57, 29 October 2013 (UTC)

I imported the contents from this into your new hc edition. Since the page count was different, I did not take the page numbers. It would be great if you would provide them. Thanks. --MartyD 02:48, 31 October 2013 (UTC)

Red Wet Dirt

Hi again. I accepted Red Wet Dirt and made some similar changes and additions. If you could help with the imprint / publisher, that would be great. I couldn't figure out how to interpret what's there. Thanks. --MartyD 11:11, 29 October 2013 (UTC)

Latest submissions

I'm holding your last series of submissions and will eventually accept them. It seems you're consistently making the same errors in most of them which I will list here and ask that you keep these in mind when making future submissions. Almost all of the corrections I'll be making are explained on this help page. I will link to the specific sections below.

  • Title field: Do not give an alternate title in the field. (As in the case of Tattered.) You must give the title as it appears on the book's title page, and nowhere else. If the work has been published under a different title, you can variant its title record to the other publication's title record.
  • Author field: Only the author or editor is credited in this field. Translators are credited in the Note field. Introducers are credited by creating a content record for the introduction. Also, you must add a space between initials in the author field. "S.C. Hayden" should be entered as "S. C. Hayden", just as "H.G. Wells" is incorrect.
  • Date field: If there is a stated date of publication in the book, giving the month, or your data is from Amazon which gives the day of publication, it should be entered in the format YYYY-MM-DD. All of your entries were dated as just 2013.
  • Pub format / binding field: You should use those formats which are listed here. A trade paperback should be entered as "tp", mass market paperback as "pb", etc.
  • ISBN field: You should only give the ISBN which is stated in the book. A book published in 2003 wouldn't have an ISBN-13. If you're using a secondary source and don't know which one to use, choose the ISBN-10 for pre-2007 books and the ISBN-13 for 2007 and later books.
  • Price field: You have to add the currency symbol. For US dollars enter "$" before the number. Other currencies are explained here. Also, be sure to enter the retail price, not the Amazon selling price. (As in the case of Embark to Darkness.)
  • Artist1 field: Only give the name of the person credited with the cover art. Do not add "(cover)" to their name. The system automatically creates a record showing it is for the cover. Do not credit an artist who contributes interior art to the book. That should be done in the content section and typed as INTERIORART.
  • Image URL field: Your links are to the "Look Inside" image. The Amazon URL must be "manipulated" to get a clean image. You should remove all characters between the two periods of the URL, leaving one of them. An detailed explanation of how to do this is here under "Amazon".
  • Image URL field: Do not link an ISFDB record to a cover image file on a website for which we don't have permission to link. (As in the case for the Masters of Horror anthology, Sweet Dreams, and Tattered.) There's a list of permitting sites in the previous bullet point.
  • Pub type field: If a publication is a single work of less-than-novel length fiction, it is entered as a CHAPTERBOOK. You must also add a content record for the contained work as well (which is the same title and author credit as the publication 99.99% of the time). Do not use this type for a publication which contains more than one work of fiction. The Wicked Haze is a COLLECTION. Also, Flatty Cat is a CHAPTERBOOK, not a NOVEL.
  • Storylength field: Unless you're certain of a story's word count, leave this field blank. See the list of word counts under "length" in this section. For example, in Read Us or Die, the story "Spider" is more than 30 pages long, which is probably closer to a novelette than a short story.
  • When creating a record for a new publication of an existing title, do not use the ADD NEW work function. Go to the title and click the "Add Publication to This Title" link. (As in the case of a new edition of Halloween IV, The Invisible Man.)
  • In the publications which you wrote introductions or forewords I removed you from the author field and created content records. (In one case, I changed the spelling from "Foreward" to "Foreword". If the incorrect spelling is used in the book, please change it back.) Also, the introduction Embark the Madness was entered as SHORTFICTION, which I corrected to ESSAY. You also have to disambiguate such generic titles by adding the title of the work being introduced parenthetically, as in "Introduction (Embark to Madness".

Please take the time to go over the field-by-field instructions on the page I've linked to above. Give me time once I've accepted these submissions to clean them up. It may take me a while. Mhhutchins 19:59, 29 October 2013 (UTC)

Here are links to the publication records which were added to the database.

Please look them over and use them as a guide for entering future publications. The records can be updated to correct any errors you may find. If you have copies of these books, please consider doing a Primary Verification of the database records. (See the link in the Welcome section about this.) Thanks for contributing. Mhhutchins 21:29, 29 October 2013 (UTC)

Fixing Amazon's URL

As I mentioned above, you have to "fix" Amazon's URL in order to get a clean and larger cover image file. For example, in this record, you gave the URL as,204,203,200_.jpg and it looks like this

But if you would remove all of the characters between the two dots like this: and it looks like this.

Clicking on the two links will make the difference clear. If you're reading these posts, please let me know by responding. Click on the "[edit]" link to the right of the message you want to respond to. This opens the dialogue box, and you can type your response and save the page. Add a colon at the beginning to indent it from the previous message, adding a colon for each successive response. Then end the message by typing in four tildes (~~~~). This will automatically sign and date the message. Thanks. Mhhutchins 03:25, 30 October 2013 (UTC)

Look at the difference between the images for this record: the one you provided and the "fixed" URL. You should go back and fix the URLs of your latest set of submissions. Mhhutchins 03:28, 30 October 2013 (UTC)

I just saw your message about the URL and I understand now to eliminate the info between the periods. Thanks! Downwarden 03:34, 30 October 2013 (UTC)
I just realized I made an error with some of those image URLs and linked them to thumbnails, because I noticed the images are now blurry on their pages. I know now which URLs to use. Downwarden 03:40, 30 October 2013 (UTC)

Primary verifiying at the time of the submission

If you're working from a book-in-hand when adding a new record, just check the first box under "Source of the data". This will automatically do a primary verification of the record. You then only have to add a source note if there is data from a secondary source which is not stated in the primary source (the book itself.) Thanks. Mhhutchins 03:25, 30 October 2013 (UTC)

Image linking to

Thanks for the linking permission. I've added to the list. --MartyD 00:37, 31 October 2013 (UTC)

Cover artist and cover design

The help isn't explicit about this, but the "Artist" field is used for whoever did the cover illustration or photograph. We don't have a field for cover design credits: these should be recorded in the notes, not as an additional artist. If there's no explicit artwork credit and no signature is visible, and there is a cover design credit, it's ok to put the designer as the artist, adding a note that the credit says cover design and there's no other cover credit. I'm just a messenger -- the practice predates my time here....

So with that as background, some questions for you:

  • Human Nature says Cover and art design by Nicholas Grabowsky from art contributed by ... Ewald and ... Ruwwe. And you gave Ruwwe as cover artist (plus yourself), with no mention of Ewald. Does this mean Ruwwe did the cover and Ewald did some interiorart (which we can credit with a content record, BTW)? And did you have a hand in the cover/interior illustrations or just the design aspects?
  • Whispers in the Cries says Cover design by Nicholas Grabowsky with artwork by Matthew Ewald. and again the dual credit. Is it safe to assume the cover illustration is Ewald's, and this should not be a dual credit?
  • The Beasts and the Walking Dead says, more clearly, Cover illustration by Jayson Boehm and cover design by Nicholas Grabowsky. So I removed the Grabowsky credit and added a note stating the cover design credit. If that's wrong, I'm happy to put it back.

Let me know what you think. I see there are many more submissions (Thank you!). I'll put any with dual artist credits on hold until you get a chance to respond to this. If there's a general rule and a few exceptions and you identify the exceptions for me, that would be ideal. Thanks! --MartyD 01:29, 31 October 2013 (UTC)

I know how that can sound confusing. I wrote the actual credits on the copyright pages myself. In all cases, the author provided me with cover artwork by a separate cover artist that I had to alter and rearrange and design the fonts and turn them into marketable covers from that art. Ultimately with those instances, when I started contributing to ISFDB, I thought twice and added my name as well because of that. Ultimately your judgement is okay with me! —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Downwarden (talkcontribs) .
It's not my judgement, but rather yours, as you know better than I the details. I'm just trying help explain what the ISFDB intends to have captured. We consider the illustration/painting to be the "cover art", and we essentially ignore the artistry in any of the adornment around that illustration/painting and in any of the text presentation: title, author credit, and so on. So if someone gave you a painting and you did up the whole cover around it, the credit would be given to the someone as "artist" and your participation would be recorded in the notes as cover designer. On the other hand, if someone gave you a sketch and you fleshed it out into a full-blown painting, and the cover was then done up around that, the credit would be given to the someone and to you, jointly, as the cover artists. If you were responsible for the doing-up of the cover, it would still be appropriate to add a note that you were also the cover designer. So if in all of the cases you retained the original illustration/painting, and your design and alterations were limited to the framing, fonts, and so on, we would not credit you as artist. Is that how it went? Thanks. --MartyD 11:43, 31 October 2013 (UTC)

Clean Freak cover

While reviewing the Clean Freak submission, I noticed your cover is different from Amazon's cover. I also found this full cover on your site, which looks like Amazon's. Aside: For wrap-around art, it's definitely ok to provide a full cover, instead of just the front, if you have it. --MartyD 01:42, 31 October 2013 (UTC)


Sorry about all of the notes! So many nuances.... Synopses for titles should not be promotional. Sometimes the publisher blurbs need a little summarizing or pruning. I am less of a stickler about them than are some other moderators, but for Never Ceese, I removed the portion bolded below:

Please check my ebay listings out (seller name sdent1) as I, Sue Dent, will almost always have a signed copy up for auction with a buy it now price LESS than Amazon. My books are ALL POD (print on demand) and are non-returnable so Amazon can NOT get my books for less than I or my publisher can sell them. Just trying to save my readers some money. ;) What happens when a determined werewolf and a skeptical vampire join forces at the request of an aging friend? Will they succeed in finding a way to rid themselves of their respective curses in spite of their natural hatred for each other or will they suffer at the hands of a radical and evil stem cell researcher who wants the fame and immortality he believes their blood will give him?

By the way, Michael mentioned it above: It saves work if you look for a title first and, if it exists, use the "Add Publication to This Title" function, instead of using one of the "Add New xxx" functions. The latter always create new titles, and any resulting duplicates then have to be found and merged. "Merge" also only allows choosing one field value or another and gives no assistance for combining texts from two records (e.g., if each had a synopsis or notes). Thanks. --MartyD 02:11, 31 October 2013 (UTC)

Thank you, I've begun to realize that. Thank you for all your help....I keep learning as I go and thank you for your patience. That Sue Dent thing I should have known was a copy & paste error without paying attention. I'm also better understanding the "merge" thing..... —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Downwarden (talkcontribs) .
No problem. We're here to help, and there's always a learning curve for new contributors -- we've all gone through it ourselves. It gets easier quickly, rest assured. Thanks for the contributions. p.s. You should "sign" your comments: you can do that by pressing the "signature" button (2nd from right at the top of the editing window) or adding four tildes: ~~~~ as the end of the text (the system will substitute your name and a timestamp when it sees that in text it is saving). --MartyD 11:47, 31 October 2013 (UTC)

CHAPTERBOOK vs chapbook

The ISFDB definition of CHAPTERBOOK differs greatly from the publishing world's definition of a chapbook (a small publication: i.e. a booklet or pamphlet). As I mentioned above, this type is reserved for the stand-alone publication of a single work of fiction which is less than 40000 words. Dislocated Thoughts is a collection of poems (according to your submission) so it is typed as COLLECTION. I'll correct the entry and ask that you add the contents when you get a chance. Thanks. Mhhutchins 02:38, 31 October 2013 (UTC)

Additional "anthology" contents

I have several submissions on hold where you've added an "anthology" content record, credited to yourself. Would you explain what you intend with those? If we have an anthology (assemblies of works by different authors), we prefer to credit it to the editor, if known, leaving the actual author credits to the content entries (i.e., NOT crediting the contributing authors to the anthology itself). If the editor is uncredited, and we don't know who it is, we'll generally credit the contributing authors unless there's too many of them. For collections (assemblies of works by the same author(s)), we credit the author and not the editor, relegating any identification of the editor to the notes. Thanks. --MartyD 11:51, 31 October 2013 (UTC)

I cancelled those as a result. I'm glad I didn't credit every author in those anthologies the same way (I was going to but that would have taken too much time), but I understand how that works now. I was looking for an anthology credit and I arrived at doing that by comparing other anthology credits. I'm hoping all the other edits are good but I see you have other non-anthologies on hold..... --Downwarden 16:40, 31 October 2013 (UTC)--Downwarden 16:40, 31 October 2013 (UTC)
Ah, sorry, ran out of time. I left them on hold for myself so I could leave more notes....  :-)
  • Some are still the artist credits I commented on further above. If you don't have any other feedback, I will probably go by what I see in the Look Insides and relegate most of the Nicholas Grabowsky credits to the notes (where it says Cover Design).
  • Some of the others have to do with author and pseudonym credits: For "Nicholas Grabowsky writing as XYZ", what we do is credit the pseudonym only, then make a variant title that uses the canonical author name. The entries will then show up as "ABC by Nicholas Grabowsky [as by XYZ]". I will fix these up.
  • One has an "Introduction". What we do for these generic sort of titles (where the same thing is going to be used in many publications but will be for different pieces) is disambiguate them by adding the main publication's title in parentheses. So, for example, we'd use "Introduction (Fear)" or "Introduction (Fear: An Anthology of Horror and Suspense)" -- I wouldn't include the subtitle, someone else might. I will fix this.
  • Where you gave this multi-cover image for The Butcher Bride, I found this single-cover image on Amazon and switched the record to use that. If you'd rather we stuck with the one you originally provided, let me know and I'll put it back.
  • I'm wondering if The Gentle Art of Making Enemies qualifies as "speculative fiction" under the ISFDB Rules of Acquisition. Take a look at that list and let me know what you think.
I think that's it. I should get most of them processed in a little while. Sorry about the delay. --MartyD 01:42, 1 November 2013 (UTC)
Because I haven't heard from you, I'm afraid I am going to reject The Gentle Art of Making Enemies as non-spec-fic. If you believe I am mistaken, please respond here and resubmit it. Thanks. --MartyD 20:42, 30 November 2013 (UTC)

Editorship on Fear

I took your Fear submission that added an additional Nicholas Grabowsky credit, and combined them, so it now has four editors credited. See this. Is that what you intended? Are you the editor? Are the other three? Something else? Thanks. --MartyD 01:56, 1 November 2013 (UTC)

Bon Sai

Your submission adding this record was accepted, but a few changes were made. Please keep these in mind when making future submissions:

  • Amazon's product identifier (ASIN) is neither a catalog number nor an ISBN, so it should not be entered into the record's ISBN/Catalog # field. You have the option of adding it to the Note field. I've done that for you.
  • You give the source as "Amazon Kindle". If you have a copy of this ebook on your Kindle, checking the first bullet ("I own this publication") would do a Primary Verification of the record, and it's not necessary to give a source. If you don't have a copy, you should have given the source as just

Thanks. Mhhutchins 06:07, 3 November 2013 (UTC)

I've made the same change to Asylum. A question: are you certain of the page count for this record? Kindle-formatted ebooks don't have a pre-set number of pages. That is determined by the user. I believe the only format of ebook which has a set number of pages is a PDF. Mhhutchins 06:12, 3 November 2013 (UTC)

The ASIN was also moved in The Demon of Despair. And the same questions about the source and the page count field can be asked about this record. Thanks. Mhhutchins 06:13, 3 November 2013 (UTC)

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